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#265376 - 08/17/07 10:23 AM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Virus9]
Svengali Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 12460
Loc: Florida, U.S.A.
 Originally Posted By: Virus9
Of course that's assuming that nearly all of the non-losers you know don't smoke pot. ;\)


Yes, but being a druggie adds to their special sleazebag aura.

 Quote:
I've noticed that when judging people, you seem to put a great deal of emphasis on their actions.


So you accept people who's actions are idiotic if their "intentions" are good?

I have a saying: "If you can't tell the difference between the toilet and the living room floor, don't come over to my house." ;\)

 Quote:
Given that and the fact that you are very clear about your opinions on all forms of drug use, I can't help but think it's possible that you might know a few pot users who you'd never suspect.


Its possible but irrelevant. I don't care if the dirtball who mows my lawn smokes pot, as long as he doesn't do it on my property.

It is also very possible that the people who don't think I know they use drugs are wrong.

 Quote:
From what I hear, people also tend to be much less guarded around me than around you. As a result, and for the fact that a lot of people know I advocate legalization, some otherwise spectacular people have let it slip in my presence that they like to take a toke from time to time. I'm usually pretty straightforward about not approving of their actions, but as long as they're not church affiliates and it's not getting in the way of anything I have going on, it's not my problem.


Yea, well, if I ever hit a human shortage maybe I'll lighten up.

In the meantime I see no reason to tolerate anything I don't like near my personal life.
_________________________
Live and Let Die.
"If I have to choose between defending the wolf or the dog, I choose the wolf, especially when he is bleeding." -- Jaques Verges
"I may have my faults, but being wrong ain't one of them." -- Jimmy Hoffa
"As for wars, well, there's only been 268 years out of the last 3421 in which there were no wars. So war, too, is in the normal course of events." -- Will Durant.
"Satanism is the worship of life, not a hypocritical, whitewashed vision of life, but life as it really is." -- Anton Szandor LaVey
ďA membership ticket in this party does not confer genius on the holder.Ē -- Benito Mussolini
MY BOOK: ESSAYS IN SATANISM | MY BLOG: COSMODROMIUM | Deep Satanism Blog

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#265379 - 08/17/07 10:27 AM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Virus9]
Drimlybunk Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 04/01/05
Posts: 928
Loc: California
 Quote:
 Quote:

As far as I'm aware there has been plenty of research done on the detrimental effects of pot-smoking upon the mind



You're right, and the much of it shows so little in the way of cognitive impairment as to be statistically insignificant.


Then, please - since by current standards, we assume weed destroys minds, please provide evidence to the contrary. The burden of proof falls on the challenger.

I have an "anecdote" with a wide sampling - approximately 80 individuals. These people grew up in an inner suburb (Population 50,000 - very close to a city of 2 Million). I attended kindergarten with these 80 people and went to high school with them. I could stretch numbers to 500 (my senior class) or even 2000 (my high school) - but I won't, I will focus on people I knew for most of their lives. I saw these people daily for at least 10 years and I knew which ones smoked pot and which ones did not. I knew when they started using, and how heavily they used. Most importantly: I know how they acted, what their grades were, what their ambitions were, and how they viewed themselves BEFORE and AFTER they started and continued to smoke pot. I can say undoubtedly, the people who began smoking at the beginning of high-school or earlier became different individuals by the time I graduated, and they changed for the worse. Their ambitions became mundane, their wit became droll, and they found themselves with more legal and family problems than I would have predicted. Of the people who did not smoke pot, I observed a preservation of character and higher self imposed standards. For at least 80 individuals I grew up with - Smoking pot negatively affects behavior.



As for the Sodomy example:
Making a behavior illegal creates a choice between that behavior and the punishment for it. If you went through the process of thinking: "do I want a blow job if the punishment is a fine of $XXX.xx or jail time of XX?" you understand me. However, if you considered the consequences irrelevant because you *knew* you would never get caught, then you fall in my audience - the group with something to learn.


Edited by Drimlybunk (08/17/07 11:09 AM)
Edit Reason: Accounted for non-smokers in the group of 80.
_________________________
'We train young men to drop fire on people, but their commanders won't allow them to write "fuck" on their airplanes because it's obscene!' -- Col. Kurtz (Apocalypse Now)

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#265407 - 08/17/07 11:50 AM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Svengali]
Virus9 Offline
CoS Priest

Registered: 08/06/01
Posts: 2108
Loc: Florida
 Quote:
So you accept people who's actions are idiotic if their "intentions" are good?


Who said anything about intentions?

Intentions have their place and actions count for something, but it is always results that matter first and foremost.

 Quote:

I have a saying: "If you can't tell the difference between the toilet and the living room floor, don't come over to my house."


Knowing the difference is meaningless if they still piss on the floor. It's all about results.

 Quote:
Yea, well, if I ever hit a human shortage maybe I'll lighten up.


You? Hit a human shortage? Is that even possible? ;\)
_________________________
Everyone is special in their own way, and by "special" I mean the short-bus variety.

"Recognize the phrase 'national interest' as a synonym for 'self-interest' and you will find no moral obstacle that cannot be removed from the highway of ambition."
-Lewis Lapham

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

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#265410 - 08/17/07 12:27 PM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Virus9]
Svengali Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 12460
Loc: Florida, U.S.A.
 Originally Posted By: Virus9
 Quote:
So you accept people who's actions are idiotic if their "intentions" are good?


Who said anything about intentions?

Intentions have their place and actions count for something, but it is always results that matter first and foremost.


You questioned my making judgements based on actions.

What other than action is there to base a judgment on, other than "intention."

Results follow actions.
_________________________
Live and Let Die.
"If I have to choose between defending the wolf or the dog, I choose the wolf, especially when he is bleeding." -- Jaques Verges
"I may have my faults, but being wrong ain't one of them." -- Jimmy Hoffa
"As for wars, well, there's only been 268 years out of the last 3421 in which there were no wars. So war, too, is in the normal course of events." -- Will Durant.
"Satanism is the worship of life, not a hypocritical, whitewashed vision of life, but life as it really is." -- Anton Szandor LaVey
ďA membership ticket in this party does not confer genius on the holder.Ē -- Benito Mussolini
MY BOOK: ESSAYS IN SATANISM | MY BLOG: COSMODROMIUM | Deep Satanism Blog

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#265459 - 08/17/07 05:26 PM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Helian]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3969
Loc: The Deep South
 Originally Posted By: Helian
No... The kung fu guy? I'm as far from being an expert on him as possible. But again, anecdotes are not evidence.


It is if it comes accompanied by an autopsy report.

Apparently the combination of cannabis and painkillers made a weird interaction that made his brain explode.

Of course, every pot head in the world blames the painkillers.
_________________________
You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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#265472 - 08/17/07 06:04 PM Re: About being God. [Re: Nemo]
x9x Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 12/10/04
Posts: 958
Loc: Flanders - Europe
 Originally Posted By: Nemo


It is critically important to remember that there are plenty of other Gods up the street who might just be able to kick your ass!

(Please pardon my crude speech).



I like that quote and you're definitely hitting nails here!!!
_________________________
He who turns the other cheek is a cowardly dog.
||.TSB Page 33.||

An investment in knowledge always pays the best interest.
|| Benjamin Franklin ||

The lack of money is the root of all evil.
|| George Bernard ||



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#265476 - 08/17/07 06:38 PM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Helian]
J. Hagalaz Offline


Registered: 12/30/03
Posts: 1212
Loc: USA
I donít know, maybe itís just me, but whether it is legal or not, why would a Satanist choose to smoke pot? What about the magical implications; that is, the dilution of any magical potential? What about the fact that walking around in a drug induced trance makes you that much more susceptible to outside influence? It doesnít matter how ďstrong willedí you are. If you donít think any of things I mentioned are relevant, then why are you here? Doctor LaVey made clear his stance on drugs in The Satanic Bible (p.101) and in The Satanic Witch as well. Legal or not, if you think drugs are ok "for some people" then you are clearly ignoring the larger picture. The Satanist is in control of, not controlled by. If you are on drugs, you are being controlled.
_________________________
They are doomed because they cannot even glimpse beyond the construct that their masters have put into place. Their masters are doomed because they believe in the construct they created.

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#265479 - 08/17/07 06:49 PM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Old_Pig]
Virus9 Offline
CoS Priest

Registered: 08/06/01
Posts: 2108
Loc: Florida
 Quote:
It is if it comes accompanied by an autopsy report.


While cannabis was found in his system the autopsy report concluded that the cause of death was brain swelling due to an abnormal hypersensitivity or allergic reaction to either aspirin or meprobamate.

I also ran a quick search for any reported drug interactions between cannabis and aspirin or cannabis and meprobamate. Granted the search wasn't especially thorough, but it seems that if such a combination was a likely cause of death there be more readily available information on it.

Unless you have access to more detailed reports, I don't see any reason to blame cannabis for Bruce Lee's death.
_________________________
Everyone is special in their own way, and by "special" I mean the short-bus variety.

"Recognize the phrase 'national interest' as a synonym for 'self-interest' and you will find no moral obstacle that cannot be removed from the highway of ambition."
-Lewis Lapham

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

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#265486 - 08/17/07 07:26 PM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Helian]
CatlikeJoe Offline


Registered: 06/26/07
Posts: 191
Loc: Dominican Republic
 Originally Posted By: Helian
If it is still unclear, just consider that not every breach of a literal contract is destructive to the contracting parties, either. You can't sue me for violating a contract we made unless there are DAMAGES.


Well, social contracts come in all shapes and sizes. If you jump a fence and intrude in a crazy gun enthusiast hillbilies propertay, he will use you for target practice, no matter what you did or would do there.

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#265488 - 08/17/07 07:40 PM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Svengali]
Virus9 Offline
CoS Priest

Registered: 08/06/01
Posts: 2108
Loc: Florida
 Quote:
You questioned my making judgements based on actions.


Really? Where did I do that?

 Quote:
Results follow actions.


But not all actions produce their desired result.

I do think I see what you're getting at, though. Basically what you're saying is that an action is to be judged on the level of success achieved in obtaining the desired result. I don't necessarily disagree with that.

I could sit here and split hairs for the rest of the night, but I don't see that as being particularly productive.
_________________________
Everyone is special in their own way, and by "special" I mean the short-bus variety.

"Recognize the phrase 'national interest' as a synonym for 'self-interest' and you will find no moral obstacle that cannot be removed from the highway of ambition."
-Lewis Lapham

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

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#265490 - 08/17/07 07:50 PM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Spark]
CatlikeJoe Offline


Registered: 06/26/07
Posts: 191
Loc: Dominican Republic
 Originally Posted By: Spark

I have seen plenty of evidence that smoking pot is detrimental to the user and those around him\her. I have seen the damage it causes in friends, family and more importantly myself!


I second this, although I have never had any on me.

As some have said it makes magic very hard to use since you are under the influence of it. Before I quit I was starting to suffer paranoia, luckily I was smart enough to know anything that went through my mind while I was high wasn't real... (I once thought god was trying to communicate with me \:o ).

The thing with marijuana is that it doesnít have literally painful side effects like alcohol or other things (sodomy?). Someone with a major hangover will likely spend at least a few days without drinking. I find it lame the way some people find it fun when they drink so much they don't remember what happened.

I remember a pothead trying to get in front of a 5 hour line to pay something. After that he just walked away giggling and left the receipt (which he was going to need eventually).

I lost allot of respect for an ex-friend of mines when he once said that if he had an infinite supply of weed and a PS2 he wouldn't need anything else in his life.
I could imagine him... vegetating like a moth in front of a fluorescent screen.

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#265492 - 08/17/07 08:01 PM Why illegal drug use is not Satanic. [Re: Helian]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12536
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...

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#265495 - 08/17/07 08:07 PM Re: Why illegal drug use is not Satanic. [Re: Nemo]
Ygraine Offline

CoS Magistra

Registered: 07/11/01
Posts: 2849
Loc: Florida
Cuts right to the chase, dunnit?

Y~
_________________________
Magistra, Church of Satan/
Autocrat of the Damned





http://magistrayrainetwo.blogspot.com/

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#265498 - 08/17/07 08:12 PM Re: Why illegal drug use is not Satanic. [Re: Ygraine]
Phoenix_Inferno Offline
Banned

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 135
Loc: Maryland, U.S.A.
Quite. It's amazing how much of a message can be conveyed through one simple photograph. Awsome post Nemo \:\)
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Love. Laugh. Live. Forever.
Hail Satan!
=================================================
"There are no coincidences...only the illusion of coincidence"--V for Vendetta

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#265499 - 08/17/07 08:17 PM Re: Satanism and Laws [Re: Virus9]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3969
Loc: The Deep South
The story is that he had two episodes of brain swelling, the second being the fatal one.

The painkiller (Equagesic) was present on his system at only one of the episodes, the cannabis was on both.

Of course, I admit that's not enough to say marijuana killed Bruce Lee.

I just find sad that a man who dedicated so many years to train his body and mind to perfection ended up using a drug... and the probably unrelated fact he died at such a young age.
_________________________
You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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