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#18272 - 01/02/04 01:10 PM Re: Merry Xmas. [Re: Redhead]
Sammael Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 09/16/03
Posts: 614
Loc: Detroit, MI
Quote:

Sound to me like somebody (hint: you) fails to recognize a joke. Sammael, on the other hand, didn't and had replied in the same funny tone.



I almost replied to his statement (re: approval from others) saying, "I think he was joking, dude." I got it.....
I understand the rest of what he's saying, although I don't agree with it. Opinions are like assholes - everybody's got one. To each his own.....
_________________________
www.churchofsatan.com
I am a Vampire.

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#18273 - 01/09/04 04:54 PM Re: Merry Xmas. [Re: reprobate]
Redhead Offline


Registered: 08/18/03
Posts: 203
Loc: Europe
Quote:

Croatian is a beautiful language. I really wish I had the opportunity to learn it.






I am pleasantly suprised by the fact you're familiar with it (and agree with you). If you happen to drop by my part of the globe, drop me a line lesson-wise .


Quote:

You talk as if you have some intellectual background. Is this accurate?




Yes. You give out the same impression. True?


Quote:

Are you a law-follower or a law-maker?





However strong I felt the urge to say "Law maker, of course!", I believe it would not be the most accurate description of the actual state I am in.

So let's see: in the world outside my window I am a law-follower. However ridiculous I might find a particular law, the state has a pretty good way of making sure that the option of breaking it have some really undesireable effects. But even in the privacy of my own home I am not as free as I'd like to be (neighbours) - until I move to a house on the hill, that is.

Now my next resort of possible law making is my mind - and again there I find the laws of proper thinking I need to apply if I want to communicate to others, and the laws of the psyche that, if one doesn't pay them a proper care/attention, can literally sabotage them.

Only in dreams can man be truly free said Shakespeare, but there again we stumble upon things we do not encounter because we chose to - but because the law of our nature gives that part of our lives to our subconsciousness.

Francis Bacon wrote that nature, in order to be commanded, has to be obeyed - and I believe this to be accurate for other realities too. Meaning, if we use language and its terms as signs to communicate, we need to use them in same way as they are generally used. So Satanist saying "I celebrate Christmass because I am a Satanist" reminds me of a member of original 1970s punk in Great Britain who suddenly added swastika to their pins and needles outfit, though politically supporting the exact opposite political option - both are meaningless in their expressions.


Quote:

Whom does a sign influence without being recognized?







Each of us, as we are all involved in collective conciousness.

Quote:

On the one hand, perhaps you are afraid that he would come off as Christian to other people, who see him haivng a good time at Christmas. Is the participant beholden to a meaning defined by other people's expectations, rather than his own?







No. I was even invited to a special audience to archbishop's for my "altruistic" work and I am sure I was considered a good Christian by all involved - but that's another story altogether.


Quote:

Do you think the semiotic influence is subconscious, especially pernicious since the practitioner is so oblivious to it? LaVey suggested that this was how curses work, so why not holidays?






Yes! But that's a wide area and would take us totally off topic.


Quote:

(But then, couldn't it be suggested that Christmas is part of what makes Christianity less Christian? The Jehovah's Witnesses refuse to celebrate it for exactly this reason!)






I don't think so. The main characteristic of Christianity as I see it is the sheepishness, the choice of following, of obeying another's suggestions. That's why in my response to ochsenshaedel I said there is not much difference whether Christmas lost its original meaning or not: the billion dollar machinery is no better master of puppets then good old JHVH.

The most commonly used argument "pro X" is (apart the one I just mentioned above) " my family always celebrated Christmas ". I believe that in my initial post in this thread I made a disctinction between younger Satanists who live (and depend upon) their parents, and adult Satanists. Now while one still lives with their primary family, that argument is ok. However, I don't understand the weight the term "family" has to self-determinded adults, who by that time probably have a partner and a circle of friends, both cathegories of whom they have personally chosen. I find it important that in this period of life one starts making their own traditions, special days and so. Unlike the average person who will (particulary on Christmas and Easter) happily regress into childhood life, while life was still something big and promising, and forget all about the dull reality it became as if they had nothing to do with it, I will celebrate occasions for I have chosen to - no other reason is good enough.

So those days when everybody is more or less voluntarily caught up in the proper mood, I choose to spend it different.


Whosoever is delighted in solitude is either a wild beast or a god - and being both I enjoy these moments I can truly separate from the current of the mindless world -without even walking away.

_________________________
Hail Satan! If there were a verb meaning "to believe falsely," it would not have any significant first person, present indicative. - Ludwig Wittgenstein

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#18274 - 01/09/04 04:58 PM Re: Merry Xmas. [Re: Sammael]
Redhead Offline


Registered: 08/18/03
Posts: 203
Loc: Europe
Quote:

"I think he was joking, dude."





I am a she, my prescious.

Now, wanna change your mind on that bathtub thing ?
_________________________
Hail Satan! If there were a verb meaning "to believe falsely," it would not have any significant first person, present indicative. - Ludwig Wittgenstein

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