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#338681 - 07/06/08 06:21 PM Re: Ask Princeton. [Re: Nemo]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
Thanks for clarifying that. I don't think I could have put it better my self. Evidence is important to keep in mind.

However, as you said, you must be careful to what conclusions you come to based on that evidence. As those conclusions will require testing to prove them true. If no evidence is present the conclusion ends up being, for all intensive purposes, false.

If one cannot even test it in the mathematical sense then the conclusion is either bogus or beyond our current scope of understanding.

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#338709 - 07/06/08 09:06 PM Re: "tangible evidence" [Re: Nemo]
Zardex Offline


Registered: 03/12/08
Posts: 310
Would you also say that because Satanism is not faith based religion it would not consider something to be true before considering the source?

Even the evidence doesn't exist simply because a Scientologist seas so for instance?

Who is Dean Radin? What is his relation to Hal Puthoff? What do you know about the people who's presentations you are ready to call evidence?

Anyone can collect a pool of insignificant unrelated pieces of evidence and make claims as to what they mean. Humans as pattern seeking animals will usually believe anything.
_________________________
"Art is not merely an imitation of the reality of nature, but in truth a metaphysical supplement to the reality of nature, placed alongside thereof for its conquest."
Friedrich Nietzsche

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#338712 - 07/06/08 09:31 PM Re: Ask Princeton. [Re: Nemo]
Zardex Offline


Registered: 03/12/08
Posts: 310
Originally Posted By: Nemo
willful ignorance in favor of winning peer approval.


Consider my position Magister. What peer approval?
_________________________
"Art is not merely an imitation of the reality of nature, but in truth a metaphysical supplement to the reality of nature, placed alongside thereof for its conquest."
Friedrich Nietzsche

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#338714 - 07/06/08 10:00 PM Re: Ask Princeton. [Re: Zardex]
FalloutGod Offline
Intellectual Black Hole

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 566
Are you talking about empirical evidence, pertaining to real fields of science(not pseudo-science)? Because evidence is not a subjective issue, it's objective, it is evident. If the evidence presented is false then by all means disregard it. Granted, with evidence you don't actually have any use for it is not really important know how accurate it is. No?


Edited by FalloutGod (07/06/08 10:02 PM)

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#338724 - 07/06/08 11:23 PM Re: Ask Princeton. [Re: FalloutGod]
Zardex Offline


Registered: 03/12/08
Posts: 310
Originally Posted By: FalloutGod
Granted, with evidence you don't actually have any use for it is not really important know how accurate it is. No?

Precisely. When the evidence itself has nothing really to do with the claims made based upon it it is useless to investigate it's accuracy.

And then the other kind of evidence that is simply based on having to trust a Scientologist to have been honest about not having used trickery is just pseudo-science.
_________________________
"Art is not merely an imitation of the reality of nature, but in truth a metaphysical supplement to the reality of nature, placed alongside thereof for its conquest."
Friedrich Nietzsche

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#338806 - 07/07/08 01:22 PM Re: Ask Princeton. [Re: FalloutGod]
Fnord Offline


Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 211
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: FalloutGod
Still, I'd like to see more tangible evidence before I buy into something. I'm not saying I discard it entierly; I just do not depend or function on the unknown in my life. Hubris is bad, but doubt is not. smile Magister Nemo is very insightful with his posts.


Well, this particular topic isn't rooted in life or death though it may or may not shape perceptions. For matters less ethereal I agree with your methodology (ies). In the case of the 'paranormal' I personally approach it with a wide open mind and with the understanding that I will have more questions than answers as, so far, even when science is/has been applied the results are most often inconclusive. It's simply the nature of that particular beast which is probably why serious science mostly disregards the subject.

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#338913 - 07/07/08 10:16 PM That's enough. [Re: Zardex]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12579
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Quote:
What do you know about the people who's presentations you are ready to call evidence?


Ah.

So if the evidence doesn't fit your view of what is possible then it must be a hoax?

We are to assume there is a gargantuan conspiracy when hundreds of scientists and engineers continue to find, produce and publish positive evidence for over more than one hundred years?

Nonsense.

That would make precognition easy to accept by comparison.

With that supposition you can ignore anything you dislike no matter who suggests it or how much evidence is offered.

The last time I ran into that approach was from a Christian door-to-door evangelist.

It was pointless to discuss things with him (he could explain away anything) and I can see that it is also pointless to discuss them with you.

So it's happy trails to you, pardner.

Others may be interested in further discussions with you if they wish, but I always close the door on evangelists who consistently pull this nonsense, and I now close my personal door on you as well for exactly the same reason.

(Now where is that "ignore this user" button anyway?).

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#338916 - 07/07/08 10:26 PM Re: That's enough. [Re: Nemo]
Fnord Offline


Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 211
Loc: Texas
Magister, I do hope that you're not dissuaded from further participation on the thread. I'm certain that I'm not alone in the appreciation of your perspectives herein.

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#338919 - 07/07/08 10:34 PM Re: That's enough. [Re: Fnord]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12579
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
I will reserve further comment for my Volume Two book.

We also have two specific forums downstairs for COS members that deal with related topics.

Membership does have its privileges.

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#338921 - 07/07/08 10:41 PM Re: That's enough. [Re: Nemo]
Fnord Offline


Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 211
Loc: Texas
Fair enough.

That being the case, we shall speak again on the subject quite soon.

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#344040 - 08/05/08 03:01 PM Re: Satanic Perspectives on the Paranormal [Re: Bill_M]
Fnord Offline


Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 211
Loc: Texas
Originally Posted By: Bill_M

If you haven't read it yet, you may want to check out the essay "The Law of the Trapezoid" from The Devil's Notebook. Also the "astrology" section of The Satanic Witch.


I missed thanking you for this reference before. I'm still working through the foundational texts and haven't gotten to those yet. I've added them to my list, though and I do appreciate the suggestion(s).

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#344282 - 08/06/08 12:17 PM Re: Satanic Perspectives on the Paranormal [Re: WolfMoon]
Posthuman Offline


Registered: 07/17/08
Posts: 33
Loc: Seattle
Since this was directed to "all", I'll pipe in.
I do not believe in spirit worlds.

I have had a few experiences with "ghosts", without getting into the details, I have noticed a few elements of the phenomena.


Apparently:

They/it seems to be bound to a location or object familiar to the person in life, the more the person interacted with the object or house, the more they seem to occur.

They exist in timespace

They are subject to entropy, ghosts seem to fade or "die"

They can interact with matter, somewhat.

They seem to be an loosely organized electromagnetic phenomena interlaced with vestigial human emotion, usually "negative".

They can be dispersed (disorganized), or ghost busted.

Or so it seems.





Edited by Posthuman (08/07/08 03:37 PM)
_________________________
"god" was an invention of Satan, to teach us how stupid we are. magic always works, but our expectations are often at odds with reality.

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#360417 - 11/15/08 03:20 PM Science and the Taboo of Psi [Re: Zardex]
ror Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/14/02
Posts: 1613
Loc: DracUR, Kalifornien: Yay Area
Why is a topic of enduring and widespread interest met with such resounding silence in academia?
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=dean+radin&search_type=&aq=f

The difference in responses greatly varies whether one is asked publically or privately.

Does your experience agree with that?

Along the consciousness continuum as charted in the lecture its interesting to see what the neurosciences have difficulty in dealing with:

Creativity
Intuition
Genius
Psi
Mysticism
Mind is correlated but not the brain
Mental Monism (All is mind)

(Eastern sciences of energetic [informational rather than material] subjectivity cover this)


Even at the level of genius, such as Mozart genius there is no response in the neurosciences.

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#360436 - 11/15/08 05:54 PM Re: Science and the Taboo of Psi [Re: ror]
ArtAche86 Offline


Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 380
Loc: Cthulhu's Bowels,Kentucky
It seems that until a method is established for proving (or debunking) such phenomena, the world may never know. There are simply things in nature that we will not be able to explain. We will be able to make theories, but that is about as far as we will go.

As for the replies you will receive on said subject, they will be as varied as the answer to "How many licks does it take to get to the center of the Tootsie-Pop"

There are just too many variables in these events. Is it possible, sure. But I will approach it as a skeptic, even if I myself thought, I had seen something unexplainable.

What was it Anton LaVey said about being Supernormal?
_________________________
You stay classy,Satans!

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#360448 - 11/15/08 07:38 PM Re: Science and the Taboo of Psi [Re: ArtAche86]
WolfMoon Offline


Registered: 04/03/06
Posts: 735
Originally Posted By: hester moffet
There are simply things in nature that we will not be able to explain. We will be able to make theories, but that is about as far as we will go.


I doubt that. We haven't even reached the tip of the iceberg yet. Wait another 50 years or so. What seems mysterious now may be common sense someday.

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