#188726 - 09/18/06 12:45 PM
Re: I'm waiting!!
[Re: Caesar]
|
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 617
|
Quote:
You've been here five years...and still haven't made your way downstairs?
Perhaps I do not as yet feel myself worthy. 
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#188728 - 09/20/06 05:16 PM
Re: not "worthy"
[Re: Nemo]
|
CoS Member
Registered: 12/10/04
Posts: 957
Loc: Flanders - Europe
|
I,on the other hand can't wait to join downstairs.
_________________________
He who turns the other cheek is a cowardly dog.
||.TSB Page 33.||
An investment in knowledge always pays the best interest.
|| Benjamin Franklin ||
The lack of money is the root of all evil.
|| George Bernard ||
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#188729 - 09/20/06 11:29 PM
Re: not "worthy"
[Re: Nemo]
|
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 617
|
My reasons for not joining the CoS are somewhat more complicated then that. Though I feel a great amount of gratitude to Dr. LaVey for the positive impact that his writings had on my life, and also view the Church of Satan’s representation of the Satanic philosophy as a positive thing, there are some view points of the present organization that I do not totally agree with or perhaps I simply do not understand. When I give my word to an agreement between myself and another entity such as a person or a group, I take it seriously and I follow through completely, if I am able to do so. Therefore I am very careful not to give my word if I may not be able to abide by it. This is not to say, that I have negative feelings towards the Cos, only that some of our view points differ and I do not feel that my membership would be beneficial at this time for either one of us.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#188731 - 09/21/06 06:46 AM
Re: not "worthy"
[Re: Asmedious]
|
CoS Magister
Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 12460
Loc: Florida, U.S.A.
|
Quote:
there are some view points of the present organization that I do not totally agree with or perhaps I simply do not understand.
For example?
Also, you specify "the present organization" - are you under the impression that something has changed? If so, what?
Just curious.
_________________________
Live and Let Die."If I have to choose between defending the wolf or the dog, I choose the wolf, especially when he is bleeding." -- Jaques Verges "I may have my faults, but being wrong ain't one of them." -- Jimmy Hoffa "As for wars, well, there's only been 268 years out of the last 3421 in which there were no wars. So war, too, is in the normal course of events." -- Will Durant. "Satanism is the worship of life, not a hypocritical, whitewashed vision of life, but life as it really is." -- Anton Szandor LaVey “A membership ticket in this party does not confer genius on the holder.” -- Benito Mussolini MY BOOK: ESSAYS IN SATANISM | MY BLOG: COSMODROMIUM | Deep Satanism Blog
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#188732 - 09/21/06 07:21 PM
Re: not "worthy"
[Re: Svengali]
|
Registered: 09/07/01
Posts: 617
|
Quote:
For example?
Also, you specify "the present organization" - are you under the impression that something has changed? If so, what?
Just curious.
Unfortunately, I am not articulate enough to provide an argument in regards to the things that I disagree with, as relating to the CoS.
They have been covered in previous posts by myself and others, and as with most things that are based on individual beliefs, not everyone shares the same views. I find this to be a positive thing, because if everyone agreed on everything, this would be a boring world. Though perhaps safer then the current status of it.
As for my use of the term “The current CoS administration, I am referring to the fact, that unfortunately Dr. LaVey is no longer with us, and it is his work and contribution that I value and respect, and know from his writings. To me personally, he is the Church of Satan. But even he stated in one of his books, that his views change often, and that what he writes one day, might not be how he feels the next. I am not sure which book this was in, since it has been several years ago that I have read it. Perhaps “Satan Speaks,” but again, I am not certain.
Hence, one of the things that I take issue with, is that many Satanists quote his work the same way that people of other belief systems quote their respective doctrines.
I believe that what may have been true when those ideas were put on paper, might not be so as time goes on, and that the only people qualified to say how they would feel about current events, is the people who wrote the original doctrines. So if I was a Catholic, I might have serious doubts about having the Pope be a spokes person for Jesus, or God. Yes, I would make a lousy Catholic. I hope.
For me, the “Big Picture” that Dr. LaVey has painted about his ideas is timeless, but the “nuts and bolts” eventually need adjustment, and each individual person has to make those adjustments for themselves. No organization can do that for a person, because everyone grows at different speeds, and in some extent, in different directions.
For me to join any group, and to pledge my self to follow and abide by all of their rules and ideas, would make me feel as if I was giving my independence and free thought over to someone else, and the older that I get, the more difficult such an alliance is.
This does not mean that I would not be willing to support a group of people or an organization, which shares my basic ideals. I just chose not to be officially affiliated with any, since there is no guarantee that our ideals will always be the same. One of the reasons that I do not pledge my allegiance to any person or group, is because as I stated before, my word of honor is one of the most important things to me, and once I give it, I would likely follow through with it, even if it may not turn out to be in my best interest. So if I give my word to someone, I will follow through come Hell or high water even at my own peril. Again, as with every rule, there are exceptions dictated by common sense. I realize that I might seem to come across as saying one thing, then shortly saying the opposite. Like I said, I am not as articulate in expressing my ideas as I wish that I was. But in my twisted little brain it all makes perfect sense.
For example, I am not a flag waving patriot, and if the United States was literally invaded by a foreign power, I would not run down to the local Armed Forces recruiting office and swear an oath to follow the orders of someone in charge. However, I would engage the enemy on my own terms, in my own way.
The same idea holds true for my feelings about the CoS, and Dr. LaVey. If I feel that someone is wrongly attacking either one, I will likely express my disagreement with them, but at the same time, I do not want to feel obligated to blindly defend their views because I am an official member.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
#188733 - 09/21/06 08:59 PM
Re: not "worthy"
[Re: Asmedious]
|
CoS Warlock
Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 4199
|
Quote:
Unfortunately, I am not articulate enough to provide an argument in regards to the things that I disagree with, as relating to the CoS.
They have been covered in previous posts by myself and others, and as with most things that are based on individual beliefs, not everyone shares the same views. I find this to be a positive thing, because if everyone agreed on everything, this would be a boring world. Though perhaps safer then the current status of it.
As for my use of the term “The current CoS administration, I am referring to the fact, that unfortunately Dr. LaVey is no longer with us, and it is his work and contribution that I value and respect, and know from his writings. To me personally, he is the Church of Satan. But even he stated in one of his books, that his views change often, and that what he writes one day, might not be how he feels the next. I am not sure which book this was in, since it has been several years ago that I have read it. Perhaps “Satan Speaks,” but again, I am not certain.
Hence, one of the things that I take issue with, is that many Satanists quote his work the same way that people of other belief systems quote their respective doctrines.
I believe that what may have been true when those ideas were put on paper, might not be so as time goes on, and that the only people qualified to say how they would feel about current events, is the people who wrote the original doctrines. So if I was a Catholic, I might have serious doubts about having the Pope be a spokes person for Jesus, or God. Yes, I would make a lousy Catholic. I hope.
For me, the “Big Picture” that Dr. LaVey has painted about his ideas is timeless, but the “nuts and bolts” eventually need adjustment, and each individual person has to make those adjustments for themselves. No organization can do that for a person, because everyone grows at different speeds, and in some extent, in different directions.
For me to join any group, and to pledge my self to follow and abide by all of their rules and ideas, would make me feel as if I was giving my independence and free thought over to someone else, and the older that I get, the more difficult such an alliance is.
This does not mean that I would not be willing to support a group of people or an organization, which shares my basic ideals. I just chose not to be officially affiliated with any, since there is no guarantee that our ideals will always be the same. One of the reasons that I do not pledge my allegiance to any person or group, is because as I stated before, my word of honor is one of the most important things to me, and once I give it, I would likely follow through with it, even if it may not turn out to be in my best interest. So if I give my word to someone, I will follow through come Hell or high water even at my own peril. Again, as with every rule, there are exceptions dictated by common sense. I realize that I might seem to come across as saying one thing, then shortly saying the opposite. Like I said, I am not as articulate in expressing my ideas as I wish that I was. But in my twisted little brain it all makes perfect sense.
For example, I am not a flag waving patriot, and if the United States was literally invaded by a foreign power, I would not run down to the local Armed Forces recruiting office and swear an oath to follow the orders of someone in charge. However, I would engage the enemy on my own terms, in my own way.
The same idea holds true for my feelings about the CoS, and Dr. LaVey. If I feel that someone is wrongly attacking either one, I will likely express my disagreement with them, but at the same time, I do not want to feel obligated to blindly defend their views because I am an official member.
All of the people who have come to this board, and have asked "What is the Left Hand Path?" should read the above.
Hail Satan!
_________________________
“Love is one of the most intense feelings felt by man; another is hate. Forcing yourself to feel indiscriminate love is very unnatural. If you try to love everyone you only lessen your feelings for those who deserve your love. Repressed hatred can lead to many physical and emotional aliments. By learning to release your hatred towards those who deserve it, you cleanse yourself of these malignant emotions and need not take your pent-up hatred out on your loved ones.”
Anton Szandor LaVey, The Satanic Bible
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
#188734 - 09/21/06 10:00 PM
Sure.
[Re: Asmedious]
|
CoS Magister
Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 11989
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
|
How interesting. You wish to define Satanism as what Anton LaVey meant (in your opinion) but not necessarily what he wrote (which was his opinion). So if anyone wishes to point out to you anything the Doktor wrote that disagrees with your opinion, you can deny it is relevant any longer. Nonsense. You are only fooling yourself if you actually believe this. Quote:
I just chose not to be officially affiliated with any, since there is no guarantee that our ideals will always be the same.
The answer to this incredible dilemma would be to resign.
No one chains you to an oar in the COS boat.
The exit door is plainly marked and those who want to leave are (ahem) encouraged to use it.
|
|
Top
|
|
|
|
|
|
Previous Topic
Index
