I agree with you, and understand.

But I was focusing on the Christian's fear, which is pretty a proof that they need to convince people about the existence of God, because they want to convince themselves.

A Satanist brings everyday a new stone, and strengthen his "Ego Foundation". When he will die, he will leave on earth another reflect of what life really is, and people who loved him will remember this, and this is a key to immortality.

But Christians don't wish to live here, they think they have to suffer as "Sinners" all a life to maybe reach that promised land...But the doubt is on of course...And they'll never said that this is where their faith fails... So they are afraid to die, knowing that maybe, they should have taken adventage of this only life.

Let us not stray from the topic.

I will say that I have spent much time and energy securing a long future for myself.

Very true, nicely said.

Straight and to the point. I like it

Why does everyone assume there was a creation in the first place? Could it be just the human brain trying to make sense of an alien concept such as infinity?

If someone came to me with an xian agenda and used the argument, "Where has everything come from?"

My reply would be, "Which creation story were you referring to again?"

When having this conversation, did you ever even ask yourself what your goal was?

Have you yet?

Did you have a goal, or were you baited into it?

Was your goal to "be right"? Do you require such a thing? To be seen as "correct" in the eyes of your cousin, who doesn't even have the discrimination to realize that science and religion are different things?

What if you won? What would you have then? Was it your goal to win and cause your cousin to do something? To lose his faith? To feel stupid? To want to learn more about science or Satanism?

Don't forget, Satanists enjoy the finer things in life.

What do you enjoy?

#1. Where has everything come from?

So. Disasters are not fun for anyone. You can still live your life like a creator without acknowledging where we came from.


#2. If you want to have the indulgence of arguing with a xian just make sure that you can never change his mind by argument alone (atleast it is hard for me to imagine). Just be careful of not beating him ( ).

#3. Religion boils down to science without productive self-deceit. Tell him to go read a college text book about the bible. There is a book called Understanding The Bible by a guy name Stephen L. Harris. That helped me out a lot when I was in college. He might understand a lot more about your solid and life-loving perspective.

>>I've encountered a few questions that I can't seem to
>>answer in a Satanic sense, since I've never encountered
>>them or even had any interest in thinking about them.

I think it's good for Satanists to at least know how to stand for themselves in a debate. It's a good skill to sharpen now and then, and I enjoy a healthy study of logic and fallacies.

However, as others have pointed out, you do run the risk of getting your mental energy being sucked by these people, and giving attention to attention-starved masochists. Usually the best move is to not give your opinion when you're not asked, and not to be like a solipist projecting your understandings on somebody who doesn't have the same congnitive skills as you (sound like familiar "rules" and "sins"?).

>>#1. Where has everything come from?

If you want answers on biology, abiogenesis, evolution, or cosmology, then I say pick up a book on one of those subjects. Unfortunately, people are stupid and don't want to make the effort to read a book that goes beyond layman's terms, so they take comfort in the ignorant position of "a big invisible man did it". In any case, evidence overwhelmingly rules out the idea of people being made out of clay and ribs.

Or, along the lines of what Nemo said: ask who created this "creator". If he answers "Well he always was here", then why can't we assume the energy and physical laws of the universe were always here? Similarly, if he argues that humans are "too complicated" to have arisen by natural processes, then surely a deity would be far too complex to have existed naturally.

>>He said there's a difference between killing and murder.

I'd agree with him.

>>"Stop talking in religion, science is religion".

Neither of you obviously know how science works. Look at the steps of the scientific method. Now compare that to the concept of "revelation" and "dogma".

>>Now, I know that Scientology is religion,

That's as relevant as bringing up Marxism in a conversation about Groucho, Chico, and Harpo.

Suggested links:

- Common theism arguments
- Logic & Fallacies
- Archive/FAQ to talk.origins


"Debate is an art form. It is about the winning of arguments. It is not about the discovery of truth. There are certain rules and procedures to debate that really have nothing to do with establishing fact [...] Some of those rules are: never say anything positive about your own position because it can be attacked, but chip away at the weaknesses in your opponent's position."
- Stephen Jay Gould

It doesn't matter where the universe came from, because it's here, and you can do what you want with it now.

It doesn't matter? Are you aware of how many billions of dollars are spent to fund particle colliders around the globe (CERN, for example) which are trying to find the answer to that very question?

And, if particle physicists are able to find an answer to the question, do you realize what implications and possible opportunities could arise?

It may not matter to you specifically, but I wouldn't say that the question isn't worthy of exploration.

Mason, is that the science teacher in you talking again? Whatever it is, I have to agree with it because only with research in this area can we find out what makes our world tick. Curiosity about science has sparked every invention ever made from the combustion engine to a frickin pocket rocket. It does matter because knowing this information can lead to great discoveries. If we'd accepted anything as "just there," nothing would ever get done. I didn't accept "God" simply because my dad said it was there. I discovered my own path in life. I don't think we should accept the universe as "just there" either. We're supposed to study it because it's human nature to do so, and because it can benefit us. I'm sure there are some bad things that have come from being curious about the universe. For the most part, I think our tendency to thirst for knowledge has been a good thing though.

Magister Nemo,

Here we stand at the end of time and I ask, "What happens next?"

Well, you sit down and have dinner at the Restaurant at the End of the Universe, of course!