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#200187 - 11/05/06 01:50 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Unknown]
Svengali Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 12460
Loc: Florida, U.S.A.
Anyone who dismisses Magistra Barton's books is shooting themselves in the foot. Aside from the fact that she was High Priestess for a time, her books are filled with direct quotations from Dr. LaVey in addition to her own insights and observations, not to mention the fact that they are publications authorized by Dr. LaVey.

It goes without saying that these statements extend to the writings of Magus Gilmore, including his books when they are finally published.

These are PRIMARY texts.
_________________________
Live and Let Die.
"If I have to choose between defending the wolf or the dog, I choose the wolf, especially when he is bleeding." -- Jaques Verges
"I may have my faults, but being wrong ain't one of them." -- Jimmy Hoffa
"As for wars, well, there's only been 268 years out of the last 3421 in which there were no wars. So war, too, is in the normal course of events." -- Will Durant.
"Satanism is the worship of life, not a hypocritical, whitewashed vision of life, but life as it really is." -- Anton Szandor LaVey
“A membership ticket in this party does not confer genius on the holder.” -- Benito Mussolini
MY BOOK: ESSAYS IN SATANISM | MY BLOG: COSMODROMIUM | Deep Satanism Blog

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#200188 - 11/05/06 02:18 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Unknown]
Prometheus Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/25/05
Posts: 1120
Loc: Germany
Quote:


Oops!

I was typing too fast and hit 5 instead of 7.




Could that be a Freudian one?

_________________________

HAIL SATAN!

Prometheus











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#200189 - 11/05/06 02:22 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Prometheus]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
No, it was a legit error on my part.

I also will note that I will take heed to this post and stop replying in it and start listening-APPLYING it rather.

Thank you for your question, I trust I have clarified.


Edited by Unknown (11/05/06 03:04 PM)
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#200190 - 11/05/06 02:38 PM A possible further step? [Re: Svengali]
RandomStranger Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 2770
Loc: Here.
Six years ago, there was an article piblished by a writer named Phillip G. Armour. He wrote about Levels of Ignorance as they relate to software development. A photocopy of the article was on everyone's desk one morning at work and we had to read it. After reading it, I filed the article and saved it because it has value in areas other than software development.

I'd like to think that knowing this information is an tool. Learning how to learn might be half the battle for some and it is easy to do, if the person's intention really is to learn.

Here is a quick list of the Five Orders of Ignorance:

0th Order Ignorance (0OI)—Lack of Ignorance.
You know, you have the answer.

1st Order Ignorance (1OI)—Lack of Knowledge.
You know what you don't know, you have the question.

2nd Order Ignorance (2OI)—Lack of Awareness.
You don't know what you don't know.

3rd Order Ignorance (3OI)—Lack of Process.
You have no means, or process, for resolving your lack of knowledge.

4th Order Ignorance (4OI)—Meta Ignorance.
Not aware of these 5 levels.

I found the list HERE and there is also a link to Armour's original article printed by in the Communications of the ACM.
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#200191 - 11/05/06 03:15 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Svengali]
Alia Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 10/31/06
Posts: 228
Loc: At Sorrow's End
OK! I get it!

Time is much too valuable to be wasted. I certainly don't want to be wasting anybody's time, least of all My own.

I owe it to you and I owe it to Myself to re-check and investigate as deeply as I can. On the extremely unlikely occasion that I turn out to be... something else than I am... I promise you you'll never hear from me again.

I'll read the last three books on the list and let you hear from me again. (Or not.) I've already read the first four a couple of times each, but I'll read them again. Anything for being as knowledgable as possible.

And I don't think you'll ban Me for taking your excellent advice and double-check. I think you meant what you said. Therefore I'll do it, going as deep and as far as I can, for the Hell of it!

Hail Satan!
Hail the Rational Mind!

-Alia
_________________________
~Alia~

Carpe Noctem

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#200192 - 11/05/06 03:27 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Svengali]
tovasshi Offline


Registered: 02/16/05
Posts: 1415
Loc: Banana, Canada
Just to share. I ran into someone who thought I was THE idiot and didn't get Satanism. They claimed they owned and read every book. They said they agreed with the philosophy but couldn't consider themselves a Satanist for the simple fact that they were an atheist.

Somewhere in all their readings, they came to conclusion that it really was about worshiping a real Satan because it was "hidden" in the words.
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Hi.

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#200193 - 11/05/06 03:32 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: tovasshi]
Svengali Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 12460
Loc: Florida, U.S.A.
Like Dorothy Parker said, "you can lead a whore to culture but you can't make her think."
_________________________
Live and Let Die.
"If I have to choose between defending the wolf or the dog, I choose the wolf, especially when he is bleeding." -- Jaques Verges
"I may have my faults, but being wrong ain't one of them." -- Jimmy Hoffa
"As for wars, well, there's only been 268 years out of the last 3421 in which there were no wars. So war, too, is in the normal course of events." -- Will Durant.
"Satanism is the worship of life, not a hypocritical, whitewashed vision of life, but life as it really is." -- Anton Szandor LaVey
“A membership ticket in this party does not confer genius on the holder.” -- Benito Mussolini
MY BOOK: ESSAYS IN SATANISM | MY BLOG: COSMODROMIUM | Deep Satanism Blog

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#200194 - 11/05/06 03:37 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Biff]
reprobate Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 7140
Loc: Canada
Quote:

If it takes all the seven books, then I truly am an idiot.




Stupid is as stupid does. Conversely, smart is as smart does.

Read the books.

Then, in retrospect, you can say: "I started off on the wrong foot, but then I caught my stride."

I take your point, and I expect Magister Svengali does too. The web sources, the essays and interviews, are important. They are often our means for first attracting people to Satanism, or for cutting through bullshit surrounding this or that issue.

But the bedrock is in the books. Read and understand.
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reprobate

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#200195 - 11/05/06 04:42 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Svengali]
Rory_Rocketpants Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/28/05
Posts: 1795
Loc: unknown
I would liek 2 proov I am nt an idiut. I hav red the santanic bible 66 times (becuz im so hardcore).



There will be idiots trying to prove themselves in any religion. The difference with Satanism is, WE do not tolerate idiots!

Once they learn this, I would imagine they will scarper off with their tails firmly in between their legs.

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#200196 - 11/05/06 04:46 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Svengali]
Callier Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/30/06
Posts: 2208
Quote:

Satanism is specific, discriminating, selective, and critical. It is NOT an “anything goes” philosophy.





This clearly points out those that see Satanism as "Yeah! Let's do what we want!"

If they were smart in the first place, they should already know the definition of the term consequence.

HS!
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#200197 - 11/05/06 05:26 PM Re: A possible further step? [Re: RandomStranger]
Virus9 Offline
CoS Priest

Registered: 08/06/01
Posts: 2108
Loc: Florida
I would add a sixth and more dangerous level; You know you have the answer, but your answer is wrong.
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"Recognize the phrase 'national interest' as a synonym for 'self-interest' and you will find no moral obstacle that cannot be removed from the highway of ambition."
-Lewis Lapham

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

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#200198 - 11/05/06 06:07 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Svengali]
tekku Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/24/06
Posts: 1261
Loc: Behind You
Excellent post Magister

Quote:

Of course the usual suspects will accuse me of being a grouch, or pedantic, or dogmatic, or unimaginative, ad nauseum.




Quite the opposite, you are very intelligent and wise.
Your words carry alot of weight.
I for one appreciate your brutal frankness

HS!
_________________________
That is not dead which can eternal lie,
And with strange aeons even death may die
~H.P. Lovecraft~

La bonne cuisine est la base du véritable bonheur ~Escoffier~

Church of Satan

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#200199 - 11/05/06 07:13 PM Re: A possible further step? [Re: Virus9]
RandomStranger Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 2770
Loc: Here.
Nice! Those people are REALLY dangerous. If not annoying.

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#200200 - 11/05/06 07:43 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Svengali]
The_Sixth_Circle Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 10/06/04
Posts: 432
Loc: Hell; where else?
Quote:

There are SEVEN books.




I often chuckle at the time the Magisters put into posts like this, remembering that they bother spending time with what everyone should know - especially, when said Magister must be loathe to do it. And while Magister Svengali lacks the poetry of Magister Nemo, perhaps, his point is no less potent. The above statement is a prime example of what is often misunderstood; there may well be a plethora of books that discuss Satanism, highlight Satanism, reference Satanism or, in extreme cases, infer Satanism. However, be under no illusions - until the release of Magus Gilmores' works, there are only seven books about Satanism as a codified religious practice.

Quote:

There may be core ideas that many find objectionable, such as elitism, stratification, materialism, responsibility, etc. In which case you have still done yourself a useful service in coming to the realization that YOU ARE NOT A SATANIST, and can stop wasting your own time and ours by trying to insist that you are.




I always liked the example of the bottle of milk who thought he (she?!) was a bottle of water, purely because he fitted some of the bill; he was wet, could be served hot or cold, quenched thirst, was good for you and went into a cup of tea.

Quote:

Of course the usual suspects will accuse me of being a grouch, or pedantic, or dogmatic, or unimaginative, ad nauseum.




Magister, you're being grouchy, pedantic, dogmatic and unimaginative.

Quote:

Anton LaVey went to the trouble of writing his books, maybe you should go to the trouble of actually reading them if you want to call yourself a Satanist.




The good Doctor wrote these books because he couldn't find any like them; that should be lesson enough for those with an iota of intelligence.
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Truth, in matters of religion, is simply the opinion that has survived. - Sir Oscar Wilde

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#200201 - 11/05/06 08:50 PM Re: HOW NOT TO BE AN IDIOT [Re: Svengali]
Mr. Obsidian Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 3120
Loc: Ohio
Quote:

Anyone who dismisses Magistra Barton's books is shooting themselves in the foot. Aside from the fact that she was High Priestess for a time, her books are filled with direct quotations from Dr. LaVey in addition to her own insights and observations, not to mention the fact that they are publications authorized by Dr. LaVey.




Certainly true.

Also, The Church of Satan reveals much about the structure, origins, evolution, and purpose of the CoS as an organization. Such detail and elaboration cannot be gleaned simply by reading the Church of Satan website, nor is it found in the other official Satanic source material.

If nothing else, one should buy the damn book just to read the letters other idiots have sent to the Church over the years.
Funny stuff.


HS!
_________________________
~ Mr. Obsidian (JP)

Olio/Etcetera

Flesh and Bones
_______________

“For those who believe in God, most of the big questions are answered. But for those of us who can't readily accept the God formula, the big answers don't remain stone-written. We adjust to new conditions and discoveries. We are pliable. Love need not be a command nor faith a dictum. I am my own god. We are here to unlearn the teachings of the church, state, and our educational system. We are here to drink beer. We are here to kill war. We are here to laugh at the odds and live our lives so well that Death will tremble to take us.”
~ Charles Bukowski


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