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#147179 - 02/22/06 01:30 PM What to do with a stalker! *DELETED*
Witch_Scarlet Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 01/09/06
Posts: 787
Loc: Texas
Post deleted by Scarlet

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#147180 - 02/22/06 01:41 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Linguascelesta Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 11/01/05
Posts: 2352
Loc: Europa
You are a CoS member, yes? When you get Downstairs, there is an entire forum devoted to personal privacy and security.

In the meantime, your friend seems to be taking every precaution. In terms of how far to go, whether to be pre-emptive in any way, that is a matter for the individual to decide, of course.

Should one "destroy him", as suggested in the 11th Satanic Rule of the Earth? How literally should one take this? As literal as one's own sense of self-preservation balanced against one's own desire to be a respectable (and thus respected) law-abiding citizen.

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#147181 - 02/22/06 01:48 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! *DELETED* [Re: Linguascelesta]
Witch_Scarlet Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 01/09/06
Posts: 787
Loc: Texas
Post deleted by Scarlet

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#147182 - 02/22/06 01:52 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Linguascelesta Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 11/01/05
Posts: 2352
Loc: Europa
I do not advocate any illegal action.

I will comment, however, on the existence of a saying: "It is better to be judged slowly by twelve men, than carried slowly by six".

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#147183 - 02/22/06 01:53 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
DarkWater Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/15/05
Posts: 784
Loc: SinCity
Quote:

When the stalker stays in the shadows and follows you where ever you go, even into cyber space and beyond. How would the Satanic Philosophy guide your hand in this matter?



If need be, I would fight.


Quote:

When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.



I avoid trouble if I am able, and in the vast majority of cases, I can. But if I cannot and no means of escape are possible, I will not wait to be a victim. Assume the role of a predator, and many times your prey will forever flee. If not, strike with calculated vengeance and with unfettered force.

Of course, this is my perspective given in broadest strokes. Fortunately, reality normally offers opportunities to reach a peaceful resolution, if only you look at the situation creatively enough.


DarkWater

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#147184 - 02/22/06 02:15 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Svengali Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 12460
Loc: Florida, U.S.A.
There are elements of this story that sound like melodramatic bullshit, but that aside:

A. Take all reasonable precautions, including getting legal and law enforcement council - follow all recommended protocols - AND DOCUMENT THAT YOU HAVE DONE SO.

B. Do whatever you have to do to defend yourself.

If it comes to a lethal force situation - have DOCUMENTATION of EVERYTHING the other person did, and EVERYTHING you did as a precaution leading up to the situation.

File police reports (and keep copies) for EVERY "incident" involving the stalker.

Even states with the most Draconian anti-gun and anti-self defense laws have room for justifiable use of lethal force if you are "in fear of your life."

Remember the statement "I was in FEAR for my LIFE."

It is a very useful statement.

There are other points not suitable for the public forum.
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#147185 - 02/22/06 02:16 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Assabrah Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 2062
Quote:

I am surrounded by two very large, strong, fearless men twenty-four hours a day. Yes, even on those rare occasions when I actually sleep, work, eat, go out in public or just sit at home reading a book. Where I go, they go.




All this for only one person harassing ?

If I was the stalker, I would take this as a challenge, this would encourage me more, and I would even feel someone important, seeing that I'm able to scare you more than anyone.

But it seems that too much informations have been spread, because apparently he knows how to catch you on internet then in the street ( just an example for the context), and here I'm a little bit puzzled.


Edited by Assabrah (02/22/06 02:26 PM)
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#147186 - 02/22/06 02:27 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! *DELETED* [Re: Svengali]
Witch_Scarlet Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 01/09/06
Posts: 787
Loc: Texas
Post deleted by Scarlet

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#147187 - 02/22/06 02:43 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Poetaster Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/20/06
Posts: 2336
Loc: East Coast, USA.
It seems as if the situation has escalated to one of self-defense.

If it's well known that the person is being stalked and said person is capable of defending themselves, I'd advise a public confrontation. Plus, the extra support from bodyguards is a bonus. Although, if this route is chosen, I'd also suggest getting a permit to carry a concealed weapon so that if necessary, you can have the extra 'bargaining' incentive.

If the stalker posed an imminent physical threat, chances are that they would have acted before now. Sometimes, a confrontation is all that's needed to deter a stalker. However, if the confrontation becomes dangerous, the right to defend your life is always present.

I'd never advocate a confrontation if I didn't think it was necessary, however, from what you've said, it doesn't appear that the stalker is going to cease and desist anytime soon.

However, all this must be considered with expectation and acceptance of the possible consequences, which could also mean a forfeiture of life if no action is taken at all.


Edited by AmbientLogic (02/22/06 03:01 PM)
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#147188 - 02/22/06 02:43 PM hah! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Assabrah Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 2062
Quote:

and the man is no stranger to her as he was once her lover




that was so sure, that's why I was puzzled when I read about the street, then internet.

My only advice : to be aware of the natural selection.
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#147189 - 02/22/06 04:13 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Poetaster]
Chess Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/09/02
Posts: 1473
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
Quote:

Sometimes, a confrontation is all that's needed to deter a stalker.




That might be quite effective, if only there was normal psychology at work inside this guy's head.

Remember, we're not dealing with a rational person here. There's no such thing as a person who has an eccentric hobby (sitting outside a certain lady's house 20 hours a day, every day) but is otherwise okay in the head. This person cannot be reasoned with and we cannot expect him to act reasonably.

Quote:

If the stalker posed an imminent physical threat, chances are that they would have acted before now.




A threat doesn't have to be imminent to be real. It's not uncommon for stalkers who've been (quite nonviolently) doing the "lawn gnome" thing for years to suddenly snap, and murder the object of their attentions.

Lady Scarlet, in terms of practical advice for your friend, I can only echo Magister Svengali's sentiments: be ready for anything, and document the Hell out of everything.

-Chess

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#147190 - 02/22/06 04:25 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Chess]
Poetaster Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/20/06
Posts: 2336
Loc: East Coast, USA.
Quote:

That might be quite effective, if only there was normal psychology at work inside this guy's head.

Remember, we're not dealing with a rational person here. There's no such thing as a person who has an eccentric hobby (sitting outside a certain lady's house 20 hours a day, every day) but is otherwise okay in the head. This person cannot be reasoned with and we cannot expect him to act reasonably.




Point taken and agreed with. Although, I still maintain that the chance is always there - albeit a small one.

Quote:

A threat doesn't have to be imminent to be real. It's not uncommon for stalkers who've been (quite nonviolently) doing the "lawn gnome" thing for years to suddenly snap, and murder the object of their attentions.




Again, I agree. Which is why I also suggested that no action at all could possibly result in the loss of a life.
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#147191 - 02/22/06 05:01 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12990
Loc: The Solid State
I recommend that ya'll check out a book called "The Gift of Fear" by Gavin de Becker. It has a whole series of chapters on how to handle a stalker--as well as how not to!
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#147192 - 02/22/06 07:55 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
tovasshi Offline


Registered: 02/16/05
Posts: 1415
Loc: Banana, Canada
The law can stop a stalker. It is harrassment. I had two stalkers so far, both ex boyfriends.

My first stalker just kept calling me and driving by my house whenever they could.

My recent stalker was more active, they followed me around cyber space wherever, posting defermating messages (stalkers don't have to admire you, they can be people who deeply hate you or are trying to ruin you for hurting them). They even went as far as to try get involved with the CoS heirarchy. This person has found out things about me and my friends and no one knows how. Really creepy, while doing this, he sent me love letters and romantic poetry. What I did was I called the local police and they set me up with a nice deal, they set it up through the univeristy though. What is being done is hes being made to sign a no contact agreement. Meaning if he so much as says 'hi' to me or talks about me to anyone, hes being academically punished. Depending on the breach of agreement it is either suspended for a term or expulsion. I could have had the police do something themselves, but that would have taken too long and I wanted this person to stop as soon as possible.

I kept all documents saved everything. Cell phone bills, emails, chat logs, msn conversations and witnessess to him harrassming me and stalking me.

As long as you have proof this person is being a problem, the law will do something. As soon as you say you feel threatened or that the person is interfering with your life, they will do something. Even if it isn't them doing it directly, they will set you up with something to deal with the problem.
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#147193 - 02/22/06 08:11 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Barb Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 04/09/05
Posts: 587
You should definitely document everything, as Magister Svengali had said. Keeping track of what goes on provides you with proof for when you need it. You need to be prepared, and you need to be able to cover your ass.

In addition, to get rid of (or at least HELP get rid of) a stalker, I would attempt to change the way the stalker feels about you; make yourself feel like you are him telling himself that he doesn’t care to stalk you anymore, and really concentrate on that (he can say “uhh…watching her all the time is so boooring. What kind of life is that? I should get my own life instead of wasting away worrying about some girl who obviously doesn‘t like me anymore.”, or something).

I have never had any serious problems with anyone stalking me, but I can recall a minor one late in high school. There was a guy who liked me a lot and he kept calling me, even though I told him I would not go out with him. After visualizing that he didn't exist in my life and never did, he DID go away after a while. I have never heard from him or seen him since then.
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#147194 - 02/22/06 08:15 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! *DELETED* [Re: tovasshi]
Witch_Scarlet Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 01/09/06
Posts: 787
Loc: Texas
Post deleted by Scarlet

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#147195 - 02/22/06 08:24 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
tovasshi Offline


Registered: 02/16/05
Posts: 1415
Loc: Banana, Canada
Well then she can do what I did with my first stalker. I played games with his head until he went on a downward spiral of drugs and alcohol and finnally vanished. No one has heard from him or of him in almost two years.
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#147196 - 02/22/06 08:40 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
IX Von ZehEhv Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 12/29/05
Posts: 708
This has been a serious and interesting topic. To add my two cents: It is important to analyse the motives of the stalker, to understand what they are gaining out of the stalking. Sometimes, if you can understand this, you can take this gain away.

For example, I was previously being harassed by a bikie who desperately wanted to be with my ex-partner. She didn't want him, so he blamed me. The threats were extreme but were delivered via SMS (it is unknown how he obtained my number). The police did not care and said that they are purely 'nuisance' messages. Meanwhile I was being told I would be meeting him soon. I realised that this sort of person can often thrive on their bully mentality. Ignoring his messages did not work, so I abused him back in ways I knew would hurt (details I knew through my ex). And the issue was pretty much over.

I understand this is not the same as the situation described, but it can show that some understanding of the stalker's goals can aid in extinguishing the situation.
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#147197 - 02/22/06 08:46 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! *DELETED* [Re: IX Von ZehEhv]
Witch_Scarlet Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 01/09/06
Posts: 787
Loc: Texas
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#147198 - 02/22/06 09:35 PM the "think by yourself" law. [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Assabrah Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 2062
Wait a minute.

You have said that she considers herself as a Satanist. So I think that it's up to her to take the right decision, instead of asking you to ask to other people to know what they think about this.... ...

The first time I've read this post, I had more in mind the word "Paranoia" than "Satanism".

Now, she has to remember something : she asked you to ask ( ) without wondering if people were ok to listen all about her private life.

2° > she doesn't even take the responsability to ask herself.

3° > she must really think that Satanism is a kind of community with a common thought.

4°> why continuing having a discussion about someone who is not even registred on the LTTD ?


Edited by Assabrah (02/22/06 09:47 PM)
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#147199 - 02/23/06 12:10 AM Re: the "think by yourself" law. [Re: Assabrah]
Chess Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/09/02
Posts: 1473
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
Quote:

You have said that she considers herself as a Satanist. So I think that it's up to her to take the right decision, instead of asking you to ask to other people to know what they think about this....




I think you're reading a little too much into this. Satanists are not prohibited from seeking out others' ideas and opinions. There's a lot of difference between "I have to think exactly what the world wants me to think -- so what should I think?" and "My life may be in danger, and I know you once faced a similar situation -- got any advice?"

Granted, Scarlet has said that she considers her stalker-magnet friend to be no Satanist, and of course we have no reason to doubt that judgement. But I don't see how asking a stronger friend for ideas would be a disqualification all by itself.

-Chess

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#147200 - 02/23/06 07:14 AM Re: the "think by yourself" law. [Re: Chess]
Assabrah Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 01/17/05
Posts: 2062
Let me show you my point by this example :

Imagine you have a problem, want to find a solution, but don't find better to ask to a friend to ask to people on the web...

I cannot say more.

Quote:

Satanists are not prohibited from seeking out others' ideas and opinions.




Did I say they should avoid this? The example I have given is explaining something else.

Quote:

But I don't see how asking a stronger friend for ideas would be a disqualification all by itself.




I don't see too.I am not speaking like a dumbass "mysanthrope online" here, and have never said that to speak to a friend was a bad idea.

think twice before moving a pawn, sir chess.


Edited by Assabrah (02/23/06 07:45 AM)
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#147201 - 02/23/06 11:07 AM Re: the "think by yourself" law. [Re: Assabrah]
Chess Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/09/02
Posts: 1473
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
Quote:

I don't see too.I am not speaking like a dumbass "mysanthrope online" here, and have never said that to speak to a friend was a bad idea.

think twice before moving a pawn, sir chess.




I intended no offense. We clearly each have our own take on the events, but it isn't required that we agree. This is a discussion forum after all, and I enjoy discussing these little issues.

Trust me, just because I raise a dissenting voice doesn't mean that I'm attacking you.

-Chess

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#147202 - 02/23/06 03:26 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: tovasshi]
VKat Offline


Registered: 03/23/05
Posts: 157
Loc: Northern California
I think all women have stalkers or they are doing something wrong.

Personally, I will only let someone back me so far in a corner before I turn around and throw it back at them. Also unless completely insane, he’s likely getting laid some where. Get him where it hurts.

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#147203 - 02/23/06 03:30 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Quercuss Offline


Registered: 08/14/05
Posts: 47
Loc: Vermont, USA
At this point in the game its probably not much help, but I found this.

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#147204 - 02/23/06 04:36 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Poetaster]
Noxilenticus Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/21/06
Posts: 274
Loc: Hell
I agree. One thing that keeps him stalking is the thrill of getting his jolleys off at the cost your fear. A confrontation is best. Counter-stalk him. Once he figures out that you're not the type of defensless person you are made out to be, he will lose interest and go on to the more easy targets to pick on. It seems like he is just having some issues with the break-up they had. I've seen this plenty of times before, it's called poor, sex-deprived male syndrome. It is one of the big reasons I'm in favor of legalizing and encouraging Brothels. If he could just go out and get laid, he probably wouldn't even care about her. For now though, she is all he sees in his sad, pathetic little life.
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- Noxilenticus Zodameranu

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#147205 - 02/23/06 04:41 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! *DELETED* [Re: Noxilenticus]
Witch_Scarlet Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 01/09/06
Posts: 787
Loc: Texas
Post deleted by Scarlet

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#147206 - 02/23/06 10:59 PM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
Noxilenticus Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/21/06
Posts: 274
Loc: Hell
Oh what a pitty, reminds me of that childhood story of the little boy who cried wolf. My advice then is that she just make a formal apology for her stupidity and hope the wolf is well fed. This also reminds me of a quote from starcraft :

Quote:

You called down the thunder, now reap the whirlwind!




Basically I have no more advice for those that wish to piss people off and cry when people decide do something about it. Sorry for your friend.
_________________________
"Satanists are epicurean, skeptical atheists who see Satan as a symbol of pride, individualism, and the quality of questioning all dogmas. The word in Hebrew means 'adversary' and so we are each 'Satans' to the doctrines that would have people use faith instead of reason to understand the universe in which we live. Our goal is to enjoy this, the only life we have and not waste it in anticipation of a mythical afterlife or an imagined apocalypse." - News 31 May, XLI A.S. in Reguards to The Satanic High Mass that happened on 6/6/6

- Noxilenticus Zodameranu

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#147207 - 02/24/06 11:09 AM Re: What to do with a stalker! [Re: Witch_Scarlet]
crackergirl Offline


Registered: 11/15/05
Posts: 323
Loc: Kansas
What to do with a stalker? Here's the deal. Stalkers strike people who are generally passive (or seem that way), so in order to avoid being stalked, just be the biggest asshole you can possibly be. Be a total bitch to this stalker, and it will scare him enough to run the other way.
A lot of people that get fan letters end up sending back a form letter from an attorney that keeps a distance between the person recieving the letter and the person who's sent it. Issuing a form letter that states that "My client has recieved your letter, but she is very busy and will try to answer it when she can." Good idea.
NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER act like you would ever be friends with ANYONE that sends you fan mail or that "secret admirer" crap. And, everyone else, if you're thinking of sending a letter signed "your secret admirer" DON'T. It's annoying, creepy, and it makes your perspective mate think you're too much of a coward to show your face.
The reason that most stalkers end up killing their victims is because at first, the person was nice to them. They sent a gift. Maybe their obsession sent one back out of kindness or just plain pity. Then the stalker (who's obviously mentally ill) starts to believe there's a relationship formed there. He sends more gifts. The obsession sends more letters back (again, out of pity). Pretty soon, the stalker shows up at the door. Finally, face to face, he believes the two can begin a physical relationship. When he's rejected, he's confused. All this time, he believed his obsession felt the same way. Now the object of his affection is rejecting him. She's brutally turned on the poor thing, and all he can think of now is, "If I can't have her, no one will." Then the obsession takes a bullet to the head.
So, what do you do? Keep your distance from adoring fans. This ties into Satanism because it deals with the discernment instinct. You've got to know who you're dealing with. You've got to know that you're sharing the right info with the right people. You've got to be brutally honest to people or they'll take you for all you've got. You've got to completely DESTROY anyone who will get in the way of your happiness. Don't be nice to them because you feel sorry for them. You will find that these needy types need way more than you can give them. We're against having any concern for psychic vampires, and stalkers are definitely the like.

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