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#310381 - 02/28/08 02:58 PM Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
So there's all sorts of under-frost and polar ice caps melting. Tons of methane gas getting ready to be released and/or being released. The evidence is clearly overwhelming. This problem is growing at an accelerated rate and the here and now may be affected for all of us within a few decades. I was just curious to hear the opinions and ideas of those concerned. I've just turned 22 last night and hope to live a good bit longer. I'd like to live in an environment where I don't get cooked alive by stepping outside. I realize the issue is kind of old but lets face it, it's still here. I just flipped on the TV out of boredom and I'm the kinda person that would turn on the History channel or Discovery. So there you have it. \:\)


Edited by FalloutGod (02/28/08 03:00 PM)

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#310386 - 02/28/08 03:09 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Quatermass Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 67
Loc: England
Yes, this latest end-of-the-world cult seems to be catching on, doesn't it?

It's probably because it gets so much attention on television. I don't own a television, so I'm generally unaffected by global warming, thankfully.

Let me know if they set a date for the climate apocalypse, I shalln't see it on the news.
_________________________
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism, while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
[William Ralph Inge, "Outspoken Essays," 1919]

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#310390 - 02/28/08 03:15 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Quatermass]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
All the scientific arguments for rapid climate change are proving valid. Is there some logical way you can explain the sudden changes and why they keep occurring more and more dramatically? Why they(changes) are starting to damage housing and roads in places where under-frost is starting to melt at dramatic rates?


Edited by FalloutGod (02/28/08 03:17 PM)

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#310391 - 02/28/08 03:18 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Phineas Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 08/16/06
Posts: 8257
No they are not. This has been discussed at length in the members forum, so I will not engage in any debates here.

Man made global warming is a hoax perpetrated by left wing politics.

I suggest you conduct an internet search under "debunking global warming".

Stop drinking the Koolaid.
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"I'm fascinated with how primitive the human mind still is. It can be misdirected so easily." John Gaughan


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#310394 - 02/28/08 03:20 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Quatermass]
Never Offline


Registered: 01/08/08
Posts: 187
Loc: Skien, Norway
 Originally Posted By: Quatermass
Let me know if they set a date for the climate apocalypse, I shalln't see it on the news.


Two days before the day after tomorrow.
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Where I lay my head is home

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#310396 - 02/28/08 03:26 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Direktor Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/12/08
Posts: 499
Why worry? Past civilizations throughout the existence of the world have gone through global climate changes to some extent. Is this one? Perhaps - I don't think so, but perhaps. I'm not so worried about saving the here and now, rather than just enjoying it. It reminds me of a scene in Herzog's Nosferatu where an inevitably doomed bunch of townsfolk celebrate life and each other's company, all the while feasting among rats and stricken with the plague. It's rather quite moving. ;\)
_________________________
"A complete education in Satanic philosophy is available at your local video store."
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"I have studied many philosophers and many cats. The wisdom of cats is infinitely superior."
-Hippolyte Taine



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#310397 - 02/28/08 03:26 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Phineas]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
Granted it may not be man made, but surly all these researchers and scientists can't be full of hot air. The have proven to me at least as much as there is visible change over time that has not been there before. I don't need proof that the change is man made or not. When there is evidence of change that could effect me negatively. Instead is there proof that this evidence I've been reading and hearing about is false? I seem to be very hard pressed to believe it is when I talk to people who have seen the changes first hand. Versus those who sit at home and in their minds imagine it does not exist.

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#310398 - 02/28/08 03:28 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Quatermass Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/07
Posts: 67
Loc: England
Sorry, I'm with Magister Phineas on this, so you'll have to do your own homework.

If you're not too busy recycling paper or something equally pointless. ;\)
_________________________
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism, while the wolf remains of a different opinion."
[William Ralph Inge, "Outspoken Essays," 1919]

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#310400 - 02/28/08 03:29 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Phineas]
SHIGALYOV Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/10/08
Posts: 141
Loc: Antarctica
I agree on the part that this is a hoax. I actually discussed this with my grandmother, and she said this has been a topic that has been coming and going since the war (WW2). They always need a new fear-inducing "terror/enemy" to keep the public in check and their minds off the real problems.

HS!

E.
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#310401 - 02/28/08 03:31 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
JayLucif Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 11/09/02
Posts: 1705
Loc: Helheim
Regardless how the climate may or may not change I will survive with all my might and ability.
Also it is not the under frost, but is actually called the permafrost.
What evidence regarding Global warming? Most information is based on twisted data, and political tactics for votes.
Now if one is to look at say localized climate change is more related to how large the human population currently is. There is a self correcting ability here for nature to fix itself due to ignorant Humans who fail to pay attention. Massive human disease and starvation as ugly as it seems, fixes the human over breeding problems that cause all these "environmental worries" in the first place.

This world has had massive extinction kill offs, volcanoes that have altered the world's weather, as well as massive asteroids miles across slamming into the earth, life still finds a way to stay alive and continue after the skies clear.

Relax you are alive today right? If so then worry about living today as if it was your last, and then move onto the next day. Why worry about supposed events that even most scientists have no idea what the real outcomes will be in the end. Might as well open up the Xian bible to Revelations and worry over supposed what ifs?

As far as the polar ice caps melting, well this has been going on for millions of years melting, freezing, melting, freezing. Way it is. Just be smart enough to move closer inland when "water seeks it's own level".


Edited by JayLucif (02/28/08 03:35 PM)
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Freedom, baby is never having to say you're sorry. Guilt is like a bag of fuckin' bricks. All ya gotta do is set it down. John Milton - The Devil's Advocate!

I'm gonna pull the whole thing down. I'm gonna bring the whole fuckin' diseased, corrupt temple down on your head. It's gonna be biblical. Clyde Shelton - Law Abiding Citizen!


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#310402 - 02/28/08 03:34 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Quatermass]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
 Originally Posted By: Quatermass

If you're not too busy recycling paper or something equally pointless. ;\)


I only did that in 6th grade for some school fund raiser. I haven't recycled anything in ages. In fact I almost got in a fight with someone who got mad because my throw didn't make the trash can. I didn't mind discarding my garbage properly but I did mind them getting in my face. How was I suppose to know they'd get their panties in a bunch because a non-biodegradable container fell on mother earth? Green peace people are crazy, this guy literally tried to punch me.

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#310407 - 02/28/08 03:44 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: JayLucif]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
Well you and including everyone else has a good point about enjoying the here and now. Awareness never hurt anyone, in fact I find being aware of circumstances can help in the long run. Right? I'm still enjoying life but I'm not going to pretend that things are not going a bit sour in nature.

EDIT: Thanks for the correction by the way. I find the term permafrost is a bit misleading. :P


Edited by FalloutGod (02/28/08 03:45 PM)

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#310411 - 02/28/08 03:57 PM Dont worry yet... [Re: FalloutGod]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3968
Loc: The Deep South
Most of the arguments about global warming and the science-fiction style disasters shown in movies can be debunked with only two words:

Ice Floats.

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You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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#310412 - 02/28/08 04:00 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
JayLucif Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 11/09/02
Posts: 1705
Loc: Helheim
 Originally Posted By: FalloutGod
Right? I'm still enjoying life but I'm not going to pretend that things are not going a bit sour in nature.


Sweet or Sour regarding nature who knows? These things matter not to me, the smart and strong will survive the dumb and weak will die off as it has always been, even if the worlds weather should really go south as the fear mongers keep screaming about.
All that matters for me is my drive to live and exist, other than that I will keep marching forward. Unless you can influence the subilities of the entire universe, and control every action of every Human you have very little control over what may or may not happen or even say on how anything will come out in the end. Why worry about what can not be really controlled? The worlds weather has always been a violent and sometimes deadly force, welcome to life and living under natural selection. If Humanity faces extinction so be it, that is the way nature works. Though I will not lose any sleep over it. Kind of like worrying about the sun burning out, what is the point?
_________________________
------------------------------------------------------------

Freedom, baby is never having to say you're sorry. Guilt is like a bag of fuckin' bricks. All ya gotta do is set it down. John Milton - The Devil's Advocate!

I'm gonna pull the whole thing down. I'm gonna bring the whole fuckin' diseased, corrupt temple down on your head. It's gonna be biblical. Clyde Shelton - Law Abiding Citizen!


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#310415 - 02/28/08 04:08 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: JayLucif]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
 Originally Posted By: JayLucif
Kind of like worrying about the sun burning out, what is the point?


*Hides his "In case of Zombie Attack" kit*(sarcasm, I don't really have one) Uh, no point. I just like to be prepared for anything that's coming, that's all. So when the probability of something occurring increases I look over my options. Better safe than sorry right? Not that I'd go stock pile a silo or something like some guy did during the Y2k scare. Nah, a well maintained rifle and some rounds do nicely for most disasters. XD

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#310424 - 02/28/08 04:44 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Chess Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/09/02
Posts: 1473
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
Humans are a dirty species. We've upset a lot of very old balances, just as a side effect of doing our thing on this planet.

But this is nothing new.

Humans have hunted many other species to extinction. We've created deserts and slashed forests. We've transplanted species halfway across the world only to see them get out of control and throw a monkey wrench into existing ecosystems. We've diverted and reversed rivers and are in the process of destroying an inland sea. We've created anoxic "dead zones" in the oceans.

And yet, here we still are.

Yes, we're pumping out greenhouse gases at a prodigious rate. Opinions differ on what exactly the ultimate consequences of this will be, but even in the very worst case they won't be the End Of The World. It might prove a very expensive nuisance. It might require heroic engineering works to mitigate the damage. Or it might prove to be a wet firecracker. But we'll adapt to the new situation, whatever it might be, and deal with it. Just like we've been doing for thousands of years.

That's what we do best. We're humans.

-Chess

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#310429 - 02/28/08 05:04 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Chess]
reprobate Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 7140
Loc: Canada
With due respect, good sir, the issue is not exactly whether this is the end of the world, or whether it threatens the end of our species (in the worst-case forecasts) - but the end of the world as we know it, and the inauguration of a new period of want that threatens individuals. The biggest changes will have to do with food and service prices, infrastructure collapse, political instability, human migrations, and incidence of violence.

No doubt many Satanists pride themselves on their power and resourcefulness, and their ability to weather the worst unscathed. Surely a cataclysm is a thinning of the herd, it favors the strong and destroys the weak. Students of history, eg. of the European Dark Age, or of the collapse of some pre-Columbian civilizations (which may have also been environmental), will snicker at this view. Or students of politics: One need only ask: When the shit hits the fan, who will be killing whom to get what? and how will they be doing it?

As in all things: Do what you must, then do what you can, and resolve yourself to the fact that, thanks to your limits and shortcomings, you will probably wind up dead in the end anyway, or worse.
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reprobate

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#310432 - 02/28/08 05:26 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
RandomStranger Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 2770
Loc: Here.
I fear you have been "cargo culted".
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#310434 - 02/28/08 05:32 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: RandomStranger]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
I have? Um what exactlly do you mean by that?

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#310435 - 02/28/08 05:34 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Poetaster Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/20/06
Posts: 2333
Loc: East Coast, USA.
Get mad, get loud, get moving...only problem is, who are you going to get mad at and, what can you do about it?

Cycles happen, that can't be helped.

It's important to note that what climate change activists cite as proximate causes of Global Warming, chief among them being the greenhouse gas C02, realistically speaking, are logistically impossible to mitigate in a democratic fashion. It would require strong-arm tactics to seriously consider implementing many of their proposed policy overhauls and absolute changes. As a species we have grown dependent upon the things which might* spell our eventual demise. That's just a fact jack and, you only need to consider China to understand how ineffectual (I think impossible) any one of the proposed solutions could be.

So if you want to recycle, buy a hybrid and place hundreds of solar panels in your back yard, be my guest, but don't seriously believe that you're making a difference.

*I place emphasis on "might" because it is hardly an inevitability that we are orchestrating any such destruction.
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"People who harbor strong convictions without evidence belong at the margins of our societies, not in our halls of power. The only thing we should respect in a person’s faith is his desire for a better life in this world; we need never have respected his certainty that one awaits him in the next."

- Sam Harris





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#310438 - 02/28/08 05:42 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Poetaster]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
You have a valid point and recycling or getting mad over it wasn't on my to do list or prerogative.

There's just one thing.

Apathy can be deadlier to a human more than any disaster, man made or not.


Edited by FalloutGod (02/28/08 05:48 PM)

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#310439 - 02/28/08 05:45 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
reprobate Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 7140
Loc: Canada
This topic has been pulled at by so many political agendas, Left and Right, that it's not worth talking about at all unless you're willing to dig into the details. But, as a political topic, that would not be appropriate for the Upstairs forums.

So, I will say this much, and bow out.

There are MANY distinct issues here that should be distinguished. Here are four, just to give an example - this is not meant to be exhaustive.

1) Is dangerous global warming occurring?
The consensus of the scientific community seems to be that yes, it is.

2) Is global warming caused by human actions?
The consensus seems to support the view that it probably is, but that the data is not strictly conclusive.

3) Is there anything that we can do to mitigate or reverse the effects of global warming?
As far as I've ever heard, there is NO consensus on this.

4) What economic or regulatory policies would accomplish this? or, if it's not possible to mitigate the climatic effects, what policies would help us best deal with the consequences of global warming?
This is the part of this debate that's political, properly speaking.


Edited by reprobate (02/28/08 05:46 PM)
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reprobate

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#310443 - 02/28/08 05:58 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: reprobate]
Chess Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/09/02
Posts: 1473
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
 Quote:
With due respect, good sir, the issue is not exactly whether this is the end of the world, or whether it threatens the end of our species (in the worst-case forecasts) - but the end of the world as we know it, and the inauguration of a new period of want that threatens individuals. The biggest changes will have to do with food and service prices, infrastructure collapse, political instability, human migrations, and incidence of violence.


An excellent point. But I think it boils down even further: ceasing to emit industrial carbon (that is, turning off the tap on things like oil and coal) would cause far greater human suffering than even the worst-case climate change scenario that's been offered.

But once nuclear fusion finally becomes practical as an energy source, things will change. There are plenty of benefits to a fusion economy over an oil one, and the whole "no more carbon emissions" thing is just a nice little extra.

-Chess

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#310454 - 02/28/08 06:16 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Chess]
reprobate Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 7140
Loc: Canada
I have a friend who is well-informed on this matter from the perspective of Peak Oil activists, and he suggested that existing and foreseeable nuclear technology can help offset some of the effects of an oil-poor economy, BUT that nuclear technology can't come anywhere near the yield of oil in terms of a measure called "energy return on energy invested" (ie., net energy output). The upshot of this is that the conversion to an oil-poor (or at least, oil-independent) economy will require most people to adapt to a standard of living with lower consumption.

I'd have to learn more about the details before I was willing to buy into this claim, but it's troubling to hear, anyway.


Edited by reprobate (02/28/08 06:16 PM)
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#310475 - 02/28/08 07:17 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: reprobate]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12982
Loc: The Solid State
Fallout, do a forums search on global warming. I'm a bit bored with the topic at this point, but you'll find some of my original comments, and some earlier discussions.

Oh, and just a random musing, unfortunately, it looks like corn ethanol might end up causing as many problems as it purports to solve, by driving up corn prices, and wheat prices as well. Ah, but ethanol from algae shows promise, last I read...

Algae and fungi are both extremely cool, in case people didn't know ;).
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#310547 - 02/28/08 10:17 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Responsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12494
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
 Quote:
Granted it may not be man made, but surly all these researchers and scientists can't be full of hot air.


Why not?

It has happened before.

However I applaud your concern to determine if any short term changes will impact you.

Excellent and well-placed concern!

So that actually narrows what you wish to determine.

You could begin with what the projections are for temperatures according to the most frantic "scientists" out there and ask yourself if that would make life impossible for you or not.

I suspect you will discover the answer is "not" (and by a long shot) but it is best to verify these things yourself.

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#310603 - 02/29/08 03:05 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Trouble_Maker Offline


Registered: 02/29/08
Posts: 11
Loc: Michigan
Is global warming a hoax? Probably not; at least some evidence supports it. Is it played up to cause terror? Likely, given the penchant for doing so by "corporate America". The question is "why are they using global warming to cause consternation in the general american public?" It is my belief that it is another distraction tactic.

Remember when everyone wanted to know why the president went after Bin Laden, then jumped into Iraq and failed to come up with WoMD? What did Bush do? He made a bold and controversial statement about a hot topic: Gay Marriage.

I think that corporate america is trying to use global warming to distract our attention from the real environmental issue; our dwindling fossil fuel supply. The longer they can shift the point of focus from the supply to the effect, the more money they can make before we collectively decide to switch to alternative energy.

If you look at recent events from a non passionate, impersonal perspective, you might find that we (Americans) are being herded into reacting to what is fed to us on the six o clock news.

Global warming, ice caps melting, polar bears becoming homeless, gas emissions, etc ad infinitum. Smoke screen.

I do believe the environment is warming, but so what? In a couple hundred more years it will cool again. In the late 1700's there was a "year without a summer" noted all over the world. Crops devastated, widespread famine. Part of a geothermal cycle? Some believe so. What you believe is up to you. I believe that the industrialization of the world has exacerbated the existing condition, causing the swing to be faster and more pronounced, but nature will right itself after we have no more hydrocarbon conversion.

In a few more centuries we will be a technologically advanced agrarian society, and the sheep will survive. They will be healthier sheep for the hardships they have endured, and us wolves will (or should be) grateful that they survived, for without them, the wolves would feed upon one another.

Us smarter wolves will have prepared our future packs to survive, and carry on our lines. We will guard and nurture our flocks to ensure our own survival. Do not curse the huddlers, for without them, who would we be disdainful of? Who would sow that we may reap? The age coming will belong to us, so accept that global warming will benefit those wise enough to remain elite from the degenerated melee that will ensue from the fall of the industrial civilization.
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#310638 - 02/29/08 08:27 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Trouble_Maker]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3968
Loc: The Deep South
"Corporate America"

Substituting "Satan" as Universal Scapegoat Word since 1995!
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You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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#310640 - 02/29/08 08:46 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
HellofallHells Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 11/01/05
Posts: 3524
I don't know about you but I'm freezing my fuckin' ass off today.
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#310669 - 02/29/08 10:27 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
TheNaturalForce Offline
Banned

Registered: 02/28/07
Posts: 511
Loc: The Vibrant Garden
Happy 22nd.

There is no doubt about the quickening rate of glacier melting. There is still debate among the science community about exactly how much of an effect humans have on the worldwide environment (weather, climate shifts).

I do my best within reason to not trash my immediate environment. There is nothing I can do about the greater portion of the source of pollution, so I don't worry about it.
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#310672 - 02/29/08 10:45 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Trouble_Maker]
JayLucif Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 11/09/02
Posts: 1705
Loc: Helheim
 Originally Posted By: Trouble_Maker
In the late 1700's there was a "year without a summer" noted all over the world. Crops devastated, widespread famine. Part of a geothermal cycle? Some believe so.


Hum not to detract from the started thread but the year without a summer was recorded all over the world in various fashions, that was in the year 1816.

"Historian John D. Post has called this "the last great subsistence crisis in the Western world". It appears to have been caused by a volcanic winter."

The consensus it was the massive explosive eruption of the Volcanic eruption of Mount Tambora. Also several other major Volcanic erputions where active at the time as well,
La Soufrière on Saint Vincent in the Caribbean in 1812,
Mayon in the Philippines in 1814

Also the War of 1812 in North America had also been ragging as well all over the Eastern American/Canadian Seaboard.

"The War of 1812 was fought between the United States of America and the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland and its colonies, including Upper Canada (Ontario), Lower Canada (Quebec), Nova Scotia, Bermuda and Newfoundland."

So agricultural resources where stretched a bit thin by the time 1816 rolled around and also when a devastating environmental natural event happened.

Year Without A Summer

War of 1812

There was also another major Volcano Eruption that effected weather severely in the year 1883 until about 1888.
Just for added emphases on how Volcanic eruptions can effect global climates.

Mount Krakatau

I am keeping my eye on a possible future major Yellowstone Volcano Eruption than anything else right now, even possible depleted Oil reserves, I can walk but I can't breath Volcanic dust all that well. Other volcanic scientists rightly are doing the same thing, keeping an eye on how the inner caldera Yellowstone National Park sits inside off. That baby decides to go off all of North America will be grinding and gnashing of teeth. Early estimates say the massive possible explosion could be many times that of Mount St. Helen's. Just some extra side information to consider when one takes that next travel/hiking trip to a famous Volcano Mountain.


Edited by JayLucif (02/29/08 10:55 AM)
_________________________
------------------------------------------------------------

Freedom, baby is never having to say you're sorry. Guilt is like a bag of fuckin' bricks. All ya gotta do is set it down. John Milton - The Devil's Advocate!

I'm gonna pull the whole thing down. I'm gonna bring the whole fuckin' diseased, corrupt temple down on your head. It's gonna be biblical. Clyde Shelton - Law Abiding Citizen!


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#310673 - 02/29/08 10:49 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Virus9 Offline
CoS Priest

Registered: 08/06/01
Posts: 2108
Loc: Florida
 Quote:
So there's all sorts of under-frost and polar ice caps melting. Tons of methane gas getting ready to be released and/or being released. The evidence is clearly overwhelming. This problem is growing at an accelerated rate and the here and now may be affected for all of us within a few decades.


Even more remarkable is that Earth isn't the only planet this is happening on. There is evidence that our sun is currently experiencing a period of increased activity causing average planetary temperatures to rise throughout the solar system.

That said, I do support some ideas which would lower carbon emissions. Not because of anything pertaining to global warming, but more for reasons pertaining to American national security and other environmental issues.

The focus over the last few years has been on future technologies which would take decades to implement and even longer to make profitable while feasible, profitable current technology has been all but ignored.
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"Recognize the phrase 'national interest' as a synonym for 'self-interest' and you will find no moral obstacle that cannot be removed from the highway of ambition."
-Lewis Lapham

"The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter."
-Winston Churchill

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#310674 - 02/29/08 10:52 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Virus9]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
Interesting, thank you for the input. It appears that more often than not the simple solution is the best way. Though the simple solution can be the hardest to accomplish.

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#310698 - 02/29/08 12:40 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: TrojZyr]
AurEum Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/16/07
Posts: 1158
Loc: Australia
Have you been listening to NPR as well? ;\)
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** former username Ealaiontor **

"The truth is I've never fooled anyone. I've let people fool themselves. They didn't bother to find out who and what I was. Instead they would invent a character for me. I wouldn't argue with them." - Marilyn Monroe

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#310714 - 02/29/08 01:24 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: TheNaturalForce]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
Thank You : )

Your response to the issue is admirable. Though I myself am undecided on it and the proper response. Too many buts and what ifs that obscure the whole picture for me. I'll bide my time and see what comes next, perhaps new studies and research by others will bring more conclusive results.

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#310976 - 03/01/08 11:55 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Night V8 Motor Offline


Registered: 03/01/08
Posts: 6
There are even many sensible, not blind, people on the left who agree that global warming is a hoax. Read the columns of Alexander Cockburn (I believe you can find them online for free). He lays it all out in a no-nonsense. Yes, the global warming scare is a hoax perpetrated by the media. Don't be a media slave!! Rev up that good old 350 small block with no guilt.

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#313135 - 03/09/08 05:24 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Majic Offline


Registered: 04/05/06
Posts: 234
Loc: Sagittarius III
Warm Welcome

 Originally Posted By: FalloutGod
I'll bide my time and see what comes next, perhaps new studies and research by others will bring more conclusive results.

Bide your time? Bide your time?

For every second you "bide your time", another polar bear drowns, the seas rise another ten feet, twenty more species of something or another die and it's all your fault because some scientists, politicians and political action committees said so.

There's no time to think, because it's already too late, and the time to panic is now!

If you don't agree, then you're worse than a Holocaust denier!

After all, this is Science, and Science can never be wrong!

But fear not, because despite the fact that it's already too late, it's not really too late to save the world from your evil, wicked, polluting ways.

Yes, my friend, though there's no hope, there's still hope!

Just send me thousands of dollars (or even better: euros, because alas, it seems the value of the U.S. dollar is yet another casualty of the Global Warming Apocalypse) to pay for your Carbon Credits.™

Purchasing these Carbon Credits™ is the only way to save the world, and it's up to you to Do The Right Thing -- and hurry, lest you spend too much time thinking and not enough time doing.

Once you've given me sufficient money and power, you can rest assured you've done your part to combat Global Warming and can therefore justifiably feel spiritually cleansed, atoned, self-righteous and superior to those ignorant, selfish, contemptible people who don't buy the sacred Carbon Credits™ and therefore don't care about The Environment. (Boo! Hiss!)

Remember: The Future Is In Your Hands, But Only Carbon Credits™ Can Save The World.

So don't be a filthy slob! Do the right thing. Do what you know you must!

That is, unless you're a polar bear hater.



Won't somebody please think of the polar bears?

Send Me Money. Save A Polar Bear Today!™
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If you expect humanity to disappoint you, you'll never be disappointed.

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#313142 - 03/09/08 06:30 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Majic]
Morganti Offline


Registered: 09/24/07
Posts: 48
 Quote:
Yes, we're pumping out greenhouse gases at a prodigious rate. Opinions differ on what exactly the ultimate consequences of this will be, but even in the very worst case they won't be the End Of The World.


1. CO2 levels have been up to 10 times higher in the past than they are now.

2. CO2 levels have never affected climate significantly, Ice core records show this. These are the records that Al Gore refers to, he mentions a link between CO2 levels and global warming. Yes there is a link, CO2 levels increase AFTER global warming.

3. The earth through out it's history has gone through climate change. Why is it strange to people that it is happening now?

4. Other planets in our solar system are currently going through climate change at this present time. This is thought to be a result of the suns increase in thermal energy.


Man made global warming is a scam, the solution to the problem of global warming is to tax you for carbon emissions and to restrict your travel. Population control has also been mentioned as a solution to "climate change".

The so called "Father of Modern Climatology" says that man made global warming is absurd. The founder of the Weather Channel is suing Al Gore, saying it is the biggest scam in the world.


The only reason people accept this scam is because the media is complicit in the crime, and when something is repeated over and over again it is considered reality by the herd. If you don't have an understanding of the past, then people can try and manipulate your future. The people behind this scam are quite clever when it comes to propaganda. They have even gone to the point of associating "Saving the Planet" with popular culture. They do this by making T-shirts (at my local globalist store) there are Global Warming t-shirts. They also held that "Live Earth" conference in order to try and associate it with popular culture that the herd likes.


 Quote:
2) Is global warming caused by human actions?
The consensus seems to support the view that it probably is, but that the data is not strictly conclusive.


Over half of the scientists who's names were on the IPCC's report on Climate Change in 2007 did not agree that man made global warming existed. The media will have you believe otherwise, especially any that is owned by Rupert Murdoch. Shows how the media is able to impose a view, and of course it is parroted by people, some of which think they are smart for simply repeating what they have heard from the Television.


Edited by Morganti (03/09/08 06:36 AM)

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#313154 - 03/09/08 08:02 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: FalloutGod]
Risen08 Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/31/08
Posts: 197
It all comes down to....

Pollution sucks, it brings no joy.

My SUV rocks, it brings much joy.


What's a Satanist to do?

BTW.. The report I read said it would take 400 years for 'humans to die off'. I'm willing to take my chances.
_________________________
"With heart and hand I pledge you while I load my gun again, you will never be forgotten or the enemy forgiven, my good comrade..."
(The Satanic Promise, by Anton Szandor LaVey)
It's time to kick some ass!


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#313187 - 03/09/08 10:39 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Risen08]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12982
Loc: The Solid State
Well, you could always plan to get your SUV converted to accept algal ethanol \:\) . (The waaaave of the futurrrrrre!)

Or you could buy the SUV that has the best gas mileage, at least, since with oil at $3, many cars become much less fun.
_________________________
"Gentlemen, the verdict is guilty, on all ten counts of first-degree stupidity. The penalty phase will now begin."--Divine, "Pink Flamingos."

"The strong rule the weak, and the cunning rule over all." HS!

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#313200 - 03/09/08 11:14 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: TrojZyr]
Risen08 Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/31/08
Posts: 197
The results of a very unscientific experiment:


I drive 170 miles a day (long highway commute) and buy gas in two different states (New Jersey and Pennsylvania).

Pennsylvania's gas have a higher ethanol percentage (I believe)and some type of scammy winter blend.

New Jersey's gas is about 20 cents a gallon cheaper and I get better gas milage!

I'm not sure of the tax rates.

This whole hybrid, ethanol, biodiesel, piss in the tank thing is a scam. The government doesn't give a rat's ass about the enviroment, they want reveue to subsidize the farmers (conagra) who grow the corn that makes the ethanol.

I'm a nut, right?

Look at how much cornsyrup is in everything we eat.

Ok, back to topic.

If the US would just invade Mexico an set up national oil wells and take what is rightfully ours.........maybe I am a nut


About half of the previous rant is my real opinion, the other half malarkey. It's up to the reader to figure it out.
_________________________
"With heart and hand I pledge you while I load my gun again, you will never be forgotten or the enemy forgiven, my good comrade..."
(The Satanic Promise, by Anton Szandor LaVey)
It's time to kick some ass!


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#313212 - 03/09/08 12:46 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Risen08]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12982
Loc: The Solid State
Corn ethanol would/will likely create a new host of problems, and the clear winners in the end would be ConAgra. You're right on all points there.

But, I said algal ethanol. Algae is something we've got lots of, and can make plenty of, I'd assume. I'm sure it has its cons, too, but I don't yet know what those would be.
_________________________
"Gentlemen, the verdict is guilty, on all ten counts of first-degree stupidity. The penalty phase will now begin."--Divine, "Pink Flamingos."

"The strong rule the weak, and the cunning rule over all." HS!

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#313303 - 03/09/08 06:55 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: TrojZyr]
Risen08 Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/31/08
Posts: 197
Algae, you want me to run my baby seal crushing, polar bear killing, world destroying, planet evicerating esuvee on algae?
Are you daft? I'm a man goddammit, and we only use REAL fuel.


Maybe I'll do a little research.


Thanx
_________________________
"With heart and hand I pledge you while I load my gun again, you will never be forgotten or the enemy forgiven, my good comrade..."
(The Satanic Promise, by Anton Szandor LaVey)
It's time to kick some ass!


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#313387 - 03/09/08 11:07 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Risen08]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12982
Loc: The Solid State
Bwahaha \:\) .

I think algae's still in the early stages yet, but I came across an article about it a few weeks ago, and got quite excited.
_________________________
"Gentlemen, the verdict is guilty, on all ten counts of first-degree stupidity. The penalty phase will now begin."--Divine, "Pink Flamingos."

"The strong rule the weak, and the cunning rule over all." HS!

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#313489 - 03/10/08 09:08 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: TrojZyr]
Morganti Offline


Registered: 09/24/07
Posts: 48
Recycle or go to Hell, warns Vatican

 Quote:
Failing to recycle plastic bags could find you spending eternity in Hell, the Vatican said after drawing up a list of seven deadly sins for our times.

The seven, which include polluting the environment, were announced by Monsignor Gianfranco Girotti, a close ally of the Pope and the head of the Apostolic Penitentiary, one of the Roman Curia's main court.

The "sins of yesteryear" - sloth, envy, gluttony, greed, lust, wrath and pride - have a "rather individualistic dimension", he told the Osservatore Romano, the official Vatican newspaper.

The new seven deadly, or mortal, sins are designed to make worshippers realise that their vices have an effect on others as well.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/earth/main.jhtml?xml=/earth/2008/03/10/eavatican110.xml

I know they are talking about pollution in general, but of course they have to join this scam as well, Anything for control.


Edited by Morganti (03/10/08 09:13 AM)

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#313520 - 03/10/08 10:49 AM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: Morganti]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12982
Loc: The Solid State
And yet, I bet they won't let up on their stance regarding condoms. Overpopulation must not be a sin.

Not that I'm not wholly displeased with this development (except for the part where they start to condemn genetic engineering and the like), mind you, just cynical.
_________________________
"Gentlemen, the verdict is guilty, on all ten counts of first-degree stupidity. The penalty phase will now begin."--Divine, "Pink Flamingos."

"The strong rule the weak, and the cunning rule over all." HS!

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#313590 - 03/10/08 03:37 PM Re: Global Warming and Responsibility to the Reponsible [Re: TrojZyr]
Colonel Kurtz Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 12/09/07
Posts: 192
 Originally Posted By: TrojZyr


Overpopulation must not be a sin.



Not unless you consider it pollution.

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