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#299768 - 01/20/08 01:16 AM "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms...
Dammarval Offline
Praise Allah

Registered: 01/03/08
Posts: 32
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
There are many supposed documented cases of demonic possessions and exorcisms all over the world, documenting demon personalities that were able to speak multiple known languages, and seem to have individual characteristics...Can someone who is a CoS member share with me what is your view of it in regards to the philosophies of the Church? How would one account for these happenings?

Thank you.
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#299769 - 01/20/08 01:31 AM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Seeker Of Wisdom Offline


Registered: 01/19/08
Posts: 76
Loc: Buckholts, Tx
This is my personal belief. I believe that "demonic possession" occurs when a person practices abstinence to such a degree that they have no release. Or they refrain from certain actions out of fear of the church or other authority figures. The desires that this person has are then left to boil in their subconscious with no ability for release. These desires become so strong that it begins to strain at the seams ready to burst, like an over-filled water ballon stretched to its limit. But, their fear still holds "them" in submission, so they create an alternate personality that has the ability to fulfill the compulsions(no longer in the indulgence range). They turn to the churches enemy for inspiration, this Satan, this rebel angel.... they form in their subconscious mind a Christians "Demonic personality", complete opposite of themselves. Then they allow it to surface. Sometimes slowly, most of the time overnight, because like the over-filled water balloon if you pop a small hole in it, it's all going to try to come out. It's really sad that if they had just indulged themselves every now and then, the beast within wouldn't have become so feral. So take your beast for a walk, rub its belly now and then; because a happy beast with a full belly is so much easier to maintain then a starving one. HS!
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#299778 - 01/20/08 02:11 AM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Seeker Of Wisdom]
Never Offline


Registered: 01/08/08
Posts: 187
Loc: Skien, Norway
I agree with Seeker of Wisdom.

Demonic Possesions are a result of either a attention-seeking unconciouness or loosing yourself to such a degree that you can`t see yourself again.

Does anyone know any numbers connecting child-abuse to Demonic Possesion?
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#299783 - 01/20/08 02:28 AM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Never]
Max Faust Offline
Banned

Registered: 09/10/07
Posts: 419
Loc: Ultima Thule
I think that "demon possession" is merely a superstitious interpretation of a situation which is real enough, but also open to other possible explanations of psychology. I have a book called "Demons!" by Anthony Finlay which is arguing for the actual existence of "supernatural, mental forces" but his agenda is clear enough as he is a Catholic pater. However, the book is quite interesting for a couple of questions that it raises.

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#299795 - 01/20/08 04:42 AM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Philotechnic Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 08/02/07
Posts: 745
Loc: NC, US
Believe in "possessions" if you want, getting an opinion from a church member wont make up your mind on the matter, unless you're that easily swayed.

I am personally full out doubt because I've never experienced anything like that, maybe aside from wailing Christians rolling around on the floor, but that's nothing out of the ordinary. \:D

The answer you seek wont have a general agreement among members on the existence of possessions, but if I did have to guess, I'd say most didn't "believe" in possessions. But again, not like it really matters, if you want to experience something like that, seek it out yourself instead of speculating on the internet.


Edited by Wolf Landon (01/20/08 04:43 AM)

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#299796 - 01/20/08 05:21 AM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10568
Loc: England
Mental illness bolstered by lack of correct interpretation and diagnosis on account of delusional belief systems.
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#299848 - 01/20/08 11:36 AM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Poetaster Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/20/06
Posts: 2334
Loc: East Coast, USA.
The act of "possession" implies some kind of spiritual mumbo-jumbo, and you'll find that Satanism doesn't entertain spiritual mumbo-jumbo in any realistic fashion.*

With that caveat aside, I can only suggest that you pay close attention to any evidence put forth for "possession" and be sure that it keeps step with reason. Anecdotes can be intriguing, but alone, they are not enough to reasonably consider fantastic events.

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence" - Carl Sagan.

*The ritual chamber being an exception, left up to the discretion of individual Satanists, however, there's a line between psychodrama and unfounded belief.
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#299854 - 01/20/08 11:47 AM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Ygraine Offline

CoS Magistra

Registered: 07/11/01
Posts: 2849
Loc: Florida
 Quote:
How would one account for these happenings?


Mental illness.

Lack of personal responsibility.

Religious industry.

**************************************************************

Never fail to look at who is doing the alleged "documenting."

The clergy have a vested interest in the reality of possession because it keeps them in business.

The "possessed" have a vested interest in order to either deny their mental illness or claim to be non-responsible for actions done while allegedly possessed.

The media wants a good story to sell.

The publisher wants to sell books.

Want to know who I'd believe? If a legitimate shrink, making money doing basic counseling work said "I need to quit because it isn't mental illness, it is demons, and now I'm going on food stamps."

Them I might believe--after having their head examined!

Y~
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#299861 - 01/20/08 11:56 AM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Seeker Of Wisdom]
Dead Roses Offline


Registered: 01/08/08
Posts: 93
Loc: Zagreb, Croatia
What a great hypothesis! Bravo. I'm impressed.

Slava Satani!
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#299869 - 01/20/08 12:26 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Callier Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/30/06
Posts: 2198
 Originally Posted By: Dammarval
Can someone who is a CoS member share with me what is your view of it in regards to the philosophies of the Church?


What are your views regarding exorcisms?

And why particularly a member of the CoS has to answer to this?
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#299873 - 01/20/08 12:47 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
spook show Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 356
Loc: under your bed
Demonic possession? Misdiagnosed mental illness.

However, if you're inclined to believe such nonsense, there is a book called 'Hostage to the Devil', written by Malachi Martin that you might find interesting.
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#299880 - 01/20/08 01:14 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Callier]
Skully Offline


Registered: 12/05/07
Posts: 7
Loc: London, UK
I'm not an expert in this matter, but believe in a miracle of human body. Most of the time "demonic possesion" could be explained by mental illness or over-active imagination on part of the "recipient". But then, there are cases when they start speaking different languages, changing voice, etc. Strange it may sound, but do we really know human body? Under enormous pressure and stress people do amazing things when defending their offspring or saving themselves in danger. And we only use something like 30% of our brains. What happens with the rest of it? We are exposed to ginormous amount of information that just gets lost in the brains and doesn't resurface in normal sircumstances. You may never be aware what languages you have been exposed to through media and such, but it might just stay at the furtherst corner of your brain. It takes an extraodinary pressure and stress to open up that little door and "release the demon", or something supressed and waiting to get out. Well, that's my opinion. and I won't lose any sleep over it.

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#299881 - 01/20/08 01:27 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Mr Avarice Offline



Registered: 12/04/07
Posts: 991
Loc: Scandinavia
 Quote:

There are many supposed documented cases of demonic possessions and exorcisms all over the world, documenting demon personalities that were able to speak multiple known languages, and seem to have individual characteristics...

Could you perhaps give us some examples then? Everything I've seen on the subject thus far make me doubt that there is any truth to it at all.

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#299884 - 01/20/08 02:06 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Mr Avarice]
Mr. Luthor Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/15/07
Posts: 33
Loc: Ohio
People desperate for attention will fabricate any story that will be listened to.

It just so happens, that a large number of Christian leeches would love to feed on their garbage; Quite possibly, in the hope that they can scare more of the general population into believing in their fairy tale.
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#299885 - 01/20/08 02:09 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11552
Loc: New England, USA
Are there "documented cases"? Yes, meaning somebody wrote down something that they attributed to demonic possession. There are likewise "docmented cases" of kids seeing Santa Claus at the mall.

Do the symptoms of demonic possession actually read much different from treatable medical conditions, such as schizophrenia? Perhaps combined with religious indoctrination, and a bored individual wanting attention and entertainment in their lives? No.

My view as a Satanist? If you can explain something without having to bring in riduclous notions of souls and demons and other metaphysics, then I take the simple solution. I know people like to bullshit themselves because it makes the story more exciting, but self-deceit is one of the Satanic sins.
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#299886 - 01/20/08 02:17 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Skully]
Poetaster Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/20/06
Posts: 2334
Loc: East Coast, USA.
 Quote:
But then, there are cases when they start speaking different languages, changing voice, etc.


And of course, you're assuming that the "possessed" hasn't been exposed to casual contact with the language they're speaking while "possessed". I refer you to the work of Sarah Thomason. As for the changing voice, extreme metal vocalists are known for doing ridiculous things with their vocals, it is an industry devoted to the practice.

 Quote:
Strange it may sound, but do we really know human body?


The mountain of research and data accumulated through interdisciplinary scientific methodology would seem to suggest that we do know at least a little bit. And that's likely why many such supposed cases of "possession" are so prevalent in uneducated, third world demographics, because they don't have ready access to the information that might provide them with a proper diagnosis.

 Quote:
Under enormous pressure and stress people do amazing things when defending their offspring or saving themselves in danger.


This is a well known fact, and it has nothing to do with the questionable validity of mystical or spiritual possession.

 Quote:
And we only use something like 30% of our brains.


So if you remove 70% of your brain, you'll function just fine?

This is a myth and I recommend better discretion and research on your part. You should begin here.

Note: If I've misconstrued the intent of this post in any way, I apologize.







Edited by Poetaster (01/20/08 05:47 PM)
Edit Reason: Just noticed that the first link didn't work, so I fixed it.
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- Sam Harris





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#299889 - 01/20/08 02:21 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Skully]
TheNaturalForce Offline
Banned

Registered: 02/28/07
Posts: 511
Loc: The Vibrant Garden
 Originally Posted By: Skully
I'm not an expert in this matter, but believe in a miracle of human body.


I am not fully sure what you mean by "miracle of human body" but I can agree that us humans are capable of extraordinary feats that can be seen as 'magical' or 'miraculous'. Only because we haven't the ability to study or even detect the processes and mechanics of how these feats are accomplished. Without that data it may not be possible to fully accept certain occurrences as believable or based in fact or reality.

 Originally Posted By: skully
But then, there are cases when they start speaking different languages, changing voice, etc.


Speaking multiple languages is a common skill. Changing the tone of ones voice is not too difficult a task either. From a skeptical standpoint this is not concrete evidence of a supernatural event as it can be done by millions, possibly billions of people.

 Originally Posted By: skully
Under enormous pressure and stress people do amazing things when defending their offspring or saving themselves in danger.


Yes, the body stores many chemicals inside the brain and other organs which can be released in times of stress to assist us by boosting reaction time, speed, mobility, sharpening the senses, raising the threshold for pain and moderating blood flow. In the course of our daily lives we are actually using just a mere fraction of the full potential of our physical capacities.

 Originally Posted By: skully
And we only use something like 30% of our brains. What happens with the rest of it?


I'm just musing here but I get the impression that the brain is much like our muscular system in that we are not continually lifting heavy objects just like we are not continually solving complex math equations.

Also, even with our 'advanced' technologies we still know very little about all the functions of the brain and exactly how it works. There may even be processes happening with that other 70% of gray matter that we cannot yet detect.

 Originally Posted By: skully
We are exposed to ginormous amount of information that just gets lost in the brains and doesn't resurface in normal sircumstances.


You may have a point here. Who knows, maybe everything in our lives is completely stored within the brain. In this way every word foreign and domestic that has reached your ears may be stored and ready for repeating at any time. Perhaps it takes a trigger of sorts to unlock this wellspring of recorded speech to allow it to flow effortlessly from ones lips. It's an interesting thought.

 Originally Posted By: skully
You may never be aware what languages you have been exposed to through media and such, but it might just stay at the furtherst corner of your brain.
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#299894 - 01/20/08 02:36 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: TheNaturalForce]
Dead Roses Offline


Registered: 01/08/08
Posts: 93
Loc: Zagreb, Croatia
It seems to me that this can be ascribed to the magic we practice, too. Indeed, we are using those uncounscious 70% while on the peak in the IDC, manifesting the power of strong emotions; doing magic by putting sudden charged quantums of counsciousness into it, which is caused by the above mentioned (respective) trigger(s).

The human brain is an enigma unsolved. A mystery we can, to an extent, explore with and through the use of magic.

But it might be better not to push it too hard, as Dr. LaVey said: ''Most people lack the ability to use a tool without having first to disassemble it and label each of the parts which make it run.''

Slava Satani
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#299905 - 01/20/08 03:18 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Lust Offline


Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 4214
My cock is possessed! It wakes me up in the middle of the night stiff as a board! It spits a thick liguid in the face of those who try to help it! It makes me sometimes do wicked things to it with my hands, that always results in the spitting of the thick liguid! I dumped some Holy water on it, and showed it a picture of Jesus, but again with the thick liguid! How would one account for my possessed cock?
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#299916 - 01/20/08 03:59 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
HellofallHells Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 11/01/05
Posts: 3524
In the documentary, "The Devil: An Unauthorized Biography", they show a Spanish speaking woman being exorcised by an aging Catholic Priest. I always found it odd that the "demon" spoke with the same Spanish accent and the best insult it could hurl was, "You stupid!" ;\)
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#299948 - 01/20/08 05:59 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Bill_M]
Dammarval Offline
Praise Allah

Registered: 01/03/08
Posts: 32
Loc: Los Angeles, CA
Thank you all of you who have responsded to my post. Appreciate that very much...
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Salamu Alaikam!

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#299952 - 01/20/08 06:09 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Philotechnic Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 08/02/07
Posts: 745
Loc: NC, US
 Originally Posted By: Dammarval
Thank you all of you who have responsded to my post. Appreciate that very much...


And...your thoughts?

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#299967 - 01/20/08 06:56 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Callier Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/30/06
Posts: 2198
 Originally Posted By: Dammarval
Thank you all of you who have responsded to my post. Appreciate that very much...


You're a mooch.
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#299986 - 01/20/08 07:49 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Dammarval]
Storm Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 03/30/07
Posts: 567
Loc: West Valley, UT, USA
Certainly, I don't believe that actual "evil dieties" take over one's body and control their actions. However, I believe that that these "possessed" individuals believe it completely. So much so, in fact, that they are able to "become" those demons which they believe inhabit their "souls". And through the guidance of an "exorcist" they are able to rid themselves of these demons.

All this really demonstrates is the terrifying power of the christian religion.

~Storm
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#299988 - 01/20/08 07:52 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Storm]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
This comes the closest to my view on the subject.
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#299990 - 01/20/08 08:07 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Storm]
Lust Offline


Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 4214
I watched a show on Monks, who tattoo vilagers. The tattoo's were of tigers, reptiles, and other mighty animals. I think there were even prayers tattooed along with the animal. Some would go into fits while the tattoo's were being performed. Displaying the actions of the animal being tattooed.

Later on, the tattoed were gathered together outside of the monestary. Where they went into an orgy of possesion! The monks would then perform exorcism. Man is truely the only animal that can lie to himself, and believe it.

HS!
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´┐ŻLove is one of the most intense feelings felt by man; another is hate. Forcing yourself to feel indiscriminate love is very unnatural. If you try to love everyone you only lessen your feelings for those who deserve your love. Repressed hatred can lead to many physical and emotional aliments. By learning to release your hatred towards those who deserve it, you cleanse yourself of these malignant emotions and need not take your pent-up hatred out on your loved ones.´┐Ż
Anton Szandor LaVey, The Satanic Bible

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#300014 - 01/20/08 10:26 PM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Callier]
RandomStranger Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 2770
Loc: Here.
 Originally Posted By: Callier
[quote=Dammarval]
And why particularly a member of the CoS has to answer to this?


Probably because the CoS member perspective is valuable? Valuable enough to start charging people for answers!
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#300092 - 01/21/08 10:09 AM Re: "Demon" Possession & Exorcisms... [Re: Bill_M]
MagisterParadise Offline

CoS Magister

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 3260
Loc: Burlington, VT
 Originally Posted By: Bill_M
There are likewise "docmented cases" of kids seeing Santa Claus at the mall.


I saw Santa Claus at the mall...

Documented!

There is no such thing as demonic possession...

Documented!

Case closed.
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