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#303821 - 02/04/08 06:56 AM Excuses and Quality Discussion
TheNaturalForce Offline
Banned

Registered: 02/28/07
Posts: 511
Loc: The Vibrant Garden
I have noticed many excuses being made for poorly made posts. People that are too tired or drunk to think clearly. Other bumbling rebuttals abound when someone kindly corrects the misinformation or the maligned assumption.

I think some negative exchanges can be avoided if a poster asks themselves some questions.

1 - Is anyone going to read my post?
Why even bother posting if you doubt that you have the attention of intelligent people?

2 - Will my reply further the discussion?
Are you offering information not previously covered in the discussion or a perspective not yet explored?

3 - Am I in a clearly focused and healthy state of mind?
Are there chemical, emotional or psychological influences in play that may distort your unique perspective? Are you cool, calm and collected?

Unfortunately this is all I can think of at this time.

Telling others what to do or what not to do is considered civilian policing, and is against the First Satanic Rule of the Earth. Over time there have been debates on whether or not this rule is applicable to this board since anything that is posted here is subject to ridicule by anyone. Some argued that it should not matter to the Satanist because this code of behavior comes natural.

While discussing something with others I see the experience as a group effort to reach a better understanding of the subject at hand. Each statement, comment or reply takes the group into a further focused and intense observation.

I see it much like taking steps into a dark cave. Everyone has a torch or a flashlight. It is best to work together in the exploration or there might run a risk of getting lost, separated or possibly injured. If you stand around and fight over directions too long the lights might go out and then the discussion is over.

Maybe I'm just whistling in the dark here but I thought some of these points are worth considering.
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#303827 - 02/04/08 08:27 AM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: TheNaturalForce]
Muse Offline

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Registered: 01/19/08
Posts: 586
Loc: In Your Dreams
I concur.
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#303830 - 02/04/08 08:49 AM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: TheNaturalForce]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
 Originally Posted By: HoundDog


Maybe I'm just whistling in the dark here but I thought some of these points are worth considering.



The points you made are worth considering. In fact, you have given a recipe for an exemplary online discussion. I believe a similar post was made in reference to essays.

The fact that relatively few have the ability to understand what you are getting at…and many who do will assume that they are an exception to the rule…is one of the reasons it is likely that few Satanists participate online…in a public forum.

Fortunately, those who have worthwhile things to say already fall under the outline you have described so well. May I add one small caveat? We may need to consider what lengths Satanists would take “group effort”. I am sure that you have heard the expression, “as hard as herding cats”? But, I do see your point.
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#303835 - 02/04/08 09:10 AM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: TheNaturalForce]
RaSc Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/17/07
Posts: 484
Loc: PA
You could break it down like that. However, I tend to think of a drunken or drug-induced idiotic post as clearly meant for the humor section, but it somehow ended up in the discussion section.

The First Satanic Rule definitely applies to the introduction forum. They are introducing themselves to this board. However, once they venture forth into the other forums and post questions... I think you see my meaning. The only obvious difference is the CoS Moderator, which is (or should be) well known as hierarchy responses only.

I can't feel sorry for those people who come to this board who just don't get it. Telling them the "correct" things to say won't help them in the long run. This is obviously a board of Satanists with a common thread - we all hold dear the foundation of Anton LaVey. Beyond that we may not agree on specifics (such as the issue of Magic). That's fine, we don't have to agree, but there is a common frame of mind that we should maintain - that we are ladies and gentlemen. Because, after all this is a public forum.

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#303852 - 02/04/08 10:20 AM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: RaSc]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
RaSc...I feel pretty sure that you will not mind me saying that there is no need to feel sorry for them. I believe that Hound Dog is speaking of things anyone with a modicum of intelligence either knows; or, should be able to figure out on their own. ;\)
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#303862 - 02/04/08 10:48 AM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
RaSc Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/17/07
Posts: 484
Loc: PA
You are right - he didn't specifically say to feel sorry for them. I guess it was the flashlight and cave analogy that ruffled my feathers.

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#303867 - 02/04/08 10:55 AM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: RaSc]
G.F.V. Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 12/31/04
Posts: 1951
Loc: NYC
 Quote:
I can't feel sorry for those people who come to this board who just don't get it. Telling them the "correct" things to say won't help them in the long run.


Great point, RaSc.

One who comes here saying all the right things in the world won't amount to anything if he/she doesn't actually understand Satanism from the start. Anyone could talk the talk but it doesn't mean that they have the Satanic perspective.

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#303873 - 02/04/08 11:20 AM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: TheNaturalForce]
spook show Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 356
Loc: under your bed
 Quote:
Telling others what to do or what not to do is considered civilian policing, and is against the First Satanic Rule of the Earth.


It depends on how you interpret 'civilian policing'.

Yesterday, I told someone on this board they should read one of the Satanic Rules of the Earth. I did not do this as an attempt to 'police' anyone. I did it because I felt that maybe if that person had read it beforehand, they might not have made their original post.

Of course, maybe I was just wasting my time by wrongly assuming that some people here possess a level of intelligence that they really don't.
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#303875 - 02/04/08 11:27 AM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: TheNaturalForce]
Pact_Primeval Offline


Registered: 01/13/08
Posts: 51
Loc: Derby, England
 Originally Posted By: HoundDog
I have noticed many excuses being made for poorly made posts. People that are too tired or drunk to think clearly. Other bumbling rebuttals abound when someone kindly corrects the misinformation or the maligned assumption.

I think some negative exchanges can be avoided if a poster asks themselves some questions.

1 - Is anyone going to read my post?
Why even bother posting if you doubt that you have the attention of intelligent people?

2 - Will my reply further the discussion?
Are you offering information not previously covered in the discussion or a perspective not yet explored?

3 - Am I in a clearly focused and healthy state of mind?
Are there chemical, emotional or psychological influences in play that may distort your unique perspective? Are you cool, calm and collected?

Unfortunately this is all I can think of at this time.


So far so good. You raise interesting ideas, i may even use this thread as a basis to start some of my later topics. If i pass all the checks and fail in the topic however, i have a backup plan below, mostly based on what you said here:

 Originally Posted By: HoundDog
Over time there have been debates on whether or not this rule is applicable to this board since anything that is posted here is subject to ridicule by anyone.



This will take some explaining.

I see no point in ridiculing people as it doesn't achieve anything constructive in my opinion. I'm here for reasons beyond boredom. This might be different for other people on here, which i accept whole-heartedly, but then that's the whole point in being different. Some people like to ridicule, some don't, some are halfway and so on.

I'm always looking for a constructive answer. I've started ignoring the people i don't regard as useful. I don't need to judge them beyond this forum. People are either useful, or useless; they decide by how they speak to me. This may change daily however, or even hourly. They might decide to be a sport and post a decent reply after being obsessively defensive in the wrong area completely, or vice versa. I'm greatful to those that do make positive contributions and I make sure I contribute to their own threads in return, and to those who don't offer constructive feedback: I've started to not bother replying. On the whole I've come to realise that I'm never going to find my utopia In forum form.

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#303878 - 02/04/08 11:50 AM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: TheNaturalForce]
TheDegenerate Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 3567
Loc: Cowtown
Well said, HoundDog.

Two lessons in one in this article, very constructive indeed.

I have been guilty of civilian policing in the past, and it was never intentional. I constantly try to comply to all the rules around here, but sometimes step over that line from the momentum I have gained. Aside from just being a part of Satanism to keep your opinions to yourself, (unless asked.) it is also good courtesy to let the moderators do their jobs; that is why they have an "M" beside their names, and I do not.

As for speaking when under influence as an excuse, that boils down to one thing. "Responsibility to the responsible." Excuses such as "I am sick" or "I am drunk" or "I am stoned (and now, banned.)" do not make the reader sympathetic. One thought comes to mind which is, "Why post in the first place?"

You are right. If someone is not in the state of mind to be posting, they should not posting. If they are under influence of some kind, or if they are NOT, they should not be using excuses such as this. It is simply a matter of trying to avert the attention, trying to pin the responsibility on something besides themselves, and around here (and in the real world, too) that sort of shit just doesn't fly well.

HS!

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#303974 - 02/04/08 03:59 PM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: Pact_Primeval]
Scion Offline



Registered: 10/15/07
Posts: 753
Loc: London, UK
A good point well made Hounddog, and as others say one could do worse to consider what you say as a base line for posting. Personally the excuse "well I was drunk" cuts as much ice with me as a soap hacksaw, whatever the context. But in terms of posting in this forum, there is a well-implemented edit function that is there for a reason - you can change posts the day after once the booze is out of your system or a good night's sleep has been acquired, so do it!

 Originally Posted By: Pact_Primeval

I see no point in ridiculing people as it doesn't achieve anything constructive in my opinion. I'm here for reasons beyond boredom. This might be different for other people on here, which i accept whole-heartedly, but then that's the whole point in being different. Some people like to ridicule, some don't, some are halfway and so on.


Pact_Primeval, this view is (I think) somewhat naive. If you look at the top of the board you'll see the title of this forum is "Letters to the Devil - where the elite come to play". For some of the elite, play involves ripping to shreds the writings of others; all the moreso when a post begs to be treated in such a way (and there are so, so many of those). You may find such behaviour distasteful and beneath you, but you can't expect everyone else to necessarily hold the same view.

I belong to the "if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything" school of thinking but even I can't resist poking some of the dumber specimens that cross our threshold. In the short time I've been using this forum I've seen fuckwittage of such a degree that it astounds me such people are capable of finding the on button on their computer, let alone typing, yet they find their way here posting all crazy sorts of gibberish that the rest of us have to put up with (until the moderators exorcise them, of course).

Unfortunately, as long this site pulls in morons (which it undeniably does) there will be moron baiting. Some friendly advice is that you do your best to get used to (or at least ignore) it, and realise that this forum is not for the weak of heart or mind.

Me - I wish Hounddog's post was unnecessary and that what he says spoke for itself, but my experience (and I'm sure that of lots of others here) speaks otherwise.


Edited by Scion (02/05/08 03:44 AM)
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#303997 - 02/04/08 05:06 PM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: Scion]
Pact_Primeval Offline


Registered: 01/13/08
Posts: 51
Loc: Derby, England
[/quote=Scion]You may find such behaviour distasteful and beneath you, but you can't expect everyone else to necessarily hold the same view.[/quote]

Nor did i imply it (or attempt to). It's actually my biggest pet peeve that some people do expect others to think like they do, which i can safely say they do not belong on a forum like this if they do think that. It reminds me too much of the Jehova's Witnesses that knock on my lair, asking me if i have ever considered god, and how they react is unmissable... i'm moving away from my point here \:\)

So far i have not seen much evidense of people acting this way while i have enjoyed my time on this forum so it's not a complaint either.

As you said though, i may find it beneath me. I do. I do not find it beneath other people. That's pretty much where it ends, naive or not.

Thanks for your opinion however. I wouldn't be on here if i didn't want it.

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#304008 - 02/04/08 05:46 PM Re: Excuses and Quality Discussion [Re: TheNaturalForce]
Lust Offline


Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 4214
"1 - Is anyone going to read my post?
Why even bother posting if you doubt that you have the attention of intelligent people?

2 - Will my reply further the discussion?
Are you offering information not previously covered in the discussion or a perspective not yet explored?

3 - Am I in a clearly focused and healthy state of mind?
Are there chemical, emotional or psychological influences in play that may distort your unique perspective? Are you cool, calm and collected?

Unfortunately this is all I can think of at this time."

If I might add one.

4 - Should I make this post, even though I have as of yet, to read, and understand any of the easily obtainable Satanic Material? i.e. The Satanic Bible, The Satanic Rituals, The Satanic Witch, The Devil's Notebook, Satan Speaks, The Secret Life of a Satanist. http://www.churchofsatan.com

Great post HoundDog!


HS!
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�Love is one of the most intense feelings felt by man; another is hate. Forcing yourself to feel indiscriminate love is very unnatural. If you try to love everyone you only lessen your feelings for those who deserve your love. Repressed hatred can lead to many physical and emotional aliments. By learning to release your hatred towards those who deserve it, you cleanse yourself of these malignant emotions and need not take your pent-up hatred out on your loved ones.�
Anton Szandor LaVey, The Satanic Bible

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