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#209003 - 12/17/06 04:14 PM Why Enochian?
DubhGhaill Offline


Registered: 12/13/06
Posts: 11
I just recently finished reading the Satanic Bible and loved it.

Having finished it however, I'm left with one main question. Why use Enochian as the language of Satanic ritual? I've surfed the net looking into the history of it, but frankly that just puzzled me more. Why use a language originally billed as "Angelic"?

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#209004 - 12/17/06 04:47 PM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
Wile_E_Quixote Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 03/14/02
Posts: 2493
Surely that's entirely appropriate choice of language for a religion that reveres the qualities of the most famous angel of them all?

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#209005 - 12/17/06 04:48 PM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
Danny Mc. Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/05/04
Posts: 2143
Loc: Taxationland
If you reread pages 155-156 closely you will answer your own question. H.S.
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"Follow Me!", John M. (Delta).

"I've learned that you shouldn't compare yourself to others - they are more screwed up than you think." Something Magistra Isabel posted. laugh

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#209006 - 12/17/06 04:57 PM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
Virus9 Offline
CoS Priest

Registered: 08/06/01
Posts: 2108
Loc: Florida
Read the keys themselves. Do you see anything particularly "Angellic" about them?
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#209007 - 12/17/06 07:08 PM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
DickSteele Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 07/06/04
Posts: 1411
Why not?

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#209008 - 12/17/06 10:13 PM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: Danny Mc.]
DubhGhaill Offline


Registered: 12/13/06
Posts: 11
I've re-read pages 155-156 a couple of times. What I'm really asking is why not Arameic or Babylonian or anything with a little more historical veracity?

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#209009 - 12/17/06 11:34 PM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
fatebender Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/28/04
Posts: 537
Loc: Sin City
When John Dee invented the Enochian language, he was using a mystical Aztec artifact, known as "the eye of Texcatlipoca," a channel for an evil god. When Dee decided to call it "angelic" he was just making himself look like a nicer person.

If you read through old grimoires, you will find that the magic words which invoke the powers guaranteed by their demonic pact are often "in the name of jesus christ" or some similar hogwash. If they used different magic words, they could have been burned alive or mobbed (or worse.)

Anton LaVey could afford to be honest.
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"When everyone is reading Neitzche, I'll be watching Don Ameche." ASL

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#209010 - 12/18/06 12:14 AM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
reprobate Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 7140
Loc: Canada
Quote:

I've re-read pages 155-156 a couple of times. What I'm really asking is why not Arameic or Babylonian or anything with a little more historical veracity?




Do you always insist your fantasies have "veracity"?
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reprobate

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#209011 - 12/18/06 12:40 AM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: reprobate]
DubhGhaill Offline


Registered: 12/13/06
Posts: 11
Quote:


Do you always insist your fantasies have "veracity"?




Not always, but I usually prefer them to have some basis in reality.

Maybe I need to do a little more research into John Dee?

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#209012 - 12/18/06 12:57 AM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
Mr_47 Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3082
Loc: Pure Imagination
Does it really matter?

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#209013 - 12/18/06 01:04 AM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: Mr_47]
DubhGhaill Offline


Registered: 12/13/06
Posts: 11
Quote:

Does it really matter?




That's kind of what I'm asking.

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#209014 - 12/18/06 01:09 AM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
Poetaster Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/20/06
Posts: 2334
Loc: East Coast, USA.
Quote:

but I usually prefer them to have some basis in reality.




Would hardly be a worthwile fantasy then, now would it?
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- Sam Harris





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#209015 - 12/18/06 02:08 AM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
Mr_47 Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3082
Loc: Pure Imagination
It seemed to me you were asking why the Good Doktor chose Enochian. I am asking why it is important to you that he did or didn't. It works, so be it.

Even if he had chose a different language it would have been for his own reasons. I don't see the importance in worrying over what language the keys are in.

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#209016 - 12/18/06 06:25 AM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: Wile_E_Quixote]
Evol Offline


Registered: 12/10/06
Posts: 34
Loc: Brisbane, Australia
Quote:

Surely that's entirely appropriate choice of language for a religion that reveres the qualities of the most famous angel of them all?




I find some pleasure in that response. I also found pleasure in the thought that languages (or at least some) used Satanicly may revolve in some way around Aramaic so as to despise the "teacher" but that is a little off topic and I agree with xDravenx:

Quote:

Even if he had chose a different language it would have been for his own reasons. I don't see the importance in worrying over what language the keys are in.




however the fantasy was for me fun
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"There are problems in today's world that cannot be solved by the level of thinking that created them" Albert Einstein "A man who dares to waste one hour of time has not discovered the value of life." Charles Darwin

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#209017 - 12/18/06 09:01 AM Re: Why Enochian? [Re: DubhGhaill]
reprobate Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 7140
Loc: Canada
Quote:

Not always, but I usually prefer them to have some basis in reality.




What, exactly, would be the "reality" of invoking Satan in Aramaic? What kind of "basis" are you looking for?

What kind of validity would be gained by using an historical language? Historical accuracy? Aramaic speakers didn't tend to do our kinds of rituals. So there's nothing to keep accurate to.

The line of thought you're suggesting leads to pretension.

We use languages that are aesthetically or intellectually conducive to the kind of atmosphere we want to cultivate in the ritual. On this criterion, Enochian, or Lovecraft's language of the Great Old Ones, or maybe Tolkien's Black Speech, are all on the same playing field as Aramaic or Latin.

(They also have one relative advantage: Aramaic was an everyday, ho-hum language. Whatever qualities it may have acquired that make it interesting for ritual use are pretty much haphazardly gained, and inconsistent. Invented languages are designed to be magical through and through.)

We're not looking to be "genuine"! We want EFFICACY.

Why not use a fake language? Or even make an entirely new language of one's own, using letters and combinations of your choice?

If you are hung up on history, that's cool; use it in your rituals. But that's your own hang-up. You might give the alternative a try. Or plain old English. Beware erecting gods above your own needs. Blaspheming history itself is fair game for a Satanist.
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