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#192901 - 10/09/06 08:33 PM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Tiberia]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Quote:

Quote:

If you are 16, with what amounts to a fourth grade education-what options do you have?




Simply for the sake of clarification and nothing more, the Amish education their children through the eighth grade. Albeit, not adequate for making a go of it alone in an alien society, but still a great deal better than fourth grade.




It's nice for you to point that out. My question would be this:

What level of education are they truly receiving? What curriculum are they receiving and 'who' is the teacher and what is the history/extent of his or her own education?

Are you referring to the 8th grade education of that of public schools or that of home schools or Xtian schools? I have noted that many Xtian schools are at a higher level of learning and are far more advanced than that of those children who attend our public school systems.

You are correct however, an 8th grade education isn't much. Better than that of a 4th grade education. Still I feel it's not enough to really help one prosper and thrive (or even survive) in our modern and very technological society.
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#192902 - 10/09/06 08:44 PM Re: Stupid, you don't know the meaning of the word!! [Re: princeofdarkness]
SilverHammer Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/01/02
Posts: 1758
Loc: Connecticut
(I SHOULD be doing something productive right now, but...)


"You stoopitt!"

"Naw, YOU stoopit!"

"No, YOU stoopit!"

"Well...

"Uh...uh...Ya know what?

"Uh...

"YOU STOOPIT!"




Edited by Dementagram (10/09/06 08:45 PM)
_________________________
Some boys grow up into men who can look at themselves in the mirror in the morning, and others just go along with the crowd, forgetting after a while that they ever had a choice. ---Roger Ebert

www.myspace.com/savagegod

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#192903 - 10/09/06 09:04 PM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Tiberia]
redheadgrl Offline


Registered: 09/24/06
Posts: 273
Thanks Tiberia.

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#192904 - 10/09/06 09:07 PM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Evil_Eve]
Tiberia Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 04/19/05
Posts: 894
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Quote:

What level of education are they truly receiving? What curriculum are they receiving and 'who' is the teacher and what is the history/extent of his or her own education?




That is a question that varies greatly from school to school, Amish or not. My question to you is why do you care? If they eventually come to the realization that they are "not like most", they will eventually break free of the constraints put upon them and pursue their goals. What, when, and how that transpires, is not my concern. If you want to know more about the Amish, check wikipedia.


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#192905 - 10/09/06 09:12 PM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: redheadgrl]
Tiberia Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 04/19/05
Posts: 894
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
You're welcome, redheadgrl. It wasn't of major importance, but I can be a stickler for details.

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#192906 - 10/09/06 09:14 PM Re: Mennonites [Re: TrojZyr]
Hagen von Tronje Offline

CoS Priest

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 10118
They were Mennonites, and we even got their CD. Good stuff.
_________________________
"The devil I'll bring you," answered Hagen. "I have enough to carry with my shield and breastplate; my helm is bright, the sword is in my hand, therefore I bring you naught."

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#192907 - 10/09/06 09:15 PM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Evil_Eve]
Lust Offline


Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 4214
Quote:

He even went so far as to paint on the side of a barn these words:

"Skate Or Die Sirs". I commend that!




He should have been arrested for vandalism.
_________________________
�Love is one of the most intense feelings felt by man; another is hate. Forcing yourself to feel indiscriminate love is very unnatural. If you try to love everyone you only lessen your feelings for those who deserve your love. Repressed hatred can lead to many physical and emotional aliments. By learning to release your hatred towards those who deserve it, you cleanse yourself of these malignant emotions and need not take your pent-up hatred out on your loved ones.�
Anton Szandor LaVey, The Satanic Bible

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#192908 - 10/09/06 09:19 PM Re: Mennonites [Re: Hagen von Tronje]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12982
Loc: The Solid State
Aha! I have that CD around somewhere, too.
_________________________
"Gentlemen, the verdict is guilty, on all ten counts of first-degree stupidity. The penalty phase will now begin."--Divine, "Pink Flamingos."

"The strong rule the weak, and the cunning rule over all." HS!

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#192909 - 10/09/06 10:27 PM Re: Praying for their deaths? [Re: Evil_Eve]
Sideshowtuper Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 09/14/05
Posts: 464
Loc: NY, USA
Quote:

Quote:

Meeting as many Amish as I have, I would never believe they would pray for somebody to die. They don't have an active intrest in the outside world. Their only concern for outsiders is if they can borrow equipment from you (and they often give you a few pies or loaves of bread for the favor) or sell you baked goods.

The topics they discuss are more along the lines of agriculture.




I too have met many Amish people in both PA, and in IN. Plain common folk who really don't bother anyone. I have no problem with this, I do have a problem with their philosophy on not only life but that of death and 'forgiveness'. I see the Amish people much as I see other herd mentality religious groups. No, the Amish don't talk to 'god' on two way radios but to me they are no different than those that do.

While I will agree with you on that matter that they mostly talk of agriculture etc.it really has no bearing on the original topic at hand which happens to be 'them not praying for death' but FORGIVING and attending the very bastards funeral that shot and killed young school girls execution style. It has not yet been determined if he sexually molested any of them at this point, but suffice to say I believe it went down as the media says:

He was planning it, and then the cops showed up. He got antsy and started firing then turning the gun on himself. COWARD that he was.

I don't believe in the Amish peoples 'god' but those kids did not deserve what happened to them and nor do they deserve their ignorant parents and fellow community members to attend the funeral of their killer. If someone kills me? I want my loved ones to be SCORTCHED EARTH mad about it. I don't want them attending my killers funeral as a show of love and forgiveness. LOVE is out the door here. Forgiveness has lost it's ferver at this point.

They may be good farmers, but they are mentally ill individuals.


HORRIBLE and I cannot excuse this yellow bellied behavior.

They do have pitch forks no? I'd stab his dead corpse and use his mouth for a urinal. At this point 'this supposed god that they worship' would be erased and removed.

In that worthless book of theirs is this quote:

"vengeance is mine saith the lord".

When I'm viewing my dead child in a coffin killed by a fruit cake? (and I have personally done this with my own child) VENGEANCE becomes a show of my own. It's all mine baby! I don't need a god at this point. I need a gun or a blunt object. I am very, VERY lucky not to be in prison myself, because I will agree with one thing in that fairy tale book of theirs.....

EYE FOR AN EYE, TOOTH for a TOOTH (and this is my own add, corpse for a corpse).

Give me that other cheek...




That is the difference between them and us. Satanists are a whole other breed. For us forgiveness isn't an obligation, so when we can forgive it's genuine.

Perhaps their forgiveness is real or they may have a lot of pent up rage inside, I don't know. Different people react differently based on "How they are wired".
_________________________
"All animals except man know that the principal business of life is to enjoy it."
- Samuel Butler


Sideshow Tuper on Undercroft

13 Moons Occult Supplies

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#192910 - 10/10/06 01:28 AM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Tiberia]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10561
Loc: England
>> they will eventually break free of the constraints put upon them and pursue their goals. <<

True. But just as a sidenote, imagine the the extent of psychological damage inflicted by the mind control they exercise over the children from birth.

This seemingly gentle and passive (sect, cult wahatever) is actually the most insidious and extreme of Christian fundamentalist groups in the world. The psychology employed makes it nigh on impossible for a child raised in it to break free of.

It is a cult.
_________________________
"Spiral Out: a bleak, page-turning, unforgettable read. Existentialism at its most hardcore" - www.uvray.moonfruit.com





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#192911 - 10/10/06 01:31 AM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Tiberia]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Quote:

Quote:

What level of education are they truly receiving? What curriculum are they receiving and 'who' is the teacher and what is the history/extent of his or her own education?




Amish or not. My question to you is why do you care?






This was not a retort, but merely a question. I question everything. It doesn't mean that the topic at hand is changing my life or views. I have always by nature been an individual who questions everything which I think is an admirable trait.

I have no inclination to 'study' the Amish as it is something that in the end (all though I will know more about them) will not do anything to change my views on this subject, nor will it glorify myself in any way.

Still, it is an interesting subject matter when you weigh in the factor of 'forgiveness'. I as a Satanist CAN and have forgiven people over various slights but the attending of this man's funeral really had me questioning not only their religion but their motives.

In the end, nothing has really changed but I do have a better understanding of how other Satanist feel on the subject and it's been quite interesting to follow and read the responses in this thread.

HS!
Eve
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


Top
#192912 - 10/10/06 05:32 AM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Evil_Eve]
DamnedLucky Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 08/03/06
Posts: 371
Loc: Massachusetts, USA
Quote:

Yes, where does a teenager run to when he/she has been raised in a very controlled enviornment? What skills aside from farming, quilting or pie baking will help them become productive citizens outside of their controlled community?




Open a pie shop. I mean that seriously. Or find someone with an apple orchard who needs farm helpers. I'm not condoning Amish childrearing practices, but I doubt these kids are any worse off than kids born with physical or mental handicaps.

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#192913 - 10/10/06 09:52 AM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Tiberia Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 04/19/05
Posts: 894
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
I definitely share your feelings in regard to the strict indoctrination of their children. With the exception of a few rare cases, not being exposed to anything else for the first 16 years of life must do extensive damage on the psyche, as it is no different than locking them in a cage.

Quote:

This seemingly gentle and passive (sect, cult wahatever) is actually the most insidious and extreme of Christian fundamentalist groups in the world.




Being that the term "cult" has so many different meanings today, I can see how it may apply here in a somewhat traditional sense. Although there is no tangible central charismatic figure, one could certainly say in this case that it is their god that plays that part.

The only tolerable thing I can see is that they don't try to inflict their personal beliefs/values into government policy as the evangelicals and catholics do. Well that, and I hear they make some really nice quilts.

What goes, "Clip....clop....clip....clop....clip....clop....bang-bang-bang-clip-clop-clip-clop-clip-clop"?

An Amish drive by shooting. .....

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#192914 - 10/10/06 10:53 AM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Evil_Eve]
Willow_NightEyes Offline


Registered: 09/27/06
Posts: 180
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Quote:

Are you referring to the 8th grade education of that of public schools or that of home schools or Xtian schools?




My mom homeschools my sister and has looked into many curriculums from many sources. She has told me that the Amish grade 8 (at least in canada here) is equivilant in reading, writting, & maths to a grade 11 or 12 public education with a change of focus towards more practical applications. (For instance a Sin-wave isn't going to do you any good to figure out your crop yeild or household budget) They can get more into even their shorter school years because there's less "extra" subjects such as music, shop, or home-ec as these things are being taught during everyday life by their parents.

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#192915 - 10/10/06 01:27 PM Re: It Is A Cult. [Re: Tiberia]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12982
Loc: The Solid State
I, too, dislike it when children are indoctrinated, or are socialized in ways that do them a disservice and make their world smaller than it has to be.

Though, I'm much, much angrier at fundamentalist Christians who live in our world, but teach their children backward, asinine lessons and ideas that essentially trap them in a liminal state, a "nowhere land." At least the Amish occupy a straightforward, enclosed, total environment world, and teach their children principles for actually getting along in that environment.
_________________________
"Gentlemen, the verdict is guilty, on all ten counts of first-degree stupidity. The penalty phase will now begin."--Divine, "Pink Flamingos."

"The strong rule the weak, and the cunning rule over all." HS!

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