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#215702 - 01/15/07 06:28 PM Love is dead, long live lust!
Mythil Offline


Registered: 01/06/07
Posts: 110
Loc: UK, Portsmouth
As we progress away from the image of the nuclear family, and as more and more celebrity sex enters the media. More and more teenage and in same cases preteen girls become pregnant..
Have we come to the point where non of us love each other any more? Is love dead, and has is been taken over by animal lust?
Of course, before anyone points out my comment, I don't support sleeping with anyone that is under the age of consent. In fact, I don't even like sex, really.. I mean, there are one or two people I might actually enjoy sleeping with, but it's not THAT important to me anymore.

As time moves on, we all seem to know people that have been cheated on, or we have been cheated on ourselves. People that have been married and divorced a few times. Are we now at the point where "love" or "commitment" to each other doesn't exist any more? And is it the medias fault, or are the majority of us really that stupid when it comes to sex? Ohh, I'm perfectly fine with people sleeping with a few people at the same time if that is your wish, if you are in an open relationship or want to remain single while you have sex with different people, that's fine with me (as if you needed my consent anyway). My point is toward the people that say they want commitment, but sleep around anyway, or the people that sleep around without contraception and get pregnant, draining more and more money with all their spawn that they pop out from between their legs in a yearly bases. As an example, and this is no joke. There is a couple in the UK that have, it was either 12 or 16 children, I can't remember now, who get something like 64 thousand pounds of the government just for having these spawn, and both of them don't work, they do not put anything back into the country that are paying for their little bastards.

And really, who is sick enough to sleep with a 12 year old girl. There was an incident, again in the UK, where three sisters, ages 12, 14 and 16 that all got pregnant and their mother was PROUD of them!.

Why do WE pay for people to pop children out of their diseased womb?
To be honest, I think the government should give aid to ONE child of a couple. Every child after that, the parents must pay for themselves, 100%.. AND, you shouldn't be allow to have a child if you are on welfare OR couldn't give a shit about the poor bastard you have just brought into the world, which inevitably adds to the rising crime in the country because you have not taught your child that crime and so forth is wrong.

Sorry if this sounds like a rant, but I hope I get my point across.
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My Heaven is your hell - Lordi "He was the sort of person who stood on mountaintops during thunderstorms in wet copper armour shouting 'All the Gods are bastards.'" - Terry Pratchett

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#215703 - 01/15/07 07:16 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Maya Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 1447
Loc: New England
Quote:


Have we come to the point where non of us love each other any more? Is love dead, and has is been taken over by animal lust?




Where did you get the idea that love and lust are mutually exclusive?

I believe that this explosion of pregnancies in youngsters is due more to a lack of resposibility and discrimination, not lust.

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#215704 - 01/15/07 07:26 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Maya]
Phineas Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 08/16/06
Posts: 8262
Quote:



I believe that this explosion of pregnancies in youngsters is due more to a lack of resposibility and discrimination, not lust.




Don't forget stupidity. The phrase "Young and stupid" comes to mind.
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"I'm fascinated with how primitive the human mind still is. It can be misdirected so easily." John Gaughan


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#215705 - 01/15/07 07:31 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Hydra_M_Star Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 03/29/06
Posts: 416
Loc: Charlotte, NC
None of ths social issue you brought up are anything new. These sorts of thing have been going on every since we swung down from the trees. We are just more comfortable talking about them now more then we ever have been.

So, I really fail to see how any of it has killed love. I also don't see how any social change--regardless of how negative--could kill love. Love is as natural an emotion as hate and lust.

If someone tells me they don't love I look at them with the same scorn I do those that say they don't hate or lust.

And like Maya I would very much like to hear how you got the idea that love and lust can not co-exist.
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#215706 - 01/15/07 07:39 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Lust Offline


Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 4214
Stupid people will always do stupid things.
Let the water seek its own level.
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�Love is one of the most intense feelings felt by man; another is hate. Forcing yourself to feel indiscriminate love is very unnatural. If you try to love everyone you only lessen your feelings for those who deserve your love. Repressed hatred can lead to many physical and emotional aliments. By learning to release your hatred towards those who deserve it, you cleanse yourself of these malignant emotions and need not take your pent-up hatred out on your loved ones.�
Anton Szandor LaVey, The Satanic Bible

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#215707 - 01/15/07 09:57 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12990
Loc: The Solid State
As long as there are people worth loving and committing to, there will be love and commitment.

I concur with the others here that teenagers are mostly dumb, hormonal, and impulsive, as is the media. It has more to do with not being willing and able to plan ahead or delay gratification, than it has to do with just being horny.

I agree that it's sick when 12-year-olds get pregnant. That's wrong on numerous levels.
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#215708 - 01/15/07 10:05 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Magnus Offline


Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 71
Loc: South America
I thought you were going to write about love and lust, not birth-control policies
Anyway I dont think love is dead, neither do I think that people who cheat dont love.
People who marry but cant get their pants on are just being natural, and we all judge them only for society-imposed standards.
And what about these stupid-stupid people who get pregnant once every year? Well in the 90s a right-wing dictator ruled my country and started the sterilization of poor rural immigrants so that they would stop spreading like a fucking disease.
I salute that action and spit on the face of humanitarian organizations who dont know shit about having hordes of young criminals screwing your countrys progress, if there was ever any.
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There is no God but Me, and I am His only Prophet

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#215709 - 01/15/07 11:31 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Lust]
Bloodfire Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 07/14/01
Posts: 2523
Loc: Honolulu, HI
Quote:

Stupid people will always do stupid things.
Let the water seek its own level.




It's no coincidence that stupid people breed more offspring than the more intelligent and responsible. What little smarts the stupid may have once had has been spread so thin through indiscriminate and frequent breeding as to no longer exist in any visible form.

That's egalitarianism for you. All for all and none for one.

I personally prefer the idea of eugenics/selective breeding.
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#215711 - 01/16/07 12:21 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
gypsy Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/04/01
Posts: 4749
Loc: Here
Have we come to the point where non of us love each other any more? Is love dead, and has is been taken over by animal lust

Yes "love" is dead and has been taken over by animal lust. And I like it just fine, I wouldnt have it any other way.

Love
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"All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie."

"Eternal nothingness is fine if you happen to be dressed for it."


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#215712 - 01/16/07 04:24 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Hydra_M_Star]
Mythil Offline


Registered: 01/06/07
Posts: 110
Loc: UK, Portsmouth
Love is not dead dead, just rare. And I'm not saying your can't love and lust at the same time, what annoys the hell out of me, is when someone has given a heart felt vow, and goes and breaks it because someone has a nice arse.
_________________________
My Heaven is your hell - Lordi "He was the sort of person who stood on mountaintops during thunderstorms in wet copper armour shouting 'All the Gods are bastards.'" - Terry Pratchett

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#215713 - 01/16/07 06:03 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Bogey_Man Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 10/25/02
Posts: 1888
Loc: Lost.
This is nothing new. It's always been this way.

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#215714 - 01/16/07 06:29 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Phineas]
Mythil Offline


Registered: 01/06/07
Posts: 110
Loc: UK, Portsmouth
Humm, perhaps I should have separated my points on love vrs lust and underage pregnancies?
_________________________
My Heaven is your hell - Lordi "He was the sort of person who stood on mountaintops during thunderstorms in wet copper armour shouting 'All the Gods are bastards.'" - Terry Pratchett

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#215715 - 01/16/07 07:54 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Khaos Offline


Registered: 01/08/07
Posts: 27
Loc: Canada
Actully you may have a point. Like its already been said, teenagers are high on hormons. So ofcourse a young couple of 17 are most likly going to screw around because they're just horny. Its more like puppy love then the more deep serious one. Honestly, how many of you had a boyfriend/girlfriend last long when a teenager? Yes some casses you end up with you mate for a life time but most cases its just ends as quick/dramatic as it begon. Its Puppy love.

For the money they recive for being pregnant. Its dumbass people helping out its own kind. They don't know the meaning of 'safe sex' yet. They should do like the cigerette packages, put warning on the condome packages. Warning most be one BEFORE NOT AFTER.

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#215716 - 01/16/07 08:31 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
This may be a little off topic but your post reminded me of an interview I read with Madonna. The question was what was she going to teach her daughter about boys. Madonna answered, I won't have to teach her anything about boys if I teach her to respect herself. May be oversimplified but it sounded like the right idea.
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#215717 - 01/16/07 09:10 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Torquemada Offline


Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 211
Loc: Spain&UK
Love is dead, long live lust

I see nothing wrong with this statement. However, I am not so radical in this. I think love is not dead. It is just on holydays, lol. I hope it will not come back. It might have an accident. Maybe Herod could be back and start killing the stupid teenagers. Oh, Jason Voorheas, what are you doing when we all need you? KILL THE STUPID TEENAGERS, please. SLAUGHTER THEM ALL. WELL, now I feel better, so, back to normal.

Dear All:

I am a supporter of the L&F theory: Lust and Friendship. This is very good, at least for me. I still have many friends who have been my ex lovers. They all followed the L&F theory. We still keep in touch. With the few women I loved or they loved me, I have no relationship at all. It is dead. Therefore, get the hell out of there when they come with the bloody love. Leave it for them. It is not for me.

The most similar thing to love I know is just sex and friendship in a civilised context. I do not deny emotion, drama, a bit of theatre, acting, and even a few natural emotions per day. But I do not want love in the fucking traditional sense. No way.

The thing is that I do not consider love when someone feels butterflies in the stomach. Anyway, I do not feel that many years ago, and I am very happy with it. Sex and Friendship is the recipe. That also can lead to a partnership. But it has to be based on something rational with solid foundations. Otherwise, it will be in vain.

Best,

Torquemada

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#215718 - 01/16/07 09:22 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Torquemada]
gypsy Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/04/01
Posts: 4749
Loc: Here
Quote:

The thing is that I do not consider love when someone feels butterflies in the stomach. Anyway, I do not feel that many years ago, and I am very happy with it. Sex and Friendship is the recipe. That also can lead to a partnership. But it has to be based on something rational with solid foundations. Otherwise, it will be in vain.




Well said! You are a wise man Torquemada
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"All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie."

"Eternal nothingness is fine if you happen to be dressed for it."


Church of Satan

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#215719 - 01/16/07 10:06 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Torquemada]
The_Lightning Offline


Registered: 05/21/06
Posts: 1325
Loc: Israel
I think falling in love is the most selfish feeling one can have for another person. Falling in love with someone is never about the other person- it's always about your fantasies, your needs.

Loving someone, on the other hand, is having respect for that person, knowing him for what he truly is and not what you want him to be- and cherishing it.

Love in the traditional, corny sense of it is nothing but a rush of young hormones that make you blind to reality.

Being "in love" is stupid, loving isn't.


Edited by The_Lightning (01/16/07 10:07 AM)
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#215720 - 01/16/07 10:12 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: gypsy]
Torquemada Offline


Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 211
Loc: Spain&UK

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#215721 - 01/16/07 10:30 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: The_Lightning]
Torquemada Offline


Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 211
Loc: Spain&UK
Well, that is a good point. Loving is difficult. To be in love is easy. In fact, it is too easy. And it is also not very elegant once you are more than 25 years old. I would even say more: to be in love is so vulgar and common (***)

However, I can love too. But my love is not the love of those people..It is far better

(***) Please, do not misinterpret this affirmation and take it out of context. Of course, and as usual, I mean no disrespect to anyone.


Best,

Torquemada

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#215723 - 01/16/07 10:48 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Quaark]
Torquemada Offline


Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 211
Loc: Spain&UK
I wish i were 24. Then i could be inelegant again.



Best,

Torquemada

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#215724 - 01/16/07 10:49 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Torquemada]
Rory_Rocketpants Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/28/05
Posts: 1795
Loc: unknown
Quote:

I am a supporter of the L&F theory: Lust and Friendship. This is very good, at least for me. I still have many friends who have been my ex lovers. They all followed the L&F theory. We still keep in touch. With the few women I loved or they loved me, I have no relationship at all. It is dead.




I totally agree with this concept, though there are many (of my ex girlfriends) that do not.

Unlucky for them...

My best friend is a girl from college, we fucked constantly, that was it, no holding hands or going on romantic picnics.

We are still friends to this day, though I do miss her body, she is still a great friend, if we had "gone out" then it would have wrecked everything, I chose not to ask her out, even though she wanted to, I could see that it would go wrong eventually.

I made the right choice.

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#215728 - 01/16/07 11:34 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Maya]
Mythil Offline


Registered: 01/06/07
Posts: 110
Loc: UK, Portsmouth
I think I should have wondered the title better. Anyway, it's not just love for a person you have sex with, it's love for that poor sod you bring in to the world, or love for yourself not getting onto that whole "welfare" mother/father state. Just because I say "love", doesn't mean it's for a husband/wife/girlfriend/boyfriend.
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My Heaven is your hell - Lordi "He was the sort of person who stood on mountaintops during thunderstorms in wet copper armour shouting 'All the Gods are bastards.'" - Terry Pratchett

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#215729 - 01/16/07 01:03 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Torquemada]
Doctor_Beat Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 08/06/06
Posts: 282
Quote:



I am a supporter of the L&F theory: Lust and Friendship. This is very good, at least for me. I still have many friends who have been my ex lovers. They all followed the L&F theory. We still keep in touch. With the few women I loved or they loved me, I have no relationship at all. It is dead. Therefore, get the hell out of there when they come with the bloody love. Leave it for them. It is not for me.





Wow, it's like you read my mind! This is my philosophy too, I only wish I had realised sooner....
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#215730 - 01/16/07 01:05 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: The_Lightning]
Bruja Offline

CoS Witch

Registered: 04/22/05
Posts: 2054
Loc: Atlanta, GA.
Quote:

Being "in love" is stupid, loving isn't.





I disagree.

I can concede, however, that I've seen my share of seemingly intelligent people revert to stupid, irrational, or infantile behavior.. all the while using "love" as an excuse (albeit a pathetic one).

It's a shame, really... as it seems that these characters are starting to give love a bad name.

As for me, though, I refuse to become jaded. I'm still a big fan of it all, and believe that a real and mature love is incredibly empowering, and can truly enrich a life.

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#215740 - 01/16/07 03:27 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Bruja]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
The trick is for both parties to "fall in love" at the same time. After almost 17 years of "being in love", I can only say it is volitional...not something that hits you, beyond your control; and, takes work to maintain. But, it makes me happy, so it's worth it.
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#215741 - 01/16/07 03:35 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: The_Lightning]
Zaftig Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 3406
Quote:

Love in the traditional, corny sense of it is nothing but a rush of young hormones that make you blind to reality.





I actually like this rush. It's extremely rare for me. But when it does happen...watch out.

EDIT: And yes, love has made me jealous, stupid, and mean. But the sex was fucking awesome!

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#215742 - 01/16/07 03:54 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Zaftig]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
Quote:

... love has made me jealous, stupid, and mean. But the sex was fucking awesome!




I'm not sure... is this the most brilliant pun I have ever seen? Yes... "the sex was fucking awesome"... Me likey.

A tiki for Lexi... Thanks for the chuckle!
_________________________
"What happens in the shadow, in the grey regions, also interests us all that is elusive and fugitive, all that can be said in those beautiful half tones, or in whispers, in deep shade." ~ The Brothers Quay

We're Just Regular People

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#215743 - 01/16/07 03:58 PM My unschooled theory of love [Re: Quaark]
The_Lightning Offline


Registered: 05/21/06
Posts: 1325
Loc: Israel
What I was talking about is the fairy tale "knight on a white horse, coming to "save the princess" from a hideous monster (herself)". "and they live happily ever after". Riiiight.

Those I know who have experienced such "felling in love", winded up wanting to change each other and demanding impossible things from one another. No happy ending there.

I'm really sick of people falling in love with me, wanting me to change them or to change me. And there are so goddamn many of them!

Love, for me, is just being wholeheartedly with a person, having that intuitive feeling that you are both on the "same wave".
Not something that comes out of being "two halves that make a whole" but rather, being "two wholes" that make a new world between them.
"Falling in love" I view as something desperate and needy (in a suffocating manner).
While love is just magnetism between two, independent beings.
It's just a very intimate friendship, with sexuality on top.

Ya' know? =P
I'm not sure we are even in a disagreement about the nature of the concept as much as how we term it




(-This was 60 seconds of Little Miss Lightning's weekly "philosophical-spree"-
-Thank you for reading, and have a nice day!- ~smile~)
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There is no such thing as evolution - Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.

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#215747 - 01/16/07 09:20 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Zaftig]
redheadgrl Offline


Registered: 09/24/06
Posts: 273
Quote:

Quote:

Love in the traditional, corny sense of it is nothing but a rush of young hormones that make you blind to reality.





I actually like this rush. It's extremely rare for me. But when it does happen...watch out.

EDIT: And yes, love has made me jealous, stupid, and mean. But the sex was fucking awesome!




I agree 100% with you lexiphanic!!!!!

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#215748 - 01/16/07 09:45 PM Re: My unschooled theory of love [Re: The_Lightning]
redheadgrl Offline


Registered: 09/24/06
Posts: 273
Quote:

I'm really sick of people falling in love with me, wanting me to change them or to change me. And there are so goddamn many of them!




This is my cue to come up with a good excuse for a sudden exit (this kind of conversation is futile and is really just a type of power struggle, of which I refuse to participate). He might be smart enough to hesitate before bring up certain topics if such conversations results in a Houdini act.

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#215749 - 01/16/07 10:46 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Jean_Luc_Picard Offline


Registered: 11/28/06
Posts: 18
it may be the shitty parenting but i am not going to go pointing fingers. i was raised just fine; my parents are fucking awesome and i just simply do not want a g/f or relationship at all. i figure it will save me from unneeded stress
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#215750 - 01/16/07 11:36 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Discipline Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/25/03
Posts: 6796
Loc: Forever West
Lust is dead!!! No wait . . . print is dead!!! No . . . Ah hell, I don't know.
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#215765 - 01/17/07 08:50 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Poetaster Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/20/06
Posts: 2334
Loc: East Coast, USA.
Here's how I see it.

There's no wrong or right answer to this.

Some people haven't felt the emotion of love, some people won't ever experience it. To them, love is dead, and might never have existed in the first place.

Then, there are some who experience this emotion, accept it and enhance it.

However, love and lust are not mutually exclusive terms.

In fact, when I 'fell in love', not only did the sun set with her, it rose with her as well, and love intensified my lust a hundred fold.

It wasn't something I planned for and it damn sure wasn't something I could stop, even if I had wanted to.
_________________________
"People who harbor strong convictions without evidence belong at the margins of our societies, not in our halls of power. The only thing we should respect in a persons faith is his desire for a better life in this world; we need never have respected his certainty that one awaits him in the next."

- Sam Harris





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#215766 - 01/17/07 09:35 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Hagen von Tronje Offline

CoS Priest

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 10121
I always wonder about these proclamations, as though the author actually made a real declaration of something happening.

Also, your post title was irrelevant to the content, which was rambling and disjointed. I think you're irritated that humans reproduce so prolifically, and have a sense of youthful surprise at this and believe it to be some new trend you're observing. How do you suppose we came to swarm across the entire surface of the globe, anyway? What that has to do with love/lust is beyond me. However, I think love is just grand, and makes a good mate for lust.
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"The devil I'll bring you," answered Hagen. "I have enough to carry with my shield and breastplate; my helm is bright, the sword is in my hand, therefore I bring you naught."

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#215767 - 01/17/07 09:51 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Callier Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/30/06
Posts: 2195
Quote:

And really, who is sick enough to sleep with a 12 year old girl.






This guy perhaps.

HS!
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#215768 - 01/17/07 10:33 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
gypsy Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/04/01
Posts: 4749
Loc: Here
The question is why do you give a rats ass about any of it, why is it so important to you? Furthermore what makes you believe that any of what you are pointing out here is new?

Maybe just face the fact that none of what you are pointing out is new. These things have been going on since the dawn of man. Face it and face the fact that there are as many definitions for love as there are people on this planet.

So of course love is alive, surely you can figure that out yourself. And really that is what matters.
_________________________
"All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie."

"Eternal nothingness is fine if you happen to be dressed for it."


Church of Satan

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#215769 - 01/17/07 10:42 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
RandomStranger Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 2770
Loc: Here.
If it wasn't for love, there would be no broken hearts.

If there were no broken hearts, there'd be no Emo kiddies running around feeling so misunderstood.

The malls, schools and (what's left of) record stores are loaded with said Emo kids.

Love, 1. Your broad-sweeping generalizations, 0.
_________________________




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#215772 - 01/19/07 11:15 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10564
Loc: England
No, romance isn't dead. It is actually quite natural.

So natural that it is, in fact, in nature all around us. It's in the stream gushing from an orifice between the thighs of a mountain. It's in the raindrop dripping into the face of a flower. It's in the mating dance of birds.

As far as human relationships go, it is somewhat more complicated due to our emotional development and individual psychologies.

Someone in this thread said that falling hopelessly in love is like being physically assaulted. That is so true.

In The Art Of Seduction Robert Greene expands on this a little further saying:

"We grow emotional, lose the ability to think straight, act in foolish ways that we would never do otherwise."

The truth is that stupidity, mistakes and even becoming a little pathetic are sure signs that we have fallen under a spell (from a Satanic perspective I think this is hugely interesting).

Beyond lust or infatuation, it is a deeper love that allows us to overcome these early obstacles and settle into a deeper relationship. Without the ability and maturity to see this wider perspective people will drop like a dead donkey at the first hurdle and the relationship could be cut short.

We all have experiences and psychological quirks. We all have deep rooted emotional scars. And none of us can change who or what we are. Many of our past experiences were beyond our control. We can't change it - but it is love that allows us to "forgive" the quirks of a loved one by working with or around a problem.

Of course those given to petulence or fickleness may struggle with dealing with the quirks of others. And in that case....

well, if you were in love with such a person you'd have try and find a way of working with their individual psychology.


So, for the success of relationships (and thus the survival of the species if we want to be scientific) "love" is quite natural to the human.

It isn't altruistic or anti Satanic to become self sacrificing for someone we love. As I said in a recent weblog on my site - giving away one's energy in matters of love should not be seen as a cost but an investment.

I do think some Satanists over compensate and in doing so become a monster of insensitivity. It's fine when applied to those we do not care about, but in matters of love would be cutting off our own nose to spite our face.

Just a few thoughts.

Sorry, I actually went off on a bit of a rant. Hope it still makes sense.
_________________________
"Spiral Out: a bleak, page-turning, unforgettable read. Existentialism at its most hardcore" - www.uvray.moonfruit.com





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#215773 - 01/19/07 03:24 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Chess Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/09/02
Posts: 1473
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
Quote:

So natural that it is, in fact, in nature all around us. It's in the stream gushing from an orifice between the thighs of a mountain. It's in the raindrop dripping into the face of a flower. It's in the mating dance of birds.




That turn of phrase reminded me of Earth Erotica. (If you've never seen this, it's worth a look -- it's rocks and landforms sculpted by nature into forms our dirty little minds will appreciate.)

-Chess

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#215774 - 01/19/07 06:07 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Discipline Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/25/03
Posts: 6796
Loc: Forever West
Mr. Ray, that was beautiful. Thank you for sharing it.
_________________________
"I've learned . . . that life is like a roll of toilet paper. The closer it gets to the end, the faster it goes." ~Andy Rooney

"At last I shall have time to devote myself seriously and freely to the destruction of all my former opinions." ~Descartes

The first principle is that you must not fool yourselfand you are the easiest person to fool. ~Richard Feynman

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#215775 - 01/19/07 08:01 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Chess]
dragondancer Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 12/22/04
Posts: 1546
Loc: Virginia
Wow! I really enjoyed those pictures on that link you posted. How very awesome. I have seen things like that in nature, but not being a photographer would never have been able to catch it quite like she did! Thanks for the link.


Hail Satan!
_________________________
"It does take an exceptional mind and a still more exceptional integrity to remain untouched by the brain-destroying influences of the world's doctrines, the accumulated evil of the centuries-to remain human, since the human is the rational." Dr. Akston in Atlas Shrugged

"Not life, but good life, is to be chiefly valued." Socrates

Dragondancer
Temple of Vampire


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#215776 - 01/19/07 11:27 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
luciferHammer Offline
Banned

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 242
Quote:

It isn't altruistic or anti Satanic to become self sacrificing for someone we love. As I said in a recent weblog on my site - giving away one's energy in matters of love should not be seen as a cost but an investment.

I do think some Satanists over compensate and in doing so become a monster of insensitivity. It's fine when applied to those we do not care about, but in matters of love would be cutting off our own nose to spite our face.





Deciding to love someone is even a more important decision than deciding to align yourself with someone. Extreme care must be taken. You're post is quite interesting and elegant to read, but it seems that a warning was missing....

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#215777 - 01/19/07 11:38 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Zaftig]
luciferHammer Offline
Banned

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 242
Your edit was expected. Thanks for proving me right!

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#215778 - 01/20/07 02:08 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: luciferHammer]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10564
Loc: England
>> Deciding to love someone is even a more important decision than deciding to align yourself with someone. Extreme care must be taken. You're post is quite interesting and elegant to read, but it seems that a warning was missing....<<

Sexual attraction and falling in love is not a conscious decision. It occurs on an emotional and deeper psychological level.

That is why it is referred to as "falling" in love. It is literally a loss of control.

The fact is that confusion, pain and irrationality are intrinsic elements of falling in love. The trick is to realise this and actually enjoy the polemics as the pendulum swings between suffering and satisfaction.

The initial stages of love cause a surge of uncontrollable emotions that are difficult to deal with as we try and hold on to our rationality - this can push us into odd behaviour.

The stronger the emotions involved the more severe is the cliff edge we fall over.

Part of the pleasure is yielding to this loss of control; understanding that it is part of the crystalisation process. And we simply must have the ability to understand
that our lover is also struggling against the boundries of his own psychology in the midst of these volatile emotions flooding their system.

George Bataille, author of one of the 20th Century's greatest erotic novels Story Of The Eye, described it thusly in his writings:

"We ought never to forget that in spite of the bliss love promises its first effect is one of turmoil and distress. Passion fulfilled provokes such violent agitation that the happiness involved is so great as to be like its opposite, suffering. The likeliehood of suffering is all the greater for it reveals the total significance of the beloved."

These emotions settle down somewhat as we form deeper trust and devotion. But these early stages are dangerous in the sheer beauty of the feelings we experience.

Its a shame that some people simply cannot overcome the hurdle since this volatile and passionate process in relationships is absolutely necessary and these are the very ones that often develop into something of extreme erotic depth and love.

The more cold hearted and callous a person is, the less they will understand human love and the polemics of it - much less the ability to yield to and enjoy it. They begin to lose perspective and experience only pain and strife, letting it eclipse everything else and stifle the pleasure involved.

Or perhaps this is just me.
_________________________
"Spiral Out: a bleak, page-turning, unforgettable read. Existentialism at its most hardcore" - www.uvray.moonfruit.com





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#215779 - 01/20/07 12:54 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Zaftig Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 3406
The poet waxes romantic.

Lovely words Warlock.

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#215780 - 01/20/07 04:35 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: luciferHammer]
Zaftig Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 3406
Well let me clarify a little without the use of flippant sexual references (as useful and amusing as they are).

While love has indeed made me jealous, stupid and mean, it has also made generous, thoughtful, funny, loyal, and open to a level of intimacy that I, quite frankly, thought myself incapable of.

As I increase in age and experience the challenges of loving someone become easier to handle. While my ability to respond eloquently to goading lovers was quite poor in my early relationships ("What?! I'm fucking argumentative?!?! I am not!") I feel so much less threatened by the small things in my recent ones ("I'm argumentative? *shrug* Not baited, baby. How do you want your eggs?").

Despite the turmoil, angst, pain, frustration, arguments, confusion and misery, I would not change it. I have grown much as a person because I loved someone, and relationships act as a catalyst to understanding things about myself that I would never have realized (who knew that submission, in all forms, would be so fucking wonderful? I sure as hell didn't).

Alright. That's enough from me.

Hail Romance! Hail Love!

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#215781 - 01/21/07 09:18 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Zaftig]
luciferHammer Offline
Banned

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 242
That's make sense.

Thanks for your reply.

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#215782 - 01/21/07 09:56 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
luciferHammer Offline
Banned

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 242
Quote:

Sexual attraction and falling in love is not a conscious decision. It occurs on an emotional and deeper psychological level.




I agree, but you still can decide to let these emotions take control or fight them back. Passion usually doesn't make someone lose his head 24 hours a day. I'm sure that some cannot handle the power of passion, and some use it to as a powerful source of energy. Maybe you are one of those you can handle it....

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#215783 - 01/22/07 01:32 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: luciferHammer]
redheadgrl Offline


Registered: 09/24/06
Posts: 273
Anyone in love is vulnerable.

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#215784 - 01/22/07 03:01 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: luciferHammer]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10564
Loc: England
>> I agree, but you still can decide to let these emotions take control or fight them back. Passion usually doesn't make someone lose his head 24 hours a day. I'm sure that some cannot handle the power of passion, and some use it to as a powerful source of energy. Maybe you are one of those you can handle it....<<

No, I'm not.

It is true that our whole life doesn't often fall apart but in my case, once smitten I can lose my head. I can lose a sense of perspective as I surrender myself to this surge of emotional confusion. I don't often fall in love and I can see the same woman for a lengthy amount of time and feel no deeper attraction or meaning. And then occasionally (Only a couple of times in my life, actually) a girl can appear in my life and take my heart and soul in an instant. It's a complete shock to my system. Just like being hit by a train. Everything surfaces within me all at once and I am rendered a mess.

I recover my footing pretty quickly but not before a period of muddle and misunderstanding.


I make a passionate and loving partner, but unfortunately the sheer depth of my feelings can lead to me temporarily losing my usual rationality.

It is in fact a beautiful agony. But not always.
_________________________
"Spiral Out: a bleak, page-turning, unforgettable read. Existentialism at its most hardcore" - www.uvray.moonfruit.com





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#215785 - 01/22/07 09:08 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Zak Offline


Registered: 01/21/07
Posts: 45
Loc: New Jersey, United States
I appreciate your words. They explain what I have thought better than I have been able to. My girlfriend, while not a Satanist, understands Satanism and thought that Satanic beliefs and my love for her were contradictory, and I tried to explain to her that that was not so. She understood, but I believe that you have said it best.

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#215786 - 01/22/07 10:32 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Quote:

>> I agree, but you still can decide to let these emotions take control or fight them back. Passion usually doesn't make someone lose his head 24 hours a day. I'm sure that some cannot handle the power of passion, and some use it to as a powerful source of energy. Maybe you are one of those you can handle it....<<

No, I'm not.

It is true that our whole life doesn't often fall apart but in my case, once smitten I can lose my head. I can lose a sense of perspective as I surrender myself to this surge of emotional confusion. I don't often fall in love and I can see the same woman for a lengthy amount of time and feel no deeper attraction or meaning. And then occasionally (Only a couple of times in my life, actually) a girl can appear in my life and take my heart and soul in an instant. It's a complete shock to my system. Just like being hit by a train. Everything surfaces within me all at once and I am rendered a mess.

I recover my footing pretty quickly but not before a period of muddle and misunderstanding.


I make a passionate and loving partner, but unfortunately the sheer depth of my feelings can lead to me temporarily losing my usual rationality.

It is in fact a beautiful agony. But not always.




I can relate.

It is easy for Me to lose My head once smitten 'bitten' by the bug (this could also pertain to the feeling of falling in love with a new friend) Not sexually related but just that giddy feeling of finding someone in this world that you can relate to, benefit from and likewise them benefit from you.

All though I realise that I am acting silly, I cannot seem to help Myself right away.

It takes Me a little while to settle down and put things into true perspective and pull Myself together.

I always do so in the end.

The feeling of falling in love is one of My most favourite feelings of all, on the same token it is also one of the most painful feelings of all.

I also have a fear that I am putting more into something/someone than I can ever hope to receive in return which in the end, makes Me feel quite foolish as I KNEW and still lost My head.

One of My most favourite quotes is from Henry Rollins where he says:

I don't trust people. I know them too well. (That also goes for Me). I know Me too well.

Love is a many spledored thing, but it is also sharp and pointy.

A two edged sword if you will.

_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#215787 - 01/22/07 10:41 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
gypsy Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/04/01
Posts: 4749
Loc: Here
Quote:

No, I'm not.
It is true that our whole life doesn't often fall apart but in my case, once smitten I can lose my head. I can lose a sense of perspective as I surrender myself to this surge of emotional confusion. I don't often fall in love and I can see the same woman for a lengthy amount of time and feel no deeper attraction or meaning. And then occasionally (Only a couple of times in my life, actually) a girl can appear in my life and take my heart and soul in an instant. It's a complete shock to my system. Just like being hit by a train. Everything surfaces within me all at once and I am rendered a mess.

I recover my footing pretty quickly but not before a period of muddle and misunderstanding.

I make a passionate and loving partner, but unfortunately the sheer depth of my feelings can lead to me temporarily losing my usual rationality.

It is in fact a beautiful agony. But not always.




Hence we have a Poet and some mighty fine poetry.
_________________________
"All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie."

"Eternal nothingness is fine if you happen to be dressed for it."


Church of Satan

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#215788 - 01/22/07 10:56 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Evil_Eve]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10564
Loc: England
>> The feeling of falling in love is one of My most favourite feelings of all, on the same token it is also one of the most painful feelings of all. <<


Indeed, Miss Eve.

That feeling of being completely and utterly possessed by a woman is quite beautiful. A woman who can make me desire her so feverishly is of great value to me. Along with the sheer pain and yearning comes the realisation that she has power over me. In a world where I am usually rational and responsible it is an exquisite pleasure to surrender oneself in abandon. The loss of control is a pleasure.

I actually feel that the most dispassionate of people think too much. They turn over details and fears in their minds, turn them over and over until it vanquishes the passion. It may well be down to how insecure we are in offering ourselves to someone so completely. They are unable to surrender themselves to passionate love without flapping and worrying - inadvertently initiating a negative domino effect that eventually eats away at any affection.

I love the sexual power the consummate seductress has over me.

Lessons of the past are ineffective. Arthur Miller never recovered from his relationship with Marilyn Monroe and he was rendered unable to write for years afterwards. Such women completely seduce the masculine type.

Just like Mark Anthony, we all have our Cleopatra. Our fantasy woman made flesh. When one of these rare creatures appears in my life they can render me their abject slave.

Such woman can ruin a man. It's been done so many times throughout history - the more powerful or driven or purposeful in his endeavours the man is the greater it seems is his vulnerability.

Yet still men such as myself cannot resist.

Anyway, I am done with this subject now. I have given FAR too much of my thoughts away in this matter.

I have ranted away with all loss of control. Jesus.

For anyone getting any funny ideas just remember I am still The Great U.V. Not soft at all.

_________________________
"Spiral Out: a bleak, page-turning, unforgettable read. Existentialism at its most hardcore" - www.uvray.moonfruit.com





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#215789 - 01/22/07 02:45 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Mr_47 Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3082
Loc: Pure Imagination
You, soft? No!

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#215790 - 01/22/07 02:53 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
The_Lightning Offline


Registered: 05/21/06
Posts: 1325
Loc: Israel
You hit the nail on its head so many times- it must've reached China by now.


I enjoyed these posts immensely.
Thank you.
_________________________
There is no such thing as evolution - Just a list of creatures Chuck Norris has allowed to live.

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#215793 - 01/22/07 03:04 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Mythil Offline


Registered: 01/06/07
Posts: 110
Loc: UK, Portsmouth
No no, made perfect sense to me. My point really was in the people who say they want one thing, and do the other. I believe honesty is always best, and at least be honest with yourself when it comes to love. I don't really believe "love" is dead, as I love, well, more things than people. Sunsets, coffee on a cool day, the mountains of my home town in Wales.

As to my previous apology, I really think I should spend far more time in actually turning my posts into more of a question or point than a semi rant.
_________________________
My Heaven is your hell - Lordi "He was the sort of person who stood on mountaintops during thunderstorms in wet copper armour shouting 'All the Gods are bastards.'" - Terry Pratchett

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#215795 - 01/23/07 01:37 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mr_47]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10564
Loc: England
Quote:

You, soft? No!




Dead right!

And let no one forget it.

I have no love to give. There is no love in my heart. I am a bad man.

That's why I am known as El Terrible Bickley.

_________________________
"Spiral Out: a bleak, page-turning, unforgettable read. Existentialism at its most hardcore" - www.uvray.moonfruit.com





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#215796 - 01/23/07 01:42 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Quote:

Quote:

You, soft? No!




Dead right!

And let no one forget it.

I have no love to give. There is no love in my heart. I am a bad man.

That's why I am known as El Terrible Bickley.









Uh huh.
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#215797 - 01/29/07 10:06 AM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: The_Lightning]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10564
Loc: England
Quote:

You hit the nail on its head so many times- it must've reached China by now.


I enjoyed these posts immensely.
Thank you.




Indeed, I have.

And I make myself look so wise and fantastic.

But then in reality Ole' UV fucks it all up. A terrible, terrible man. Apparently.



Bah!
_________________________
"Spiral Out: a bleak, page-turning, unforgettable read. Existentialism at its most hardcore" - www.uvray.moonfruit.com





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#215798 - 01/29/07 01:56 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
kender Offline


Registered: 01/29/07
Posts: 1
sex is everywhere and when kids want to be in love they think sex
then theyre pregnant just like my girlfriend at least shes 18.
even by adults i beliueve love is very misunderstood and confusing. if not totally made up in your head that is.
i dont really care, i love many and lust for many more.
the real question is where can i find good true lust?

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#215799 - 01/29/07 02:15 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: kender]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Quote:

the real question is where can i find good true lust?





I hear there are some hot Hell hounds here.

Be sure to mention My name as I get a cut of the profits from those who apply for new membership.
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


Top
#215800 - 01/29/07 02:34 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Evil_Eve]
gypsy Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/04/01
Posts: 4749
Loc: Here
I hear there are some hot Hell hounds here.


Oh you SOB I'm choking over here
_________________________
"All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie."

"Eternal nothingness is fine if you happen to be dressed for it."


Church of Satan

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#215801 - 01/29/07 03:39 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
vivicaro Offline


Registered: 01/19/07
Posts: 2
Loc: Barcelona, Spain
For you I have a very specific question. Are all the symptoms you described that seem to put us under some sort of spell, only caused by feelings of lust or infatuation? Then when in lust we have much more to lose??...H ow many of us have not reached absurd levels of stupidity when in "love"? The word pathetic underestimates what some of us will do for the sake of someone else(this someone else is most often a parasite like person). This feeling of emptiness is what may often drive us to the better and less harmfull option of insensitivity and avoiding love completely. But what you say confuses me...is lust even more harmful? It's not love that makes us blind but lust? Damn....then what choices are there?
_________________________
ziggy

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#215802 - 01/29/07 05:54 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: Mythil]
MrsVineh Offline


Registered: 01/23/07
Posts: 47
Ok a few things.

1- Love is most definitely NOT dead. Lust is simply easier and faster to find. We usually feel lust for someone way before we even begin to love them (not talking about family of course).

2- Yes our carnal desire for lust does and should take over. Think about it. You cannot fall in love with every person you date. But you can fufill your needs for lust with them. So why not?

3- No the government should not be responsible for any kids born. The parents should be willing to take full responsibility of the children or else they should not have kids in the first place.
It is just the same with the teenagers. If a girl knows the risks of getting pregnant or getting STDs for that matter and she still decides to be sexually active, then she better damn well be responsible enough for her actions. If something happens to her it is nobody's fault but her own. If she (or he) cannot accept that then they are not ready to have sex.

4-In the Satanic Bible LaVey addresses this issue saying that it is rare to find both lust and love together in the same person. In fact many times one is found without the other. To the man or woman whom falls in love with a person they are not attracted to this is very unfortunate. This is when "infidelity" becomes an issue. A person may love sex and have a partner who does not; they end up seeking this side of love outside of the relationship. The key ruiner of relationships is not infidelity. It is lack of communication. Couples need to talk to each other about their sexuality.

5- On the topic of "cheating" my advice to the person who cannot commit or enjoys multiple sex partners; do not shackle and chain yourself to a marriage. It will only end in emotional pain most likely to your spouse.

I am only stating the basic obvious that most people refuse to see.
_________________________
HAiL LUST!
HAiL WRATH!
HAiL ENVY!
HAiL PRiDE!
HAiL GLUTTONY!
HAiL GREED!
HAiL SLOTH!
HAiL ME!
HAiL SATAN!

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#215803 - 01/29/07 05:59 PM Re: Love is dead, long live lust! [Re: gypsy]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Quote:

I hear there are some hot Hell hounds here.


Oh you SOB I'm choking over here




Sowwy.
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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