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#357121 - 10/26/08 06:28 AM What if Heaven really exists?
Carbon-Dioxide Offline


Registered: 09/12/08
Posts: 22
In my opinion, I find it a fantasy thing to give hopes for those suffering in this world. But I often wonder and come with this question in my mind and without even realising I ask myself "But what if Heaven is real?". I really wish know your opinions and thoughts about it.

It might sound a simple question but I feel it may have several point of views. Thanks in advance for your time.
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#357128 - 10/26/08 06:55 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Luigi Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 349
Loc: Europe & South America
And what if pink unicorns are real? Or the flying spaghetti monster? Or Tarvu?

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#357129 - 10/26/08 07:17 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Mr Avarice Offline



Registered: 12/04/07
Posts: 991
Loc: Scandinavia
If heaven is real we ain't getting in.

Who would want to spend an eternity with Mormons anyway?

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#357131 - 10/26/08 07:58 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Evil_Eve Offline
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Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
What if Heaven is real...

A better question would be this:

WHO CARES? I don't care if there is some big Ju Ju in the sky. I simply don't give a good god damned. Go with God. sick

Quote:
what if pink unicorns are real?


OK, that cracked Me up. Thank you. I really needed to laugh today. jack
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If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

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Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#357134 - 10/26/08 08:09 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Evil_Eve]
Fiat_Creperum Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 10/16/08
Posts: 63
Right on. We can't indulge there so why bother smile

Plus, I can't sing and play the harp anyway...

FC


Originally Posted By: Evil_Eve
What if Heaven is real...

A better question would be this:

WHO CARES? I don't care if there is some big Ju Ju in the sky. I simply don't give a good god damned. Go with God. sick

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#357135 - 10/26/08 08:12 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Evil_Eve]
LanceAlton Offline


Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 116
Loc: Delphi
I haven't asked this question in years. I have had no reason to.

Now that it has actually come up -

I would live My life exactly as I am right now, with only one difference, I would pray to Tarvu and the Flying Spaghetti Monster that I would not end up in heaven, EVER.

wink
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#357137 - 10/26/08 08:21 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
You mean it's not Iowa? grin

Of course heaven is real. If Reese's peanut butter cups are not pure bliss I don't know what is. jack
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#357139 - 10/26/08 08:30 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Shade]
Evil_Eve Offline
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Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Originally Posted By: Shade
You mean it's not Iowa? grin

Of course heaven is real. If Reese's peanut butter cups are not pure bliss I don't know what is. jack


Tee hee!

Yes, Reese's peanut butter cups ARE indeed pure bliss. I have three packages of them in My freezer.

Oh, Pink Unicorn alert:

They found one in Iowa. I just saw it on CNN.
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#357140 - 10/26/08 08:31 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Eibon Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 03/26/07
Posts: 1802
Loc: Delaware
It's all about good company. I'll see you all in Hell. my ex mother-in-law will no doubt go to this happy disaster of a place. So, its puffy clouds, bright light and her OR dinner with the greatest talents and minds the Earth ever saw. yep... Hell it is.

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#357141 - 10/26/08 08:33 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Shade]
LightAngel Offline


Registered: 09/10/05
Posts: 1685
Loc: Denmark
I know what beats peanut butter, but a Lady won't tell in public blush

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#357150 - 10/26/08 08:51 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Sorry...there is no Heaven.
Only Hell: http://www.roadsideamerica.com/tip/2456

*enter demonic laughter here*
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#357151 - 10/26/08 08:52 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: LightAngel]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Originally Posted By: LightAngel
I know what beats peanut butter, but a Lady won't tell in public blush


Thank you!
I was beginning to feel like a perv. grin
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#357153 - 10/26/08 08:59 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
Neuroticax Offline


Registered: 05/29/07
Posts: 82
Loc: Milwaukee, WI
I'll take my heaven in chocolate and orgasm form, thank you. wink
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·«(¯`·._)Neuroticax(¯`·._)»·

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#357155 - 10/26/08 09:01 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Neuroticax]
Evil_Eve Offline
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Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane


I had BETTER see a god damned pink Unicorn down there or I'm going to be PISSED!
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Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#357160 - 10/26/08 09:13 AM If Heaven Were Real [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
It would look like this (sorry...I just can't take it seriously)...

Manditory death to all who cut their grass before 12:00. This rooster doesn't crow until the crack of noon.

Endless brew on tap...and it's good for you.

Kids blast Rachmaninoff form their car stereos instead of that crap...I mean rap.

And last but not least...Jessica Alba booty calls.
Ouch! *punched by Mrs. Rooster*
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#357163 - 10/26/08 09:17 AM Re: If Heaven Were Real [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
LOL!

Oh Roho....how do I love thee? Let Me count the ways......
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Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#357166 - 10/26/08 09:23 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
RaSc Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/17/07
Posts: 484
Loc: PA
Originally Posted By: Carbon-Dioxide
"But what if Heaven is real?". I really wish know your opinions and thoughts about it.


If it is real then we chose wrong. In the end we sided with ourselves instead of something that supposedly created us. It is our intellect which promotes our sense of self. If there is some creator out there, it is a fool for creating something capable of rendering it obsolete. If it is a fool then it is not worthy of worship by those that surpass it. Any punishment or reward would be a poor exchange for playing a game with rules that change with the officiator.

My opinion on heaven (or hell for that matter) is that it is a pathetic control mechanism of fear and represents the worst illogical conundrum of the human imagination.

Life is better spent on enjoyment and pursuit of those things that bring personal fulfillment rather than trying to appease the twisted ideals of people long since dead.

RaSc

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#357171 - 10/26/08 09:36 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: RaSc]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Well, there you go.

I rather like this response. You said it better than I could hope to.

Good show!
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#357173 - 10/26/08 09:48 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
AurEum Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/16/07
Posts: 1158
Loc: Australia
I more of a beach type of gal, so I went to Hell (in Grand Cayman). While there, I couldn't resist sending myself (and quite a few others) a postcard stamped from Hell.
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"The truth is I've never fooled anyone. I've let people fool themselves. They didn't bother to find out who and what I was. Instead they would invent a character for me. I wouldn't argue with them." - Marilyn Monroe

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#357174 - 10/26/08 09:51 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: AurEum]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Ha ha! Note the phone number. 6999.

Oddly enough, My own phone number has 666 in the last four digits.

Oddly enough, My passport has 666 right smack dab in the middle of it.

Man, I need to go to Hell. Looks like fun. I'll send out some postcards too...
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#357177 - 10/26/08 09:56 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Evil_Eve]
AurEum Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/16/07
Posts: 1158
Loc: Australia
LOL! I hadn't noticed the phone number. You can pose with Satan while you're there too. I had a great time and can't wait to go back! Where else can you go to Hell in the morning and swim with stingrays in the afternoon smile


Edited by ealaiontoir (10/26/08 09:56 AM)
_________________________
** former username Ealaiontor **

"The truth is I've never fooled anyone. I've let people fool themselves. They didn't bother to find out who and what I was. Instead they would invent a character for me. I wouldn't argue with them." - Marilyn Monroe

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#357178 - 10/26/08 09:57 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: AurEum]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Hmmmmm ROAD TRIP! I got the airfare.... coopdevil
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#357181 - 10/26/08 10:05 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Evil_Eve]
AurEum Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/16/07
Posts: 1158
Loc: Australia
Hell may not be ready for us! devilchili
_________________________
** former username Ealaiontor **

"The truth is I've never fooled anyone. I've let people fool themselves. They didn't bother to find out who and what I was. Instead they would invent a character for me. I wouldn't argue with them." - Marilyn Monroe

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#357183 - 10/26/08 10:16 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: AurEum]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Meh, We'll turn that Mother upside down.

To Hell with you! wink
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#357185 - 10/26/08 10:26 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Philotechnic Offline

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Registered: 08/02/07
Posts: 745
Loc: NC, US
Heaven is going to the DMV and not having to wait all goddamned afternoon.

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#357188 - 10/26/08 10:57 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Dan_Dread Offline


Registered: 10/08/03
Posts: 523
Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Personally I feel that this sort of 'what if' scenario vastly over credits the christian cosmological position. To lend even enough credit to such a ridiculous meme to postulate this scenario plays right into their hands, in the same way that people who claim to be 'agnostic' do.

But just to play along;If it was all true I would rather be in 'hell' (ie: the absence of gods presence) than worship that egomaniacal child god flat on my face for all eternity, while flying around the universe in that giant borg cube called new Jerusalem. (Yes, this is what the bible ACTUALLY says)

At least the borg get to walk around!


Edited by Dan_Dread (10/26/08 11:01 AM)
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"One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike and yet it is the most precious thing we have." - Albert Einstein --------------------

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#357190 - 10/26/08 11:05 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Evil_Eve]
Mahidevran Offline


Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 6
I sure hope there is Heaven after all!

It will include but won't be limited to: many hot men and women, none of them jealous, lots and lots of tasy food to chew on whenever I feel like it. Few people to annoy me and then again only for diversity purposes. Good music, endless entertainment options and a new video game every week. My list you can go on but you get the idea.

The truth is that contemporary ideas of how the Christian Heaven and Hell work are heavily influenced by apocryphs. I have to admit I don't know the Bible by heart and I might have missed something and while I know a good number of places where they tell you of the prerequisites to enter, I don't remember reading a whole section about Heaven being a garden with cherubs playing the harp, with milk and honey, people singing and praying to god in the middle of the clouds. Dante's famous works played a huge role in how people imagined Hell and Heaven back then and it's been passed down to the new generations. Needless to say all descrpitions of hell include physical pain or discomfort and nothing about how people feel. I've experienced a lot of physical and emotional pain to compare the two and if they think physical is worse, then can go straight to hell.

The Muslim at least have a better idea of what heaven is about, as depicted in the Quran. It lists a lot of delicious food and beautiful virgins. Well, I can relate to that. If there was a theistic heaven, I definitely would want to be in Jannah.
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#357192 - 10/26/08 11:09 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Evil_Eve]
AurEum Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/16/07
Posts: 1158
Loc: Australia
Why thank you! To Hell with you as well! grin
_________________________
** former username Ealaiontor **

"The truth is I've never fooled anyone. I've let people fool themselves. They didn't bother to find out who and what I was. Instead they would invent a character for me. I wouldn't argue with them." - Marilyn Monroe

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#357193 - 10/26/08 11:11 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: AurEum]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Originally Posted By: ealaiontoir
Why thank you! To Hell with you as well! grin


Don't make me hunt up that youtube video!
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"Life is the only race you lose by reaching the end." - M.M.

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#357194 - 10/26/08 11:11 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Mahidevran]
AurEum Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/16/07
Posts: 1158
Loc: Australia
I find it interesting that certain descriptions of Heaven involve sinful behavior. Hmmm .... perhaps sinning is natural after all. smirk
_________________________
** former username Ealaiontor **

"The truth is I've never fooled anyone. I've let people fool themselves. They didn't bother to find out who and what I was. Instead they would invent a character for me. I wouldn't argue with them." - Marilyn Monroe

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#357195 - 10/26/08 11:12 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
_________________________
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http://theepicureandilettante.blogspot.com/

"Life is the only race you lose by reaching the end." - M.M.

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#357196 - 10/26/08 11:13 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
AurEum Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/16/07
Posts: 1158
Loc: Australia
Ok, Ok ... I promise I'll play nice. coopdevil
_________________________
** former username Ealaiontor **

"The truth is I've never fooled anyone. I've let people fool themselves. They didn't bother to find out who and what I was. Instead they would invent a character for me. I wouldn't argue with them." - Marilyn Monroe

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#357198 - 10/26/08 11:30 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
I have it on My webpage....

Best EVER!
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#357201 - 10/26/08 12:18 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Maya Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 04/21/05
Posts: 1447
Loc: New England
Then I'd rather go to Hell, because no one interesting ever went to Heaven.

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#357219 - 10/26/08 01:22 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Lust Offline


Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 4214
Originally Posted By: Carbon-Dioxide
In my opinion, I find it a fantasy thing to give hopes for those suffering in this world.


If someone is suffering, and they can find some emotional comfort by accepting the myth of any given religion then so be it. Fantasy is thinking that one can change the persons in question. Nature has already predetermined.

Originally Posted By: Carbon-Dioxide
But I often wonder and come with this question in my mind and without even realising I ask myself "But what if Heaven is real?". I really wish know your opinions and thoughts about it.


It seems that you are at war with yourself. The notion of an afterlife is taught by man to other men, and accepted as reality by believers. Christianity is obsolete, and the package it came in was discarded a long time a go. When all you can see is the carnal, all the "what ifs" are simply unimportant. This is discussed in The Satanic Bible.

Originally Posted By: Carbon-Dioxide
It might sound a simple question but I feel it may have several point of views. Thanks in advance for your time.


It is a simple question to answer if you have read The Satanic Bible. The point of views that you want to discuss are unimportant too. There is nothing to be gained (outside of joking around) in sitting around thinking about what you would do in a mythological place, be it heaven, or hell. Why not create your own? Right here, right now! You can start by reading The Satanic Bible.

HS!
_________________________
�Love is one of the most intense feelings felt by man; another is hate. Forcing yourself to feel indiscriminate love is very unnatural. If you try to love everyone you only lessen your feelings for those who deserve your love. Repressed hatred can lead to many physical and emotional aliments. By learning to release your hatred towards those who deserve it, you cleanse yourself of these malignant emotions and need not take your pent-up hatred out on your loved ones.�
Anton Szandor LaVey, The Satanic Bible

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#357222 - 10/26/08 01:48 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Citizen Jonesy Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/22/02
Posts: 995
Loc: Palm Springs, California, USA
If there is, who cares? It doesn't affect how I live my life HERE AND NOW.

Since such existence cannot be proven or disproven, the point is moot.

If others want to engage in fantasy, by all means, they have my blessing.
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#357229 - 10/26/08 02:33 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Screamer_Pipe Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 03/17/08
Posts: 186
Loc: In the Shadows
You want to go to the Sky be my guest.There is No heaven.There is no Hell.There is the forces of nature and thats IT.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heaven
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#357232 - 10/26/08 03:05 PM Okay. I'll play. [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Let us suppose that there does exist another part of reality that would match up with what is currently referred to as "Heaven", which I shall consider to be a location for the existence of dead people in some sort of afterlife.

I will set aside what kind of "Heaven" we are discussing due to the seemingly limitless versions being promoted throughout history to include the gloomy afterlife of the ancient Greeks, the Summerland of the Spiritualists, the multiple Bardo states of the Tibetan Buddhists, the seven heavens of many shamanistic religions, the Cube City in the sky fundamentalist Christian version (which has always reminded me of the Borg from Star Trek), etc.

Let's just assume that by "Heaven" we mean some kind of afterlife location in which dead people can continue to exist for a certain period of time (finite or infinite, depending on the version chosen).

Now let's suppose that it is scientifically proven to be real. (Please. All of you who are gagging. Get a grip!)

So how would an extended life - an afterlife - affect the suffering and hope of the world's people, as you now ask?

Not at all.

What?

Not at all??!

Yep.

Please understand that the vast majority of the human population already do believe in an afterlife.

And yet their behavior remains identical with regard to how they live their lives to those fewer in number who do not believe.

You see, your real question I would suggest is how would knowledge of an afterlife change how people would behave.

And beneath that question, you are asking an even deeper question which is how would the ethics of people be different if they possessed a knowledge of an afterlife.

Any set of ethical principles are based on that person's values.

Understand that the only difference between the values of someone who assumes they will live only about 75 years on average (if they stop tailgating cars on the freeways and do not get struck down by disease) and the values of someone who fully expects to continue living after death (Get a grip, people!) is quantity of life not quality of life.

Let's pull away from "Heaven" a moment to make this easier to discuss.

Let us suppose that Aubrey de Grey succeeds with his SENS project and some people become functionally immortal. (Or Michael West at Bio-Time accomplishes the same goal with his approach. Or someone else).

(We substitute extended life on earth for an extended life after death in "Heaven").

Now exactly how will the reality of knowing that you could extend your life as an unending youthful, vigorous human being affect your "suffering in this world"?

Well if your fear of death is your primary source of your "suffering" then having a likely stay of execution would have a very profound and powerful effect on you.

But the simple fact of the matter is that most people do not "suffer" because they fear death. They value death. The often view death as an escape hatch from other "suffering" such as having to work at a job, having physical ailments, having a lousy love life, irritating in-laws or neighbors, and overall seeing life as a zero sum game that they are always losing.

You can personally check this out to your heart's content by simply asking people a question: "If you could physically live forever, healthy and youthful, would you want to?"

If you ask this question I assure you that over 99% of the people you ask will tell you "NO!"

Check it for yourself.

Then think about what this means.

In my humble opinion it simply points to the fact that most people hate their lives.

Another simple test of this is to stand on a bridge over a busy freeway on Monday morning during rush hour. Count the number of happy, smiling faces you see ...if you see any at all.

So if an extended life were offered to these people I would suggest that at this point in history most of them would turn it down.

Now back to "Heaven".

If "Heaven" is a place where you can extend your life, obviously most people wouldn't really want it anyway unless it was radically different in a positive way from their lives right now.

And here is the stinger.

They do not have the slightest idea as to how it would really need to be different except to say that it would need to be without the problems they have.

They cannot tell you what they want that is different.

They can only tell you what they want to avoid.

They want to avoid working hard, feeling lousy, being lonely, having irritating people around them, on and on.

So to these poor sick people, "Heaven" is the absence of what they do not like - but damned if they know what they do want.

Well, I'll tell you what they want.

In a word.

Happiness.

They want lasting happiness.

But they do not believe that that is possible!

If you doubt me try to find the stories, the plays, the films that depict lasting happiness for the characters in them.

Shakespeare's comedies are where everyone gets married at the end of the play.

Shakespeare's tragedies are where everyone dies after they get married! wink

In fairy tales and ghost stories the third wish is for death.

The examples are endless, historical and cross-cultural.

But the key to happiness is to choose to be happy.

That's it.

Notice what you like and indulge yourself.

If worry stops you from happiness then do something about it if you can and then indulge yourself in what you do like.

Create the habit of happiness.

Then you can stop worrying about "Heaven" and have a Hell of good time whether there is an afterlife or not.

Just my opinion.

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#357233 - 10/26/08 03:07 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Mr. Obsidian Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 3120
Loc: Ohio
"If in the Spring, she whom I love so well
Meet me by some green bank - the truth I tell -
Bringing my thirsty soul a cup of wine,
I want no better Heaven, nor fear a Hell.


The Slaves of Intellect in talk persist;
Die, arguing does this or that exist;
Fools eat dry raisins 'til their souls become
Sour grapes; but wise men on New Wine insist."



(Talbot versing Heron-Allen's literal translation of Khayyám's quatrains.)


Edited by Dale Cooper (10/26/08 03:20 PM)
Edit Reason: relevant addition.
_________________________
~ Mr. Obsidian (JP)

Olio/Etcetera

Flesh and Bones
_______________

“For those who believe in God, most of the big questions are answered. But for those of us who can't readily accept the God formula, the big answers don't remain stone-written. We adjust to new conditions and discoveries. We are pliable. Love need not be a command nor faith a dictum. I am my own god. We are here to unlearn the teachings of the church, state, and our educational system. We are here to drink beer. We are here to kill war. We are here to laugh at the odds and live our lives so well that Death will tremble to take us.”
~ Charles Bukowski


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#357234 - 10/26/08 03:40 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
If death is the only way to verify this answer then you can count me out.
_________________________









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#357245 - 10/26/08 05:09 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Callier Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/30/06
Posts: 2210
Heaven is real because I've been there. coopdevil

That's right. I went there and there was this dude standin' by the gate with pearls all on that shit. He asked me if I had the players VIP card so I gave it to him.

He let me in and there were all these fine ass bitches playing harps and shit. There were all in sexy white lingerie. Man they were BAD! All complexions and sizes. I was like "DAMN! This is where I need to BE!"

So this old ass dude came out of nowhere and said "Hey man. My name is GOD! I run this bitch! Pick anyone of these hos to be with forever."

I said "Huh? Just one? That's a hard choice God. How come I can't have ALL of them?"

Then God said "Nigga! These are MY hos! You can only have ONE!"

So me and God had a beef and it lead me to get kicked out of Heaven. But that didn't stop a pimp. I left and started my own shit called Hell and now I got all of God's hos down here with me and he's been pissed off at me ever since.

So to get me back for that, he sent this one dude name Jesus down to stop people from coming down to my place because that's where all the bitches is. Jesus ain't got game because he want people to obey him and all that shit but I just want people to have fun and come down here and party.

So Jesus made up this lie about my place and said that if they come down here they gonna burn up and all that shit. He just being a playa-hater because God's bitches chose me. Ain't nobody burnin' up down here. The only thang burnin' in this muthafucka is DESIRE! That's the ONLY fire that's goin' on down here!

For that shit that Jesus pulled, I sent some of my homies to get his ass. They beat his ass down and nailed his punk ass up on a cross. Yeah! They killed that fool! That's what he got for fuckin' with me.

But whatever. Haters will be haters. Heaven used to be a cool place but God is fucked up. He wanna control everythang. He don't know that I'M the one controllin' everythang because I ain't tryin' to make people do a goddamn thang! I let people just be themselves so we can have some fuckin' fun.
_________________________
$$$ Get Rich or Die Tryin' $$$

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#357256 - 10/26/08 07:05 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
GCaesarWhiskers Offline


Registered: 01/14/08
Posts: 92
Loc: TN, USA
Carbon-Dioxide,
I would say that "Heaven" depends on your definition
of the term, and what meaning or value you would give
to such a concept or a place.

Magister Nemo gave you a very kind and thorough answer
to your question; I could not possibly add to it.

I can only offer this:
Play the hand which life has dealt you
and make the very most of it,
WHILE YOU ARE HERE!

Just as you are responsible for your survival,
you are also responsible for your own happiness
and finding, creating, or living in your own "Heaven"
(if this is even a worthwhile endeavor).

If you woke up this morning,
if you were able to feed, clothe, and bathe yourself,
then you are experiencing the "Heaven" of those
who cannot do these things for themselves.

Pursue your "Happiness",
and you will know your "Heaven".

"To thine own self be true..."
_________________________
May your fields always be full of food
May your dwelling be warm and dry
May your predators be dead or far away
And may your dominant mate always be happy to see you

Meerkat Blessing



www.vampiretemple.com

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#357287 - 10/27/08 12:13 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
RandomStranger Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 2770
Loc: Here.
Heaven exists: right here; right now. I find it disturbing that death cults convince their followers that heaven is a place that can be entered upon death. They have it totally backwards-- you get there by living and leave it by dying!
_________________________




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#357328 - 10/27/08 09:40 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Descendant Offline


Registered: 07/24/08
Posts: 262
Loc: Inland Empire, Ca
Ummmmmmm.....This is real!

_________________________
"Jealousy is an emotion often found in individuals whose estimation of their own worth exceeds their achievements."- from "The Satanic Scriptures" by Peter H. Gilmore

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#357332 - 10/27/08 10:29 AM Re: If Heaven Were Real [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
Sinister_Motive Offline


Registered: 10/22/08
Posts: 3
Loc: Oregon
If heaven were real I would rather go to hell anyway. Hell is where all my friends will be, so I won't be alone there. Antother reason for this is the fact that heaven will be full of people whom I absolutely despise. The thought of spending eternity with those people is enough to make my blood boil.

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#357337 - 10/27/08 12:33 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: RandomStranger]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Originally Posted By: RandomStranger
Heaven exists: right here; right now. I find it disturbing that death cults convince their followers that heaven is a place that can be entered upon death. They have it totally backwards-- you get there by living and leave it by dying!


Good answer!
_________________________
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/clickToGive/home.faces

http://theepicureandilettante.blogspot.com/

"Life is the only race you lose by reaching the end." - M.M.

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#357373 - 10/27/08 05:46 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: AurEum]
Morrigan Offline


Registered: 10/27/08
Posts: 4
Loc: Va
If you are really commited to what it is that you believe, when those occasional doubts consiously form your inner self should respond immediately with "where the hell did that come from? i know better." and you go on your merry way.
In the literal sense, if heaven really does exist, you weren't going there anyway or you wouldn't be here. In my opinion, it's kind of an obsolete question because it's not applicable.
_________________________
~Mana du Vortes-Aeria Gloris~

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#358041 - 11/02/08 12:08 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Nemo]
AurEum Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/16/07
Posts: 1158
Loc: Australia
Quote:
You can personally check this out to your heart's content by simply asking people a question: "If you could physically live forever, healthy and youthful, would you want to?"

If you ask this question I assure you that over 99% of the people you ask will tell you "NO!"


I have polled people (all different ages, levels of education, socio-economic status) and you were right, the vast majority responded "No." A few responded with a "Maybe." Not a single person said "Yes."

I can understand not wanting to extend one's life when one may be elderly, ailing, and dependent on others. It baffles me to think that most people do not want to extend their lives with the promises of youth and health. This exercise was a jolting reality check, which reminded me that most people's thoughts and outlooks are significantly different than my own. Thank you for the suggestion, it was well worth the time.
_________________________
** former username Ealaiontor **

"The truth is I've never fooled anyone. I've let people fool themselves. They didn't bother to find out who and what I was. Instead they would invent a character for me. I wouldn't argue with them." - Marilyn Monroe

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#358045 - 11/02/08 12:20 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: AurEum]
TheDegenerate Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 3567
Loc: Cowtown
Well, 99 percent of people are, recent studies have shown, stupid idiots.

If 99 percent of people wish death upon themselves, than those statistics clearly reflect that of the "stupid" statistic.

This leads us to the conclusion that 99 percent of people are stupid, and want to die.

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#358069 - 11/02/08 02:25 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: AurEum]
Neuroticax Offline


Registered: 05/29/07
Posts: 82
Loc: Milwaukee, WI
Originally Posted By: ealaiontoir
Not a single person said "Yes."


The first thing that came to my mind was Yes. I think people are scared of watching their loved ones die off and they live on. Provided this wasn't a majority thing and a one time deal with whomever it was being asked and could happen. Most people are afraid to be alone.
_________________________
- Wisdom builds ego, it doesn't destroy it.

- Art is born of the observation and investigation of nature. - Cicero (106 BC - 43 BC)

- The answer to 1984 is 1776.


·«(¯`·._)Neuroticax(¯`·._)»·

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#358072 - 11/02/08 02:42 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Neuroticax]
Dfalls Offline


Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 29
Would you live your life to the fullest if you had all the time of the world? What would you do after a few hundreds of years on this ball of dirt? I don't know.. everything loses the thrill after you've done it some times. And when more time passes, you lose a lot of people you know.

But this is an 'what if' question. It just isn't. So i'll live my life and do my best to live long. :p
_________________________
*We should get rid off all the extremists*

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#358077 - 11/02/08 03:44 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Dfalls]
Zardex Offline


Registered: 03/12/08
Posts: 310
Maybe most people don't feel good about living forever because they feel they just can't make their lives meaningful for such a long amount of time, even if they can't articulate that fear.

People are naturally inclined to prepare for death during their lives, it is our evolutionary task, to push the responsibility of making a difference on to our children and leave a mark in our society through our accomplishments, and thus attain "peace" and become depressed or obsolete when there is nothing more significance we can attain in order to serve the organism by evolving. We build our lives so we can die, and the old can evolve by being replaced by the new.

I guess the step that some of us make is to form an attachment to self improvement and the struggle of life itself so that we don't get bored with it.
_________________________
"Art is not merely an imitation of the reality of nature, but in truth a metaphysical supplement to the reality of nature, placed alongside thereof for its conquest."
Friedrich Nietzsche

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#358084 - 11/02/08 05:05 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Zardex]
Neuroticax Offline


Registered: 05/29/07
Posts: 82
Loc: Milwaukee, WI
I really see it as an opportunity to learn and grow over time. Imagine the history you could be a part of.
_________________________
- Wisdom builds ego, it doesn't destroy it.

- Art is born of the observation and investigation of nature. - Cicero (106 BC - 43 BC)

- The answer to 1984 is 1776.


·«(¯`·._)Neuroticax(¯`·._)»·

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#358214 - 11/03/08 12:32 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: TheDegenerate]
fire_vixen Offline


Registered: 08/31/07
Posts: 90
"If 99 percent of people wish death upon themselves, than those statistics clearly reflect that of the "stupid" statistic."

I asked a few people that I know if they'd want to live forever, and as expected everyone said no, or not sure.
At the same time, I wouldn't consider those people stupid. I mean if they have an unfounded belief in some kind of afterlife while neglecting living life to the fullest here, then maybe it's stupid. But if that's not the case, then I don't know.

What's interesting is that one person who admitted being happy and has plenty of things in life that she appreciates still would not want to live forever. I think some people can see death as peaceful (not necessarily my view), and after all, if death is the end, you wouldn't know you are dead and wouldn't care, so what is the bad in that?

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#358215 - 11/03/08 12:38 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Dfalls]
fire_vixen Offline


Registered: 08/31/07
Posts: 90
"Would you live your life to the fullest if you had all the time of the world? What would you do after a few hundreds of years on this ball of dirt? I don't know.. everything loses the thrill after you've done it some times."

It's what I am leaning towards too. After you've done everything you've wanted, what else would there be to live for?

Eternity is a long long time. Can anyone imagine what it really is like or approximately how long? I certainly can't. So I couldn't even answer the question if I'd want to live forever. I don't even know what it's like or what that would mean.
All that I care about is making life meaningful in the time that I have now.

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#358236 - 11/03/08 04:01 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11565
Loc: New England, USA
Originally Posted By: Carbon-Dioxide
"But what if Heaven is real?".

Then it still begs the questions of who goes there, under what exact conditions, can we even get there in the first place, who or what enforces the trip, the purpose of heaven, whether or not other alternatives realms exist, what they are, what exactly goes on in heaven, is it really desirable, and what are the dead's responsibilities there.

If the existence of "heaven" is at best debatable, then why should any of these other things be any less debatable? You can't even get two different sects of the same religion to agree on all these things.

Originally Posted By: Wolf Landon
Heaven is going to the DMV and not having to wait all goddamned afternoon.

So in other words, it doesn't exist? crazy
_________________________
Reverend Bill M.

http://www.devilsmischief.com: Carnal Comedy Clips, Netherworld Novelty Numbers,
New hour every week. Download the mp3 now!

http://www.aplaceformystuff.org: Tales of Combat Clutter and other Adventures

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#358238 - 11/03/08 04:08 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: fire_vixen]
Warlock Atreus Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 10/27/08
Posts: 61
Loc: Dallas TX
I stopped believing in heaven and hell long before I stopped being a theist. (It *is* a handy tool to keep the masses in line, though.)

That happened when this occurred to me: Line up every human who has ever lived and sort them based upon whatever criteria a god would use to determine who is going to heaven and who is going to hell. It does not matter what the criteria is. Somewhere in that line are two people standing next to each other such that one will go to heaven and the other will go to hell. Those two people will be nearly identical with respect to the criteria used to sort them given the billions of people who have ever lived.

It is impossible to believe that any being - let alone one that is supposedly benevolent - could send those two people to opposite locations for eternity. Even if I suspend that disbelief, any being who could make that discrete choice based upon such a minute difference is not one with whom I would want to spend eternity.

Life is what I make of it. If I think I should have heaven, it is. If I think I should have hell, it is. My god and judge is in me. I get the life I have *NOW* because I believe it is what I should have.

Atreus
_________________________
HS!
Atreus
The better it gets, the better it gets.

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#358276 - 11/03/08 06:28 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: AurEum]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
You are welcome.

Deathism is more popular than any other religion on Earth.

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#358278 - 11/03/08 06:30 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: fire_vixen]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Quote:
and after all, if death is the end, you wouldn't know you are dead and wouldn't care, so what is the bad in that?


And it is very popular to think that way too! smile

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#358281 - 11/03/08 06:32 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Dfalls]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Quote:
everything loses the thrill after you've done it some times.


Yes, that next orgasm is sure to be a bore.zombie

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#358282 - 11/03/08 06:40 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: fire_vixen]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Quote:
After you've done everything you've wanted, what else would there be to live for?


Hunger. Good food. Eat. Enjoy. Repeat.

Thirst. Good drink. Swallow. Enjoy. Repeat.

The Seven Deadly Sins will continue to work for you, guiding you unerringly toward pleasure and away from pain for as long as you live.

Quote:
Can anyone imagine what it really is like or approximately how long?


Easy. It is your next breath. Followed by another. Followed by another.

Not being able to breathe is also easy to imagine and not very desirable!

Deathism. The most popular religion in the world! To be a true deathist you only need to not think about what it really means. wink

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#358285 - 11/03/08 06:53 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Nemo]
Callier Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/30/06
Posts: 2210
Originally Posted By: Nemo


Hunger. Good food. Eat. Enjoy. Repeat.

Thirst. Good drink. Swallow. Enjoy. Repeat.


Sex. Good piece of ass. Tap. Enjoy. Repeat and repeat that shit and tap that ass again and again man! laugh
_________________________
$$$ Get Rich or Die Tryin' $$$

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#358288 - 11/03/08 07:08 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: fire_vixen]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Originally Posted By: fire_vixen
After you've done everything you've wanted, what else would there be to live for?



Doing it again.

Fortunately, my present project...Operation Jessica Alba...or OJay...is such a long shot, I am guaranteed another century.
_________________________
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/clickToGive/home.faces

http://theepicureandilettante.blogspot.com/

"Life is the only race you lose by reaching the end." - M.M.

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#358318 - 11/04/08 12:38 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Nemo]
Dfalls Offline


Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 29
Quote:
Yes, that next orgasm is sure to be a bore.zombie


Ok, you got me grin
_________________________
*We should get rid off all the extremists*

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#358424 - 11/04/08 03:27 PM Re: If Heaven Were Real [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
PaulDuet Offline


Registered: 11/04/08
Posts: 5
Loc: New Orleans, LA
it's difficult for me to even entertain this topic.. heaven is not real. End of discussion.

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#358426 - 11/04/08 03:31 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Nemo]
fire_vixen Offline


Registered: 08/31/07
Posts: 90
"Hunger. Good food. Eat. Enjoy. Repeat.

Thirst. Good drink. Swallow. Enjoy. Repeat.

The Seven Deadly Sins will continue to work for you, guiding you unerringly toward pleasure and away from pain for as long as you live.
"
That works. smile

"Deathism. The most popular religion in the world! To be a true deathist you only need to not think about what it really means."

Hmm, I am thinking but I am not sure what deathism means. Wanting to die or not wanting to live forever? (I don't consider these the same)
If one lives their life to the fullest I wouldn't consider them to be a deathist regardless of whether or not they want immortality. That is exactly what I am trying to do, as all I can expect of myself is to do the best that I can in the time that I know I have.

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#358461 - 11/04/08 05:41 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
VaH Offline


Registered: 10/02/08
Posts: 42
Loc: Between Random Neuron Firings
I'm happy to inform you all that Heaven is a real place...and it's in Phoenix, AZ, going by the alias of The Heart Attack Grill: Home of the Quadruple Bypass Burger.

It is a magical place where you can order food that will fill you with joy and shorten your overall life-expectancy and is served by waitresses in skimpy nurse uniforms...now seriously, who could ask for more than that?
_________________________

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#358462 - 11/04/08 05:48 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: VaH]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Originally Posted By: VaH
and is served by waitresses in skimpy nurse uniforms...


Now you're speaking my language.
I will not share any other fetish *cough*librarians*cough*
_________________________
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/clickToGive/home.faces

http://theepicureandilettante.blogspot.com/

"Life is the only race you lose by reaching the end." - M.M.

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#358510 - 11/04/08 10:33 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: fire_vixen]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Quote:
Wanting to die or not wanting to live forever?


Just go to a morgue or some funerals.

Talk to the unwilling participants.

That is Choice A.

Choice A is the deathism choice.

Choice B is choosing not to die.

Not dying is just ...not dying.

This is not rocket science.

But it is important.

To you.

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#358511 - 11/04/08 10:34 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Callier]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Yes.

It is difficult to do that if you chose death first.

Really simple stuff.

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#358530 - 11/04/08 11:59 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Nemo]
Jack_Lantern Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/06/05
Posts: 2785
Loc: America
This is all great but the real question is, how do we defeat the unicorns?
_________________________
"If a man empties his purse into his head no one can take it away from him. An investment in knowledge always pays the best interest." -Benjamin Franklin

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#358606 - 11/05/08 09:43 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Jack_Lantern]
Moosnuff Offline



Registered: 02/05/08
Posts: 16
Loc: NY
As I have moved out of first-phase Satanism, I have learned that time spent thinking about "what-ifs", especially if they concern religious ideas that I don't identify with, is time and energy wasted that is better spent pondering something productive.

"Be very careful what you put into your head, for you will never get it out"

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#358657 - 11/05/08 02:43 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Nemo]
Remo razz Offline


Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 68
Loc: Canada
After having read the post of several members, I decided to try your test for myself, Magister. I asked a few persons if, given the choice, they chose eternal life or death.

My co-worker answered without hesitation that he would live forever. He even added that “I will be kicking and screaming when I am on my death bed, I will not go quietly.”

The cleaner that does our offices during the day said that she would like to live forever because she “fears death and the emptiness that will follow”.

Another person said that he would welcome death when it will come because he knows that he will have lived a full life.

There were a lot of people that said that heaven would be a welcome change of pace, some wanted clarifications like: “would it be the same type of life” or “can I make changes…”

All in all it confirms your theory.

I had fun asking this to the people around my work, it was informative.

Thank you Sir.


Edited by Obscure_Forces (11/05/08 02:43 PM)
_________________________
http://www.satannet.com/Remorazz/

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#358680 - 11/05/08 04:18 PM Sour grapes. [Re: Dfalls]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Just as the fox who couldn't reach the grapes declared they were sour and something he "didn't want anyway", most people come up with reasons why living on (even in a healthy and youthful body) is something they "didn't want anyway".

...because life would be boring.

...because everyone you knew would die.

...because life itself is unpleasant.

...because the Bible tells me so. wink

But none of this holds water if we just instead narrow it down to wanting to not die this very instant.

Suddenly everyone becomes an optimist and just maybe those grapes might not be that sour after all! grin

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#358764 - 11/05/08 10:05 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Ebenezer Scrooge Offline


Registered: 11/04/08
Posts: 140
Loc: New England
Originally Posted By: Carbon-Dioxide
In my opinion, I find it a fantasy thing to give hopes for those suffering in this world. But I often wonder and come with this question in my mind and without even realising I ask myself "But what if Heaven is real?". I really wish know your opinions and thoughts about it.

It might sound a simple question but I feel it may have several point of views. Thanks in advance for your time.


Could heaven exist? Yes.

Could Hell exist? Yes.

Could Lucifer and God exist? Yes.

Do I live my life caring if they do? No.

If your going to worry about heaven or hell being real, you might as well just be a Christian.

No one knows for sure if heaven does, or doesn't exist. Satanist are willing to take the risk and believe it doesn't and live for the here in now. What do you have to lose?

Worse comes to worse, if you find yourself being that worried about it, you can always repent on your death bed. I hear God forgives pretty much everyone now a days...except for the gays, he hates them.
_________________________
"If they'd rather die, they had better do it and decrease the surplus population."-Ebenezer Scrooge

“I don't mean to sound bitter,cold,or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.”-Bill Hicks

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#358771 - 11/05/08 10:27 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Ebenezer Scrooge]
TheDegenerate Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 3567
Loc: Cowtown
If there is some kind of all knowing entity that exists out there, it isn't whatever was written in the Bible.

That 2,000 page sleeping pill has been edited more times than you could care to know.

I agree with the sentiment, however, I think it is a bit off. Namely, Satanists don't "believe" anything, one way or another. Being open to a possibility of some super-normal thing existing doesn't require belief one way or the other. Just evidence. So far, God doesn't have a lot of that on his end of the table.

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#358780 - 11/05/08 11:05 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: TheDegenerate]
Ebenezer Scrooge Offline


Registered: 11/04/08
Posts: 140
Loc: New England
Originally Posted By: Phosis
If there is some kind of all knowing entity that exists out there, it isn't whatever was written in the Bible.

That 2,000 page sleeping pill has been edited more times than you could care to know.

I agree with the sentiment, however, I think it is a bit off. Namely, Satanists don't "believe" anything, one way or another. Being open to a possibility of some super-normal thing existing doesn't require belief one way or the other. Just evidence. So far, God doesn't have a lot of that on his end of the table.


Point taken. I guess "believe" was the wrong word.I should have said "Satanist are willing to take a risk, based on the evidence, that God nor heaven exist"

I'll keep this in mind for the future.
_________________________
"If they'd rather die, they had better do it and decrease the surplus population."-Ebenezer Scrooge

“I don't mean to sound bitter,cold,or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.”-Bill Hicks

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#358781 - 11/05/08 11:09 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: TheDegenerate]
gremlinera Offline
Banned Spitter

Registered: 10/30/08
Posts: 1
though i learned satanists seek evidence not excepting to enter heaven or hell

spit on uou if you dont want the thred to continue

this is my best evidence i have obtained to keep the thred going

Seems to me sensitivity requires scripture.

1) ok im made in the image of god if he is logical spock wise or other then thus i am made thus the same way. though we have to understand not one man is rightious so he holds back part of his image to distant himself from us to allow room for exploration of beliefe and faith. the expansion between the self image and faith and beliefe is infite the alpaha you towards the rightious omega him. this i believe in faith.

2) gods infinite expansion of spirtuality and reality of space and time is my beliefe when scripture atrubutes that god is all things big and small he is the alpha and omega.

3) material goods can be mother natures or gods. this is my beliefe. scripture suggests god baught and paid for our body soul and spirit so treat it as a temple of gods. so to say our bodies arvived from ashes and end in ashes so the same then goes with material goods. though possesion is 9/10 of the law the 1/10 i presume is reality is that one tenth is awarnesses expansion to obtain religion/science thus lifes chain circle of obtainable life and material goods. though god can lend that which is of the 9/10 to the point of scripture suggesting for jesus to bow down to satan to have the world.

4) with beliefe there stems logic such things as stepping stones. this is because earth is curcular however the universe einstein suggests is simiar to being a flat stepping stone of worlds with the sun being so heavy to balance the universe straight. expanding the reflection of light while extracting the expansion of electric energy (also known as radiation or ultra violet light both spiritual and in reality) some might suggest asking the holy spirit questions of concern. these questions are based on prair the effect this has is a curcular motion of seperated answers and still remaing questions. the still remaing questions causes expansion i guess in space mabby the sun. this expansion of absolute is the alpha and omega god himself in this universe and expanded on to others with seperation of the whole curcular motion above in motion, causing energy to form matter in hope for answered future praires.

5) added beliefe material goods have a universal identity governing each item in reality causing a canection creating a image of the universe upon items individually thus free hopeful awarness of the will of purpose. this is how freewill proclames its purpose sort of on humans animals and material goods. material goods are awareness in a degree procsess that of acceptence sort of. as a house plant as well as all material things have a purpose living things can nurture that purpose threw love for so short of a word. thus causing a house plant to grow better. this however might be because you remember to water and take care of it more. leading me to believe reality has a subconcience on a claravoient level in order to comunicate because of slavery isolation. i also portain all related material goods are spiritually seperated and the exceptence of connecting to one another is aload. for many cries in the wilderness is heard better then one.

as illogical as god might be seen here i have obtained a satisfieng inner strength of logical beliefe that satisfies my craving to see godd as logical all knowing all caring being the alpha and omega and showing his purpose in my life. my logical beliefe shows me integent illogical design upon the proof that god exists. i turn the illogical god into loving logic threw faith. thus meating up with such things as rightiousness.

know argue god doesnt exist and argue he is illogical. or show as i did a beliefe structure in honour of god.

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#358782 - 11/05/08 11:13 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: gremlinera]
TheDegenerate Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 3567
Loc: Cowtown
Why is it that believers who stumble upon this forum always have the worst grammar, and are the most poorly educated?

I'm sensing a pattern here...

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#358783 - 11/05/08 11:16 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: gremlinera]
foreverlearning Offline


Registered: 02/12/08
Posts: 104
...
...
...
...
...what?

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#358784 - 11/05/08 11:17 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: TheDegenerate]
foreverlearning Offline


Registered: 02/12/08
Posts: 104
Funny how it always seems to be that the least educated people you run into are the followers of "god"...

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#358785 - 11/05/08 11:24 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: gremlinera]
Ebenezer Scrooge Offline


Registered: 11/04/08
Posts: 140
Loc: New England
Originally Posted By: gremlinera
though i learned satanists seek evidence not excepting to enter heaven or hell

spit on uou if you dont want the thred to continue

this is my best evidence i have obtained to keep the thred going

Seems to me sensitivity requires scripture.

1) ok im made in the image of god if he is logical spock wise or other then thus i am made thus the same way. though we have to understand not one man is rightious so he holds back part of his image to distant himself from us to allow room for exploration of beliefe and faith. the expansion between the self image and faith and beliefe is infite the alpaha you towards the rightious omega him. this i believe in faith.

2) gods infinite expansion of spirtuality and reality of space and time is my beliefe when scripture atrubutes that god is all things big and small he is the alpha and omega.

3) material goods can be mother natures or gods. this is my beliefe. scripture suggests god baught and paid for our body soul and spirit so treat it as a temple of gods. so to say our bodies arvived from ashes and end in ashes so the same then goes with material goods. though possesion is 9/10 of the law the 1/10 i presume is reality is that one tenth is awarnesses expansion to obtain religion/science thus lifes chain circle of obtainable life and material goods. though god can lend that which is of the 9/10 to the point of scripture suggesting for jesus to bow down to satan to have the world.

4) with beliefe there stems logic such things as stepping stones. this is because earth is curcular however the universe einstein suggests is simiar to being a flat stepping stone of worlds with the sun being so heavy to balance the universe straight. expanding the reflection of light while extracting the expansion of electric energy (also known as radiation or ultra violet light both spiritual and in reality) some might suggest asking the holy spirit questions of concern. these questions are based on prair the effect this has is a curcular motion of seperated answers and still remaing questions. the still remaing questions causes expansion i guess in space mabby the sun. this expansion of absolute is the alpha and omega god himself in this universe and expanded on to others with seperation of the whole curcular motion above in motion, causing energy to form matter in hope for answered future praires.

5) added beliefe material goods have a universal identity governing each item in reality causing a canection creating a image of the universe upon items individually thus free hopeful awarness of the will of purpose. this is how freewill proclames its purpose sort of on humans animals and material goods. material goods are awareness in a degree procsess that of acceptence sort of. as a house plant as well as all material things have a purpose living things can nurture that purpose threw love for so short of a word. thus causing a house plant to grow better. this however might be because you remember to water and take care of it more. leading me to believe reality has a subconcience on a claravoient level in order to comunicate because of slavery isolation. i also portain all related material goods are spiritually seperated and the exceptence of connecting to one another is aload. for many cries in the wilderness is heard better then one.

as illogical as god might be seen here i have obtained a satisfieng inner strength of logical beliefe that satisfies my craving to see godd as logical all knowing all caring being the alpha and omega and showing his purpose in my life. my logical beliefe shows me integent illogical design upon the proof that god exists. i turn the illogical god into loving logic threw faith. thus meating up with such things as rightiousness.

know argue god doesnt exist and argue he is illogical. or show as i did a beliefe structure in honour of god.


I'm sorry, babblefish doesn't translate Christian, so I can't reply.
_________________________
"If they'd rather die, they had better do it and decrease the surplus population."-Ebenezer Scrooge

“I don't mean to sound bitter,cold,or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.”-Bill Hicks

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#358787 - 11/05/08 11:55 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: gremlinera]
Ygraine Offline

CoS Magistra

Registered: 07/11/01
Posts: 2849
Loc: Florida
Quote:
spit on uou if you dont want the thred to continue


A lady never spits.

Y~
_________________________
Magistra, Church of Satan/
Autocrat of the Damned





http://magistrayrainetwo.blogspot.com/

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#358789 - 11/06/08 12:30 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: gremlinera]
ArtAche86 Offline


Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 380
Loc: Cthulhu's Bowels,Kentucky
I'm sorry. I didn't understand a one word you just said.

But (because i'm sure her and the joy luck club are going to be going over this even though she/he/it was banned) consider these facts into evidence:

1.) Adam and Eve are the 1st 2 people on this earth, they bear a child, Cain. Then they have Able. Cain and Able make sacrifices to God one day and God likes Able's better, although it wasn't a blood sacrifice. Cain kills Able. He is marked for shame and sent out into the wilderness...and what does he do? He BEARS A WIFE? Where the hell did she come from?!!!!

2.) The world was destroyed the 1st time by water. Noah and his family were saved having already a based religion, language, and sound intelligence...

Where the hell do the cavemen come into play. Did we de-evolve through sinnish incest?!

3.) If heaven is the same today, tomorrow and forever, and is a place of UNENDING happiness with no sorrow...

How could Satan ever have become jealous, bothered, or deserve anything that befell him?

Consider this amongst yourself...Pretend for a moment you are God? You are the alpha and the omega, you know the beginning and the end...

Why would you make people knowing that they were going to burn in Hell?

And since he knows the beginning and the end...doesn't that mean that we have destinys that must be fulfilled for his alleged purpose? And what is that purpose is a good question?

His own personal masturbation? be it mental or physical?

You should really read "God of The Assholes" by Anton LaVey...

Anyhow...I just wasted so much time on people who most likely won't change. But i'm a ranter anyway on occasion. Its my cross-to-bear LMAOd

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#358799 - 11/06/08 02:27 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: ArtAche86]
Dfalls Offline


Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 29
Trying to convince a christian god doesn't excist is a waste of your time mate.
_________________________
*We should get rid off all the extremists*

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#358814 - 11/06/08 07:27 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Callier]
Ice Claw Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/08
Posts: 151
Dear Mr. Warlock Callier,

I was doing some spying on heaven last night and this is what I have to report back to you.

1. There is only 1 fine bitch in heaven.
2. The rest are a bunch of cross dressing, closeted, christian preachers and evangelists.
3. God likes to rub his 2 inch limp dick on cross dressing, closeted, christian preachers and evangelists.

I had to use the high power scope to get the rest of the information...

4. It appears that God has syphilis, the clap and Herpes. I am not to sure what the fungal/mushroom growths were.

Sincerly,
Dark River

THIS JUST IN:
Moments ago Gods dick fell off and there is much weeping and gnashing of teeth taking place in heaven. This is truly a hellish day for preachers and evangelists.


Edited by Dark River (11/06/08 08:18 AM)
Edit Reason: THIS JUST IN !

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#358891 - 11/06/08 04:10 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Ice Claw]
LanceAlton Offline


Registered: 08/10/07
Posts: 116
Loc: Delphi
Oh My...
_________________________
"Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all."
-Friedrich Nietzsche


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#358939 - 11/06/08 07:29 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
gypsy Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/04/01
Posts: 4749
Loc: Here
Quote:
I find it a fantasy thing to give hopes for those suffering in this world. But I often wonder and come with this question in my mind and without even realising I ask myself "But what if Heaven is real?"


Well if you’re going to discuss biblical myths
Why stop there?

How about a virgins giving birth?

Or this one particularly in these tough economical times: grin

What if we could feed a few thousand people with a couple fish?
_________________________
"All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie."

"Eternal nothingness is fine if you happen to be dressed for it."


Church of Satan

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#358943 - 11/06/08 08:06 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: gypsy]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11565
Loc: New England, USA
Originally Posted By: gypsy
What if we could feed a few thousand people with a couple fish?

McDonalds have been doing that for years with the Filet-O-Fish patty.
_________________________
Reverend Bill M.

http://www.devilsmischief.com: Carnal Comedy Clips, Netherworld Novelty Numbers,
New hour every week. Download the mp3 now!

http://www.aplaceformystuff.org: Tales of Combat Clutter and other Adventures

(Wenn du Google's Übersetzer verwendest, um diese Worte zu lesen, dann bist du ein Arschloch.)

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#358944 - 11/06/08 08:20 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Bill_M]
gypsy Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/04/01
Posts: 4749
Loc: Here
*smacks forehead* Oops my mistake blush
_________________________
"All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie."

"Eternal nothingness is fine if you happen to be dressed for it."


Church of Satan

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#358980 - 11/07/08 12:50 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: gypsy]
Ebenezer Scrooge Offline


Registered: 11/04/08
Posts: 140
Loc: New England
Originally Posted By: gypsy
How about a virgins giving birth?



Actually, I have a theory on this, that while far fetch, could be the reason for the so called "Virgin Birth" It is called, Sleep sex

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleep_sex

My theory is that one night, while laying together, Joe got his sex on with Mary and when they woke up, they wouldn't have even realized it. Thus, she technically was a "virgin birth" at least they thought she was, because no one knew they technically had sex. So as far as everyone still knew, she was a virgin.


This was the theory I had as a kid though.
_________________________
"If they'd rather die, they had better do it and decrease the surplus population."-Ebenezer Scrooge

“I don't mean to sound bitter,cold,or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.”-Bill Hicks

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#358985 - 11/07/08 02:50 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Ebenezer Scrooge]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3969
Loc: The Deep South
I knew a couple of cases of "virgin mothers".

They were teenagers who thought just "playing around" was o.k. as long as there was no real penetration...

Apparently they liked to play it messy too and they didn't count on sperms' ability to find their way.
_________________________
You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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#359017 - 11/07/08 09:15 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Old_Pig]
ArtAche86 Offline


Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 380
Loc: Cthulhu's Bowels,Kentucky
Very interesting! I actually hadn't considered this. Her hymen would be intact and everything wouldn't it?!

Could you imagine the hypocricy! The alleged messiah born of premarital sex! Sounds like a bad soap opera...
_________________________
You stay classy,Satans!

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#359067 - 11/07/08 01:16 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: gypsy]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11565
Loc: New England, USA
Originally Posted By: gypsy
*smacks forehead* Oops my mistake blush

Bartles & Jaymes by the way were able to turn water into wine.

As for the virgin birth, such a child would have to be female, because mothers only have X-chromosomes. On the other hand, I've heard that the X/Y situation for male/female determination is biologically reversed in the case of turkeys. Make of that what you will.
_________________________
Reverend Bill M.

http://www.devilsmischief.com: Carnal Comedy Clips, Netherworld Novelty Numbers,
New hour every week. Download the mp3 now!

http://www.aplaceformystuff.org: Tales of Combat Clutter and other Adventures

(Wenn du Google's Übersetzer verwendest, um diese Worte zu lesen, dann bist du ein Arschloch.)

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#359071 - 11/07/08 01:33 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Bill_M]
Sakura Offline



Registered: 07/01/08
Posts: 220
Loc: The Circus
Well, you could look at it that way I guess. I always tell people they already had IVF back in those days! grin
_________________________
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "otherwise you wouldn't have come here."
Alice didn't think that proved it at all: however she went on. "And how do you know that you're mad?"
"To begin with," said the Cat, "a dog's not mad. You grant that?"
"I suppose so," said Alice.
"Well, then, " the Cat went on, "you see a dog growls when it's angry, and wags its tail when it's pleased. Now I growl when I'm pleased, and wag my tail when I'm angry. Therefore I'm mad."

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#359088 - 11/07/08 05:25 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Bill_M]
gypsy Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 07/04/01
Posts: 4749
Loc: Here
Quote:
Make of that what you will.


Ok - zombie
_________________________
"All the truth in the world adds up to one big lie."

"Eternal nothingness is fine if you happen to be dressed for it."


Church of Satan

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#359098 - 11/07/08 06:17 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: gypsy]
Evil_Eve Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 4234
Loc: 1313 Mockingbird Lane
Originally Posted By: gypsy
Quote:
Make of that what you will.


Ok - zombie


Jesus Joseph Mary and all of the Saints! I nearly ruined this computer after seeing the turkey baster picture. I had a mouth full of water you see......luckily I got it down before swpewing it onto the laptop.

coopdevil
_________________________
Satan LIVES!
If you could....would YOU?



"Our religion does not require martyrs."
Magistra Nadramia.

FEARED!
Revered.
YOU can be a voice for the voiceless.


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#359106 - 11/07/08 07:58 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Ebenezer Scrooge]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Then there's sleeploitation.
Warm milk?
_________________________
http://www.theanimalrescuesite.com/clickToGive/home.faces

http://theepicureandilettante.blogspot.com/

"Life is the only race you lose by reaching the end." - M.M.

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#359325 - 11/09/08 12:18 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Philotechnic]
Ysabela Offline


Registered: 10/12/08
Posts: 5
I don't believe in the Christian heaven. What comes after our death remains to be seen, but I reject the notions of Christianity. My current tendency leans toward reincarnation. Not that I change much, but I am not convinced of anything beyond death since I have not experienced it.
_________________________
~Ysabela~

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#359441 - 11/09/08 02:58 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Dfalls]
DCLXVI Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 07/13/06
Posts: 1064
Loc: U.S.A.
Originally Posted By: Dfalls
Would you live your life to the fullest if you had all the time of the world? What would you do after a few hundreds of years on this ball of dirt? I don't know.. everything loses the thrill after you've done it some times. And when more time passes, you lose a lot of people you know.



With advancing technology, there is always something new "to do" or to learn. If asked the question, I would answer with a resounding,"YES!"

Look back through history: if someone born in, say, 1885 were asked if s/he would want to live forever with youth and health. And suppose they accepted the gift. Look at all the advancements through the 20th century. And, I think, it isn't over yet.

So, with youth and health, Hell yes, I would choose immortality.

The point you made about watching friends and loved ones die off? If the are of the Deathist Cult, let them go. I'll make new friends.
_________________________
"Churches may close and old shepherds may die, but the herd will always be the herd."
Reverend Bill


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#359443 - 11/09/08 03:08 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Nemo]
DCLXVI Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 07/13/06
Posts: 1064
Loc: U.S.A.
Quote:
And it is very popular to think that way too! smile


Is that simply because they don't know any better?
_________________________
"Churches may close and old shepherds may die, but the herd will always be the herd."
Reverend Bill


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#359539 - 11/09/08 10:24 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: DCLXVI]
ArtAche86 Offline


Registered: 10/24/08
Posts: 380
Loc: Cthulhu's Bowels,Kentucky
no its because

"The Bi-ble Tells them Soooooo" *insert bad piano playing*
_________________________
You stay classy,Satans!

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#359662 - 11/10/08 08:39 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Evil_Eve]
Giovanni Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 08/12/06
Posts: 238
Loc: Fishers,IN
Your reactions make me smile Eve.

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#360009 - 11/12/08 04:56 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Ashtar Offline


Registered: 02/25/08
Posts: 27
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Most myths about heavens usually include a counterpart hell where your soul will suffer for eternity. If this were indeed by some chance true, then I would have an immortal soul that could never die (otherwise how will they torture me forever?) therefore, I am saved from oblivion. That would be ideal I think.

Pascal's wager has always had it backwards, we should gamble that heaven is false, because if it is, then this life is all we have and we are gone forever if we die. Let's plan for that inevitability, and if it turns our we're wrong, then maybe we'll find out some day if a random comet hits us or something. I'm not in any rush, if indeed there's an eternity waiting in an afterlife, then it will no doubt be LONGER than the time we get to spend in the flesh, meaning we should try to stay in the flesh for as long as possible.

I haven't seen any concrete statements on how long possible is, so I presume a really long time so long as we don't get sick and die.
_________________________
-Thanks

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#360016 - 11/12/08 05:11 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Ashtar]
VaH Offline


Registered: 10/02/08
Posts: 42
Loc: Between Random Neuron Firings
well...immortality *could* be achieved (sort of). This dig is this: Most of the aging process is a decrease in the splitting of DNA strands. The main reason this happens is due to the ends of the strands (I forget what exactly they're called, but they bind the strands together and keep them from fraying...kind of like the ends of your shoe laces...). After so many splits, these ends start to lose cohesion and the DNA strand isn't bound together as well and splits become less successful.

Now if there was some way to retain the strength of those end caps, theoritically your DNA could replicate indefinitely. Granted, you could still be killed or fall ill, but you would for all intents and purposes be in your prime throughout your entire existence.

Of course, there are other factors that play on the lifespan of these end caps. Stress, diet, or any number of other things that you could do to the body seems to affect their cohesive properties.

Granted, I found this information in a medical magazine while looking for anatomical references for a drawing I was working on at the time, and I would guess that it's largely theoretical...so take it for what it's worth. I just thought I'd chip in that little bit of info with all the talk of immortality in the mix...

V.
_________________________

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#360045 - 11/12/08 07:40 PM Being done as we speak. [Re: VaH]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...

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#360052 - 11/12/08 08:18 PM Re: Being done as we speak. [Re: Nemo]
Quaark Offline

CoS Reverend

Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 8898
In place of Daark, when I registered here in 2003, it was nearly under the user name of Telomere.

Thought you might appreciate that.

wink

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#360054 - 11/12/08 08:36 PM Re: Being done as we speak. [Re: Quaark]
Ashtar Offline


Registered: 02/25/08
Posts: 27
Loc: Ontario, Canada
I don't have any plans to contradict you VaH, I hope you did not think I was implying anything contrary. Whatever the solution is, it's going to require nonflagrant use of resources, meaning we'll have to work for it. Even when ageing and related diseases are no longer a problem, there will always be things to kill us which we need to work on fighting against. That's the issue with religions who do not feel it is a large priorioty. Believing in an afterlife, they focus more on making life comfortable than making it lengthly.
_________________________
-Thanks

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#360058 - 11/12/08 09:00 PM Re: Being done as we speak. [Re: Ashtar]
Quaark Offline

CoS Reverend

Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 8898
You have accidentally posted under my post when you meant to post under VaH.

Please learn how this board functions before posting or it causes confusion.

Kindly remove your reply and repost it in the place you actually intended to.

The problem may be that you are viewing this thread in 'flat mode' instead of 'threaded mode'.

Thank you.

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#360124 - 11/13/08 08:06 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
tekku Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/24/06
Posts: 1261
Loc: Behind You
Of Course Heaven exsists!



The black forest flavour takes ice cream to a new level

coopdevil
_________________________
That is not dead which can eternal lie,
And with strange aeons even death may die
~H.P. Lovecraft~

La bonne cuisine est la base du véritable bonheur ~Escoffier~

Church of Satan

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#360143 - 11/13/08 09:25 AM Re: Being done as we speak. [Re: Nemo]
VaH Offline


Registered: 10/02/08
Posts: 42
Loc: Between Random Neuron Firings
Thank you for the link, good sir! Not being able to remember what the telomeres were called was going to drive me bonkers eek
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#360167 - 11/13/08 11:56 AM Re: Being done as we speak. [Re: Ashtar]
VaH Offline


Registered: 10/02/08
Posts: 42
Loc: Between Random Neuron Firings
Originally Posted By: Ashtar
I don't have any plans to contradict you VaH, I hope you did not think I was implying anything contrary. Whatever the solution is, it's going to require nonflagrant use of resources, meaning we'll have to work for it. Even when ageing and related diseases are no longer a problem, there will always be things to kill us which we need to work on fighting against. That's the issue with religions who do not feel it is a large priorioty. Believing in an afterlife, they focus more on making life comfortable than making it lengthly.


The issue that I see with immortality is that I don't think that many who desire it actually have the stamina for it. This is simply to say that many would simply not know what to do with themselves for eternity. The esteemed Doctor put it best: "There are many who yearn for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon."

Also I'm pretty sure it would require an individual with an unparallelled level of detachment to the world around him or her. Knowing that any bonds you might have with another are most likely temporary, I could see where this could lend itself very easily to the extremes of hedonism or nihilism. Naturally, I would wager that individuals that are already predisposed to those sorts of mentalities are already quite fit for immortality.

I prefer a different mode of thought on the subject of immortality. I don't want to live forever, but rather live until such time as I decide I don't want to anymore. Say what you will about it; I like to keep my options open. coopdevil
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#360170 - 11/13/08 12:04 PM Re: Being done as we speak. [Re: VaH]
TheDegenerate Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 3567
Loc: Cowtown
Well then, that's easy, isn't it?

If immortality treatment becomes available, take advantage of it.

Then, if you ever get bored, simply throw yourself off the nearest high-rise. Problem solved. laugh


Edited by Phosis (11/13/08 12:04 PM)

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#360172 - 11/13/08 12:09 PM Re: Being done as we speak. [Re: TheDegenerate]
VaH Offline


Registered: 10/02/08
Posts: 42
Loc: Between Random Neuron Firings
Originally Posted By: Phosis
Well then, that's easy, isn't it?

If immortality treatment becomes available, take advantage of it.

Then, if you ever get bored, simply throw yourself off the nearest high-rise. Problem solved. laugh


touche! grin
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#360281 - 11/14/08 01:17 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Luigi]
ConquerOrPerish Offline


Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 228
Loc: DC Metro Area
Originally Posted By: LuigiBertolucci
And what if pink unicorns are real? Or the flying spaghetti monster? Or Tarvu?


Thank you, thank you for illuminating me on the illustrious wisdom of Tarvu.


Edited by ConquerOrPerish (11/15/08 08:58 AM)
_________________________
"I, even I, am my own redeemer". -Ragnar Redbeard

"Making a difference makes sense only if you are convinced that you have mastered the subject at hand to the point where any difference you might make would be for the better." -Thomas Sowell


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#382194 - 05/22/09 07:08 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: ConquerOrPerish]
Atralux Lucis Offline


Registered: 05/21/09
Posts: 35
Loc: Australia
I read the Diabolicon which details an interpretation in Statement form of the Seraphic wars (God vs Lucifer) and then the creation of hell, mankind and other things.

In it he says that Hell was created by lucifer and the angels that followed him expected something more or less like heaven. They were suprised to find it was quite different. Chaos, due to the complete freedom of wills.
Heaven was kept in order by the angels blind faith and they gave their will completely to 'God' (made to be some form of being but never actually shown to be sentient) and it was this that kept heaven in perfect order at the cost of complete dissolution of free will and ego.

If heaven and hell exist, and this interpretation is far more believable when one reads the Diabolicon, then I personally think Hell seems a much more appealing place than heaven.


Edited by Atralux Lucis (05/22/09 10:11 PM)
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Lascivian Atralux Lucis

It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful.- Anton Szandor LaVey

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#382990 - 05/29/09 12:01 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Faronakume Offline


Registered: 05/29/09
Posts: 5
Loc: Oklahoma, USA
I would offer perhaps no greater than .00001% chance that any "genuine" heaven be authentic in terms of virtual existence, albeit any individual might arrive at peculiar view, immediate awareness, else distinct perception at any given time. Heaven, as sheer Christian dogmatic principle, to me, lit. evidence of inane Herd Mentality for which LaVey clearly disapproved of.

Much opposite, "paradise" perhaps, in terms of lit. comfort or satisfaction, be that Satannic interpretation of some explicit dark realm, majestic cavern or other, even I presumably once entreated for a time, e.g. she was just that good .

The Bible, to me, as with many people, at most meager comic book in many respects, a layman's guide for philosophical compliance with nonsense morality, and morality to me is of unique offense (I like what I like, when I like it, with whom I wish to enjoy the same with).

NOTE: Clearly, I do recognize principles of select existence wherefrom equivelant of "distinct realm" is more than obvious. I simply choose to disregard, else disapprove of quasi "moral" realms as commonly purported.


Edited by Faronakume (05/29/09 12:04 PM)
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This document authenticated by Faronakume (independent Satanist, non-conformist, non-religionist).

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#382991 - 05/29/09 12:05 PM Re: Being done as we speak. [Re: TheDegenerate]
Faronakume Offline


Registered: 05/29/09
Posts: 5
Loc: Oklahoma, USA
Impeccable reply!
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This document authenticated by Faronakume (independent Satanist, non-conformist, non-religionist).

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#383081 - 05/30/09 01:33 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: tekku]
Faronakume Offline


Registered: 05/29/09
Posts: 5
Loc: Oklahoma, USA
Rumor has it that more than a single beauty mirrored pretty little Sandra within the mystique dark forest, each of course, bearing an esteemed designation akin to " Magister ". But otherwise, her beauty was personally unveiled before me uniquely off-set, having just concluded a days filming as she then portrayed a precocious young lady. Reportedly, Anton was out in the woods at such time with a distinct blonde, camped out within the precise same cabin where Norma and Arthur Fiddler had honeymooned years previous. Oh, those were the days. Nice to know some of the beauties determined to forever stay young! So let our youth endure forever.
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#383114 - 05/31/09 02:01 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: ArtAche86]
S810 Offline


Registered: 02/11/06
Posts: 326
Loc: northwest
Or they may be looking around at the world and realize that its full of very low life forms and now that an eternity of this would be very annoying at many levels.

Anything for an eternity would be boring on some level. If heaven was real you'd be annoyed by the assholes that are in it. If hell were real, we'd all get used to the heat or whatever torture it has, and make fun of the new guys painful cries.

I'd like to be at least 100, just to see what I can do in that time, and also to see how many of us realize an Is-to-be.
_________________________
"Morality" It's a fickle thing, little thing,little thing. Depends on WHO, is your king, IS your king. -Fred A. Padilla-

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#383152 - 05/31/09 03:21 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: S810]
Ozymandias Offline


Registered: 04/16/09
Posts: 36
Loc: Louisville, Kentucky
IF you could live for eternity, do you not think that the annoying aspects of this world would become even more trivial?

IF you knew that technology could grant you everlasting life, would it not change how you lived much more than the hollow promises of heaven and hell? Would you not be able to shrug off the most cumbersome task or troubling circumstance, knowing that you had eternity to handle your problems?

IF you enjoy life, IF you can rise above the mindless shuffling of the human herd, IF you savor every moment, would you not want it to last?

Just a few thoughts of my own.
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Are you one of Us?

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#383154 - 05/31/09 03:31 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Ozymandias]
Ozymandias Offline


Registered: 04/16/09
Posts: 36
Loc: Louisville, Kentucky
Quote:
Just a few thoughts of my own.


To be fair, there are people much wiser than I who have and do put it much more eloquently. wink
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Are you one of Us?

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#383185 - 05/31/09 10:04 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Basher Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/16/09
Posts: 66
Loc: Mars
What if we played ping-pong with bowling balls? What if money grew on trees? What if you had to pay your employer so that you could work? What if I had a $5 bill with "IF" as part of the serial number? Oh, wait, I DO have a $5 bill with "IF" as part of the serial number.

smile
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Felated Satan!

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#384033 - 06/09/09 01:27 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Basher]
Iscariot Offline


Registered: 06/08/09
Posts: 144
Loc: United States
I dunno, the idea of heaven seems a little fishy to me. I mean come on, "You don’t have to be afraid of dying because there’s this magical happy place with no sin or death or suffering and everyone you know and love will be there and blah blah blah..." Feels kinda like I'm being conned.

I mean if someone on the street came up to you and told you about a magical island somewhere with all your dead loved ones on it and no more sadness, you'd clearly think they were crazy or a bullshiting you.

Theistic religion found a way to ensure you could never investigate or disprove their claims about the afterlife: you have to meet the unfortunate prerequisite of being dead before you can go there, thus no one can 'disprove' the claim that heaven is really there.

I dunno, the whole "too good to be true" thing comes to mind whenever I think about heaven.
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"Much Madness is divinest Sense..."

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#384038 - 06/09/09 01:58 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Iscariot]
Spelled Moon
Unregistered


My father likes to say: "Everybody say, that Heaven's beautiful, but no one wants to get there." ... sometime, instead of want he uses hurry. But it's true - if heaven's so great place, why all so-sure-believers so care for being alive.
A bit exaggerated, but eventually, they wouldn't have to care if they are sick, because it's God's will, and there's better place waiting for them. grin

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#384040 - 06/09/09 02:06 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Nemo]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
interesting comment Magister, but the question of the existence of an afterlife raises many questions. and to be frank, i just cant know. Christianity and many other major religions, with all their dogmas and consequences are amusing because they appear to be ridiculous, but also scary. There will always be the fear of the unknown. In an aesthetic / Satanic point of view its also scary, don't get me wrong. i am a firm believer in the philosophy of satanism because "I" found it much more realistic and truthful. There is always the fear, whether people claim to be happy and satisfied with their life. Its a struggle. and a question i can never answer.
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#384041 - 06/09/09 02:08 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Rodim]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Originally Posted By: Rodim
interesting comment Magister, but the question of the existence of an afterlife raises many questions.


Not if you consider the word "afterlife".
There is only one thing after life.
Death.
Not much to question.
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"Life is the only race you lose by reaching the end." - M.M.

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#384042 - 06/09/09 02:10 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
TraceLines Offline


Registered: 04/28/09
Posts: 58
Loc: Upstate South Carolina, USA
A whole Yale course on the philosophy of death and the afterlife. Happens to be free to watch. The professor isn't boring at all either. Hope everyone enjoys.

http://academicearth.org/courses/death
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Too much zeal clouds judgment.

Lack of zeal results in doing nothing worth judging.

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#384044 - 06/09/09 03:00 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: TraceLines]
Thrax Orion Offline


Registered: 06/05/09
Posts: 47
Loc: San Diego, CA
In regards to the rationality and desirability of theories on the continuance of consciousness after physical death, I have strong reservations.

Reincarnation has been a fad the past few decades, and it is rational in that yes, nature conserves all energy and consciousness itself is at its most base level an energetic phenomenon... Until you consider the fact that your identity is a very, VERY delicately arranged 'pattern' of that energy! Presuming we all have past incarnations, how much of these individuals actually remains? Do you know their names, or who and what they loved? The only honest answer is that no, they really don't live on. The individual you are now has to achieve his or her potential NOW, not in fifty lifetimes. That's an unpleasant thought indeed, but it is likely the most accurate one even if some portion of your being moves on to a new body.

In regard to imaginary destinations IE heaven or hell, you must ask yourself this: Since most if not all of our personality as human beings is endemic to man's animal nature, does it follow that the majority of who and what you are in terms of basic motivations would live on in some ethereal plane outside of physical reality? I do not believe it does.

And finally there is a very simple question you can ask yourself to resolve the issue. Ask yourself "If I were to drink a hundred beers and swallow seven vicodin, should I expect to retain consciousness?", and then ask yourself: "If my whole physical being were annihilated, should I expect to retain consciousness?"

That clears things up very quickly.

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#384047 - 06/09/09 03:24 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Thrax Orion]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
Quote:

And finally there is a very simple question you can ask yourself to resolve the issue. Ask yourself "If I were to drink a hundred beers and swallow seven vicodin, should I expect to retain consciousness?", and then ask yourself: "If my whole physical being were annihilated, should I expect to retain consciousness?"

That clears things up very quickly.


Religious people, Christians at least as far as I'm concerned, believe presumably that you reincarnate to an ethereal "body", not to a physical one ergo "retaining" has no meaning, the beer and the vicodin only destroy your human body.


As for your swift response.. Resolve the issue? Your argument resolves the aesthetic perspective of the issue. But what i commented was based entirely on doubts.
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#384048 - 06/09/09 03:41 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Rodim]
Thrax Orion Offline


Registered: 06/05/09
Posts: 47
Loc: San Diego, CA
Quote:
Religious people, Christians at least as far as I'm concerned, believe presumably that you reincarnate to an ethereal "body", not to a physical one ergo "retaining" has no meaning, the beer and the vicodin only destroy your human body.


Point conceded at least insofar as I recognize an exotic excuse could be employed as to why we black out under the influence of drugs but fail to do so after the total death of our physical forms. You have a valid point there.

Quote:
As for your swift response.. Resolve the issue? Your argument resolves the aesthetic perspective of the issue. But what i commented was based entirely on doubts.


Agreed. Actually I can reasonably make no such claim to resolve any such issue in a broad sense for anyone but myself... Also you may be under the impression I was stating "you" as in the personal, not the general. I wasn't replying to you specifically, but this is my fault for being imprecise. I intended to address the topic at large.

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#384055 - 06/09/09 04:17 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Rodim]
reprobate Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 7140
Loc: Canada
Quote:
Religious people, Christians at least as far as I'm concerned, believe presumably that you reincarnate to an ethereal "body", not to a physical one ergo "retaining" has no meaning, the beer and the vicodin only destroy your human body.

What an odd thing to presume. Most traditional Christian theologies (Catholicism and many of the older Protestant denominations included) are pretty straight on this: that your real, actual, physical body is resurrected. If there's any damage to it, the damage is restored. The Kingdom of Heaven is held to be here, on the real Earth, after the Second Coming.

Aquinas has a hilarious passage detailing what, precisely, happens when eg. a cannibal eats a Christian, then repents and converts to Christianity on his deathbed, and is resurrected: to whose body do the eaten parts belong, the original owner or the cannibal? (Answer: The original owner, but the missing parts are miraculously supplied to the cannibal by God's power.)


Edited by reprobate (06/09/09 04:19 PM)
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reprobate

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#384065 - 06/09/09 08:10 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: reprobate]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
That is indeed weird, this is what iv been hearing from Christians here. and their also very traditional devoted protestants / Catholics. As for the passage, Good laugh really. Enjoyed it.
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#384066 - 06/09/09 08:24 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Thrax Orion]
Basher Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/16/09
Posts: 66
Loc: Mars
Originally Posted By: Thrax Orion
delicately arranged 'pattern' of that energy!


Ah, yes, patterns.
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Felated Satan!

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#384069 - 06/09/09 09:01 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Rodim]
reprobate Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 7140
Loc: Canada
Just one of those things, really: most Christians don't know jack shit about Christianity. They make stuff up.

Compare what you've been told by, eg., well-meaning devout lay Catholics, with the official catechism of the Catholic Church.
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reprobate

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#384070 - 06/09/09 09:31 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Basher]
Thrax Orion Offline


Registered: 06/05/09
Posts: 47
Loc: San Diego, CA
Quote:
Ah, yes, patterns.


My favorite energy pattern is plaid. wink

Minus one point for poor word choice.

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#384072 - 06/09/09 11:07 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Dfalls]
Venus Flytrap Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 05/13/09
Posts: 92
Loc: Brooklyn, NY
Originally Posted By: Dfalls
Trying to convince a christian god doesn't excist is a waste of your time mate.


The whole topic of heaven is one I wasted far too much time on in the past because it led me to realize that religious debate only reinforces their faith, giving them a reason to hang around. Which is probably why they preach about the paradise of "God's" kingdom and can't wait to meet him yet still try EVERY possible means to REMAIN ON EARTH pretty much with "after-you" attitude with they preach.


This also comes from the same idiots who walk up to the deli I used to work at and ask me "HOW LONG IS A TWO FOOT HOAGIE?" What the hell do I say to that?! Then they hand me a religious brochure upon taking their sandwich.
_________________________
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On the Undercroft:

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#384084 - 06/10/09 07:02 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Venus Flytrap]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
Originally Posted By: Shadowed Light
This also comes from the same idiots who walk up to the deli I used to work at and ask me "HOW LONG IS A TWO FOOT HOAGIE?"


grin

Huh, the "Heaven" thread is still going... like the energizer bunny... well, what the hell.

I'm not used to fanatics. I was not raised by them, never lived near them and have never been chased around by them. I've had a difficult time relating to people's pure vitriolic hatred of Christians for this reason but recently had an encounter that helped me understand a little better.

I was minding my business going for a walk extremely early one Sunday morning when this very young fella approached me.

Him: Excuse me, can I ask you a question?
Me: Sure
Him: If you died today, do you think you would go to heaven?

Oh boy.

Maybe it was the early morning hour or my own insularity but it doesn't immediately occur to me what is going on. My first thought is, gee whiz that's delightfully morbid. My second thought is, okay I'll bite. I mean, I thought he was just some harmless college kid having one of those weird random internal philosophical debates.

Me: Sure
Him: What makes you think that?
Me: Because I'm a good liar.

Heh, oh I think I'm soooo clever at this point and am grinning a big dumb grin. Young Mister Morbid either doesn't hear me or ignores me and immediately launches into a bonafide sermon about how god demands PERFECTION, about how lying is a SIN and all SINNERS will burn for eternity in the fiery lakes of HELL, and how jesus christ died for our SINS and we must accept him as our one true lord and SAVIOR. You all know what's coming don't you? Well, I didn't. So when Mister Morbid told me he was a born-again my eyes got wide and methinks, Ah, is that what it's called. .. as I surreptitiously check for a hospital band.

Normally I get kind of sarcastic with preachy people (No, I'm not familiar with religious sorts but preachy people come in all kinds of guises). However, this time, something about this kid made me stow my usual smart assery and keep my mouth shut. Then halfway through the diatribe I notice this kid's hand is badly injured, actively bleeding. It could've been a farm accident or something else benign but the sight of blood combined with the psycho-rant had an eerie effect. I was genuinely disturbed by the whole thing. I realized I was on a less-travelled road (literally) by myself with a religious zealot who might as well be a serial killer for all I knew.

So I stayed extremely polite. And when Young Mister Might-Kill-Me told me he'd pray for me I just thanked him kindly and smiled sweetly and got the fuck out of there as quickly as possible.

Lessons learned: They're fun to make fun of but I'd rather do so from a safe distance where the froth and spittle and bleeding hands can't reach me. Barring that, I'll be on my best behavior, eyes peeled, with full awareness of all available exits. Oh and don't talk to strangers. grin
_________________________
"What happens in the shadow, in the grey regions, also interests us – all that is elusive and fugitive, all that can be said in those beautiful half tones, or in whispers, in deep shade." ~ The Brothers Quay

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#384088 - 06/10/09 07:35 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Shade]
MissMina1556 Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 03/05/08
Posts: 1386
Loc: USA
Geeshhh, Shade, that was a "creepy" encounter.

From the standpoint of being in a somewhat secluded place, and truly not knowing if Mr. Morbid was a crazy killer from around the bend, it gives us all pause to make sure we know where we are, and we should be aware of all exits.

Mother did know best when she told us not to talk to strangers.

I think I'll put my gun back into my purse.
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#384090 - 06/10/09 07:40 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Shade]
Minus Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/10/06
Posts: 2236
Loc: Circling A Star
I'm sorry you were disturbed but it was nice to finally meet you in person.
_________________________
Hail Satan!
Minus

"When the great lord passes, the wise peasant bows deeply and silently farts."
-Ethiopian Proverb

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#384094 - 06/10/09 08:21 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: MissMina1556]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
Amen. crossbones
_________________________
"What happens in the shadow, in the grey regions, also interests us – all that is elusive and fugitive, all that can be said in those beautiful half tones, or in whispers, in deep shade." ~ The Brothers Quay

We're Just Regular People

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#384095 - 06/10/09 08:23 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Minus]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
Dear Minus,

I can't believe I didn't recognize you. The owl mask should've been a dead giveaway. That or the fact that you weren't wearing pants.

Say hi to Nurse Ratched for me.

Love,
Shade
_________________________
"What happens in the shadow, in the grey regions, also interests us – all that is elusive and fugitive, all that can be said in those beautiful half tones, or in whispers, in deep shade." ~ The Brothers Quay

We're Just Regular People

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#384207 - 06/11/09 06:07 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Shade]
Minus Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/10/06
Posts: 2236
Loc: Circling A Star
Originally Posted By: Shade
I can't believe I didn't recognize you. The owl mask should've been a dead giveaway. That or the fact that you weren't wearing pants.


Owl mask? I wasn't wearing an owl mask. I was naked and walking on my hands. I guess it's time to take a trimmer to this 70's bush. Did you like my "beak"?
_________________________
Hail Satan!
Minus

"When the great lord passes, the wise peasant bows deeply and silently farts."
-Ethiopian Proverb

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#384222 - 06/11/09 08:59 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Minus]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
Did I like it? Presented in the proper way, your "beak" may be the most compelling evidence for the existence of heaven. Joseph Smith would be jealous of your ingenuity.

Do do that voodoo that you do so well...

coopdevil
_________________________
"What happens in the shadow, in the grey regions, also interests us – all that is elusive and fugitive, all that can be said in those beautiful half tones, or in whispers, in deep shade." ~ The Brothers Quay

We're Just Regular People

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#384239 - 06/11/09 12:50 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: reprobate]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
Quote:
Just one of those things, really: most Christians don't know jack shit about Christianity. They make stuff up.

Compare what you've been told by, eg., well-meaning devout lay Catholics, with [url=http://www.vatican.va/archive/catechism/p123a11.htm]the official catechism of the Catholic Church.


Ironic how Christians keep arguing about people not listening to the word of god anymore while their "devoted brethren" don't know the basis of Christianity. And thanks for the link warlock, never too late for a good laugh.
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#384454 - 06/14/09 07:16 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Rodim]
Iscariot Offline


Registered: 06/08/09
Posts: 144
Loc: United States
Something I’ve had to deal with all too often.

Example: "Jesus says in the bible you only have to give up one thing for lent."

*sigh* Yet, somehow, their belief in the "bible" or what they think is in the bible is an excuse for their political and moral bigotry. Kinda gives you a pain in the front of your forehead just thinking about it.
_________________________
"Much Madness is divinest Sense..."

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#384471 - 06/14/09 10:25 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Iscariot]
Umbra_Euri Offline


Registered: 05/24/08
Posts: 57
Loc: Pennsylvania
Oh, that is nothing, I remember rather clearly a teacher at my high school (catholic high school) reading from his "bible" a story where Jesus went to Mcdonalds and told everyone to purchase food from the dollar menu, as that way they would save money that way.

The stupidity of people is astounding.

Reminds me of the movie Idiocracy.
_________________________
These things can never be important to the elephant; they are nothing to him; he cannot shrink his sympathies to the microscopic size of them. Man is to me as the red spider is to the elephant.

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#384552 - 06/15/09 09:10 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Umbra_Euri]
Venus Flytrap Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 05/13/09
Posts: 92
Loc: Brooklyn, NY
If this has touched upon, then I didn't feel like spending over an hour reading the responses as my time is limited.

If heaven exists, so then must hell. But with all the different cultures interpreting the place for the damned, which one would be the accurate one?
The Buddhists hell is of many levels as is Dante's Inferno. Then how would it be determined which level to go to if We Satanists exemplify ALL the "sins"? Loyalty to the Left-hand creed? Personality types? Which sin was used the most? Or perhaps to whatever level of the Decent into the underworld one has achieved in ritual before dying? If this were the case, then hell is nothing more than the founding roots of the primary levels of consciousness, reached only by ritualistic guided meditations.

Hell is as I believe, the harboring realm of all things unknown and undiscovered. But in reference to the topic of death, then hell is the eternal dreamless state of oblivion, then why fear death outside the reasoning as stated in the Satanic Bible on this subject? One will be unaware of the fact that their dead or even that they ever existed at all.
Though I have seen many paranormal and supernatural occurrences unexplained by logical science that somewhat resembled the presence of one who has past...

What if the lake of fire does exist as threatened by the Christians? Any one have sunblock? We could use the bones of our enemies to roast the marshmallows on and talk about the pink unicorns.
_________________________
"We have such sights to show you" -Hellraiser




On the Undercroft:

http://www.satannet.com/Shadowedlight/

On Facebook

www.facebook.com/Satanicdragon





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#384564 - 06/15/09 11:12 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Venus Flytrap]
Thrax Orion Offline


Registered: 06/05/09
Posts: 47
Loc: San Diego, CA
hehehe... I want to be on the level where the beast eats you and shits you out repeatedly for eternity. Sounds like a wild ride!

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#385614 - 06/23/09 04:37 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Thrax Orion]
Paul Powers Offline


Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 28
Loc: Uk
The easiest way to view this is the way the Christians put it "Hell is a life without god" So I'm already in hell and loving it laugh
in fact I'm certain the world would be a better place if all the god believers, Religious Fanatics and Followers of the right hand path shuffled off the mortal coil to spend an eternity playing harps and just leave the rest of us in peace

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#385617 - 06/23/09 05:06 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Paul Powers]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3969
Loc: The Deep South
Originally Posted By: Tch0rt
The easiest way to view this is the way the Christians put it "Hell is a life without god" So I'm already in hell and loving it


That's a great way to put it. Can I have your permission to use that quote?
_________________________
You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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#385645 - 06/24/09 03:28 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Old_Pig]
Paul Powers Offline


Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 28
Loc: Uk
certainly
I take that as a compliment so thank you

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#385650 - 06/24/09 05:21 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Paul Powers]
ruraldean Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 08/21/08
Posts: 227
Loc: England
I'll add my 2p worth, just so there's no doubt. The concept of Heaven came about by following exactly your thought process - if life here is this bad then there HAS to be something better.

This is great news if you are the sort of moribund bastard who just sits around waiting for some sort of improvement. We tend to view life here as all there is and therefore live it to the max.

I suspect we've all asked ourselves the same question at some time, mainly because it is impossible to be an effective opposer without knowing the opposition, but you really have to look at both the evidence and the possibility of Heaven being real. If it's a place where we can bathe in the glory of God non-stop,offering Him nothing but non-stop worship, then what does that say about God?

If, on the other hand, we are there to enjoy ourselves in a state of perpetual bliss for all of eternity (which is quite a long time) then where does my sense of contrast go? Will I be bored? could I choose to be miserable? Being a grumpy old bastard I love days when it all goes tits-up and I have problems to chew on. I've just come back from two weeks holiday where money was no object and alcoholic and gastronomic pleasures reigned. It's always nice to get back to normal though.

And what evidence for Heaven is there? Who can give any testament except the living?

To acknowledge the possibility of Heaven you must accept the plausibility of a God.

We don't.
_________________________
Hail Satan!

"The pipe draws wisdom from the lips of the philosopher, and shuts up the mouth of the foolish; it generates a style of conversation, contemplative, thoughtful, benevolent, and unaffected..."

-William Makepeace Thackeray, from The Social Pipe
http://ruraldean.wordpress.com

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#385654 - 06/24/09 06:28 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: TheDegenerate]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
"Blasphemy! God works through the priesthood and the Vatican church, isn't that enough evidence?" <- Christianities only "solid" evidence.

This subject is indeed tired and depleted.
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#385655 - 06/24/09 06:31 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: ruraldean]
MissMina1556 Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 03/05/08
Posts: 1386
Loc: USA
Quote:
I've just come back from two weeks holiday where money was no object and alcoholic and gastronomic pleasures reigned.


Is that not a description of "heaven"? smile I think it is for me!
_________________________
YOU ARE DEEP, DARK AND LOVELY.


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#385705 - 06/24/09 06:05 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: MissMina1556]
Carbon-Dioxide Offline


Registered: 09/12/08
Posts: 22
I think Heaven, is a kind of hope certain people would like to adopt. Cause although Satanists do not believe in this stuff, someone who does, would be a really helpful way to build hope when suffering or facing a permanent problem.

In fact, if someone is quite sick and will end up in bed or into jail for his end of his life, Heaven would be a great help for him to keep living. Right?

Heaven reminds me of placebo. Once, me and some others made a joke to our friend. We gave him some kind ( I don't remember exactly) of white herbal tea and we told him it is cocaine. He ever abused from drugs, so basically, he couldn't know the difference between cocaine and this herbal tea. Thus, he was assuming to feel the effect when taking it. When he took it, without even realizing, his behavior was really strange and was acting as if he really took cocaine. We laughed cause we knew it wasn't cociane but it was white herbal tea. My friend is a psychologist and this technique is usually used to check whether the client is really suffering of a problem or not. The client would be given a "fake" medicine. Sometimes, clients would go to my friend and say "thanks, the medicine you gave me was helpful". He realizes that therefore, the client didn't really suffered in anything, his problem was in his mind.

Let's say we use Heaven as a placebo. Wouldn't that then be a good idea?

To keep on the subject, I did enjoy reading most of the comments but however, there was one thing I couldn't really understand. Most of the comments showed Heaven as bullshit. But no comment really proven how/why Heaven is fantasy. In my opinion, no living human can really say whether Heaven is true or not so it will remain a mystery till we die. No matter how strong the argument is.

Also, I would like to point something else. If someone is going to die within next couple of hours. Would it be painfully knowing there is no God, no Heaven and nothing left?

Many people that I had experienced, laughed at Christians and people believing in another life. But I noticed that at the end of their life, Christians were more confidential and fearless for death. They didn't even worry that they are going to die.

When as Satanist is at his end of his life, what thoughts would he have during his last moments?

Anyway, thanks for reading my comment smile
_________________________
The strong rule the weak, but the cunning rule over all.

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#385706 - 06/24/09 06:20 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Carbon-Dioxide]
Umbra_Euri Offline


Registered: 05/24/08
Posts: 57
Loc: Pennsylvania
I agree with you carbon, no one can truly say whether or not heaven, or anything like it, exists or not.

However, seeing as there is little to no proof of the existence of an afterlife, most people here on this forum would be inclined to say that it does not exist.

I keep an open mind, since no one knows, regardless of what they think.

I know what you mean about the religious seeming to not fear death.

But is it better to make up a nice story of how you would like death to be?

Or to realize you have no idea what lies ahead, and embrace the inevitable that way.

I think it is foolish to attempt to say whether or not anything supernatural exists, regardless of proof.

Remember people, lack of proof is not proof of the contrary.
_________________________
These things can never be important to the elephant; they are nothing to him; he cannot shrink his sympathies to the microscopic size of them. Man is to me as the red spider is to the elephant.

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#385713 - 06/24/09 08:19 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Umbra_Euri]
casper3912 Offline


Registered: 06/24/09
Posts: 30
theres nothing to fear in death, theres only something to fear in not living. it doesn't matter to me if theres a heaven that i might go to after i die. i really don't think there is something after death for me. i already found heaven and hell, and they're here on earth.

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#385717 - 06/24/09 08:29 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: casper3912]
Umbra_Euri Offline


Registered: 05/24/08
Posts: 57
Loc: Pennsylvania
You contradict yourself. Death is the absence of life. Therefore being afraid of no longer living, is being afraid of being dead and death.

Yes, "heaven and hell" can indeed be found here while living, yet that does not rule out the possibility of there being something after death.

While I am sure no one here believes in an afterlife, there is still the possibility for its existence, however slim you think that possibility may be.
_________________________
These things can never be important to the elephant; they are nothing to him; he cannot shrink his sympathies to the microscopic size of them. Man is to me as the red spider is to the elephant.

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#385721 - 06/24/09 09:33 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Umbra_Euri]
Venus Flytrap Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 05/13/09
Posts: 92
Loc: Brooklyn, NY
In terms of any applied sense of conceptual spirituality, a good orgasm is the closest thing to "God" anyone can get.
as are large amounts of chocolate (same chemical reactions in the brain), therefore He/She who is hungriest and horniest, is most holy! wink

Besides, Christ did in fact exist, his bones were found in a tomb according to a Discovery Channel special. Carbon dated and everything. Christians who saw the program (My mom who is a Born Again being one of them) now say that Jesus' SPIRIT was risen and not his body as the great mother goose book indicates. Thus, continuing to confound My senses as to why when proof is handed to them, they just up and change 2000 years of a specific thought and denying their own religious convictions. Typical, I suppose, it's how they lasted so long.

Christ, I believe was a real man. He was no son God and was nothing more than a hippie who was hung on a Popsicle stick.

*I now crave cookies and cream ice cream with chocolate syrup*
_________________________
"We have such sights to show you" -Hellraiser




On the Undercroft:

http://www.satannet.com/Shadowedlight/

On Facebook

www.facebook.com/Satanicdragon





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#385775 - 06/25/09 10:58 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Umbra_Euri]
ruraldean Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 08/21/08
Posts: 227
Loc: England
Originally Posted By: Umbra_Euri
You contradict yourself. Death is the absence of life. Therefore being afraid of no longer living, is being afraid of being dead and death.

Yes, "heaven and hell" can indeed be found here while living, yet that does not rule out the possibility of there being something after death.

While I am sure no one here believes in an afterlife, there is still the possibility for its existence, however slim you think that possibility may be.


I didn't read a contradiction in Casper's statement. I read "not living" as representing what the majority of the herd do on a daily basis.
_________________________
Hail Satan!

"The pipe draws wisdom from the lips of the philosopher, and shuts up the mouth of the foolish; it generates a style of conversation, contemplative, thoughtful, benevolent, and unaffected..."

-William Makepeace Thackeray, from The Social Pipe
http://ruraldean.wordpress.com

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#385776 - 06/25/09 11:00 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Venus Flytrap]
ruraldean Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 08/21/08
Posts: 227
Loc: England
Originally Posted By: Shadowed Light
In terms of any applied sense of conceptual spirituality, a good orgasm is the closest thing to "God" anyone can get.

Please describe a bad orgasm. crossbones
_________________________
Hail Satan!

"The pipe draws wisdom from the lips of the philosopher, and shuts up the mouth of the foolish; it generates a style of conversation, contemplative, thoughtful, benevolent, and unaffected..."

-William Makepeace Thackeray, from The Social Pipe
http://ruraldean.wordpress.com

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#385777 - 06/25/09 11:09 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: casper3912]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
Originally Posted By: casper3912
there's nothing to fear in death, there's only something to fear in not living. it doesn't matter to me if there's a heaven that i might go to after i die. i really don't think there is something after death for me. i already found heaven and hell, and they're here on earth.


Being Naive now, aren't we? The Fear of the Unknown is the oldest question in the history of mankind. Its always better to say "I reserve my judgment" rather than "i think" or "I believe", Just my opinion.


Edited by Rodim (06/25/09 11:10 AM)
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#385784 - 06/25/09 11:46 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Rodim]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
Quote:
Being Naive now, aren't we? The Fear of the Unknown is the oldest question in the history of mankind. Its always better to say "I reserve my judgment" rather than "i think" or "I believe", Just my opinion.


Do you mean reserve judgment for the possibility of an after life?
_________________________









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#385785 - 06/25/09 11:49 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: ruraldean]
casper3912 Offline


Registered: 06/24/09
Posts: 30
Originally Posted By: Umbra_Euri
You contradict yourself. Death is the absence of life. Therefore being afraid of no longer living, is being afraid of being dead and death.


Originally Posted By: ruraldean

I didn't read a contradiction in Casper's statement. I read "not living" as representing what the majority of the herd do on a daily basis.


Originally Posted By: Umbra_Euri

Yes, "heaven and hell" can indeed be found here while living, yet that does not rule out the possibility of there being something after death.

While I am sure no one here believes in an afterlife, there is still the possibility for its existence, however slim you think that possibility may be.


lack of proof isn't proof of absence. most people would never wonder how many neutrinos are passing through them at this very moment. technically, i could be walking through a wall or two daily and never know it(i can imagine there being a difference in types of matter, where there is little to none interaction between the two types. No interaction, means they don't really exist to each other). It doesn't do me much good to try to find out if there is something that by principle i won't know in my life time. point being, it might be fun to wonder about, but i'm not going to let the slim possibility of it dictate my life. life is now, i should enjoy it.

if there is a heaven, good(i guess). if theres a hell, the devil will have a new soldier. either way, it doesn't matter to me currently. I tell people i'm not afraid of death and they don't believe me. i admit i'll fight to stay alive and have certain hormonal response in some situations.I have my reasons to stay alive, life after all is the great indulgence.(i love that quote we all know)

Death is like True Love, final.(well, they have resurrected dogs). I think people's own finality scares them, probably an extension of the Animal instinct of self-preservation. however, "living" is different then simply breathing.
In short and for me, its feeling the magic of life within me.


PS. the unknown is exciting, a test and a challenge. I love walking the trail at Night; hair raising on my neck as i pass from the orange glow among the streets into the shadowed woods. Eventually A rabbit might surprise me with its sudden movement as A bright moon casts speckled shadows through the trees. I then hear THE clown's laugh, resonating in the crisp night air with in me. In the moment, i know i am home. the unknown also makes me nervous and at times its scary, but when it comes towards death, i'm confident its not so bad. My only concern is what death would force me to miss or not be able to do.

(the clown is my own personification, i kinda created my own mythology)


Edited by casper3912 (06/25/09 12:07 PM)

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#385790 - 06/25/09 12:04 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Unknown]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
Can you deny that possibility by mere words? As hypocritical and as ridiculous "Major" religions may look. i believe an individual should never eliminate the ability to doubt, anything.


Edited by Rodim (06/25/09 12:05 PM)
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#385791 - 06/25/09 12:09 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Rodim]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
I can deny the possibility by using the great tools called logic and reasoning. I doubt the possibility of an after life, do you? Why should I doubt my doubt of an after life? zombie
_________________________









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#385793 - 06/25/09 12:15 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Unknown]
casper3912 Offline


Registered: 06/24/09
Posts: 30
"test everything, believe nothing" -
http://www.vampiretemple.com/index.html;
i like that quote a lot.

doubt is needed.
I think its good to doubt even logic.
however, i think logic is one of the better tools to use in life.
all models seem to be false, some are just more useful.
i don't find much utility in believing in heaven. i know many do, but i don't.

Heaven by itself can be many things, its better to take a particular form and the system its a part of and see if the entire system is sound and valid with itself.

for example. an all knowing, all powerFull, all beneficial, creator god that is still involved in its creation, free will,fire and brimstone hell, etc. don't go together.


Edited by casper3912 (06/25/09 12:20 PM)

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#385794 - 06/25/09 12:22 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Unknown]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
Forget Logic and Reason, Doubt is besides the very definition of reason, without it your weak minded and can be lured to believe anything by anyone. Do you think i related to The Doktor's Philosophy without using reason and logic? All I'm saying is, do not stop doubting.
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#385796 - 06/25/09 12:34 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Rodim]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
Doubt can be a powerful tool but if all you do is doubt then how do you come to a conclusion? Isn't that what knowledge is about? Doubt built upon doubt leads to not knowing anything at all.

So I am saying doubt until you have come to a reasonable conclusion. I think it is up to each person to decide for them-selves weather or not they decide to be open to the possibility of an after life or not.
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#385799 - 06/25/09 12:57 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Unknown]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
Am i saying that its not a personal decision? All i meant was that its good to indulge in doubt, the choice is yours. that's not the issue here.
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#385801 - 06/25/09 01:14 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Rodim]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
Quote:
All i meant was that its good to indulge in doubt, the choice is yours. that's not the issue here.


I agree.

It's just you came off as if doubting an after life is a bad choice.

That's why I asked for your clarification so I can better understand where you are coming from.
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#385806 - 06/25/09 01:24 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Unknown]
Rodim Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 239
Quote:

I agree.

It's just you came off as if doubting an after life is a bad choice.

That's why I asked for your clarification so I can better understand where you are coming from.


You'd be surprised to find out how many people get misunderstood.

Vale.

Hail.


Edited by Rodim (06/25/09 01:28 PM)
_________________________
A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.

-Friedrich Nietzsche

The world is a tragedy to those who feel, but a comedy to those who think.

-Horace Walpole

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#385807 - 06/25/09 01:28 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: casper3912]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
Quote:
I think its good to doubt even logic.


How can you question the truth of something without using logic?

If you do this then do you not leave yourself open to bullshit?
_________________________









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#385817 - 06/25/09 03:15 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Unknown]
casper3912 Offline


Registered: 06/24/09
Posts: 30
logic is just another man made system, like math.
it seems to work, and work well.
if we use logic to determine the validity of logic,haven't we fallen into recursion? right now i'm useing logic to determine the validity of using logic to determining the validity of logic...interesting situations i get myself in uh? i consider logic as working well because it produces a lot of positive feelings and situations for me. it gets me what i want.
as far as telling me truth, well truth seems to be metaphor, reality an agreement.From the chaos of perception, we create objects. etc.

eventually fundamentals are found, and we stare at the absurdity of the unfounded.

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#385902 - 06/25/09 11:04 PM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: casper3912]
Sakura Offline



Registered: 07/01/08
Posts: 220
Loc: The Circus
I've read this thread with a lot of interest, so I thought I'd join in. In my personal thoughts: if heaven and hell do exist, I wouldn't worry too much. I've never done anything utterly wrong or evil so I don't see why I'd be sent to hell. All I was (and am) ever guilty of was living life in a way that suited me best, without breaking the law or doing other weird things. I mean seriously, what kind of an asshole would God be to send a person like me to hell and let a Christian sicko who raped his own sister into heaven? Hmm. Come to think of it.. Pass me the marshmallows grin
_________________________
"But I don't want to go among mad people," Alice remarked.
"Oh, you can't help that," said the Cat: "We're all mad here. I'm mad. You're mad."
"How do you know I'm mad?" said Alice.
"You must be," said the Cat, "otherwise you wouldn't have come here."
Alice didn't think that proved it at all: however she went on. "And how do you know that you're mad?"
"To begin with," said the Cat, "a dog's not mad. You grant that?"
"I suppose so," said Alice.
"Well, then, " the Cat went on, "you see a dog growls when it's angry, and wags its tail when it's pleased. Now I growl when I'm pleased, and wag my tail when I'm angry. Therefore I'm mad."

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#386181 - 06/28/09 02:41 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: Nemo]
iwnmutef Offline



Registered: 06/25/09
Posts: 64
*Thank* you, Nemo. Your post of 10/26/08 was the best arguing about Heaven, real or not, that I've *ever* seen *anywhere*.

Now, I may have been inculcated into a belief in reincarnation and a belief that Heaven is a temporary inbetween-state, but I've always been Satanist enough not to let that phase me into living for the Heaven-life I was taught about. And let me add that even in my seeming "memories" of between-life states, *in*-life states were always the primary focus of what was going on, emphasizing the importance of carnality at least in my own brain, if not actually between lives. More evidence, in other words, that teachings about Heaven make little difference "down here" to thinking people.

I am very impressed with your postings, quite generally speaking.

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#386191 - 06/28/09 08:52 AM Re: Okay. I'll play. [Re: iwnmutef]
Paul Powers Offline


Registered: 06/22/09
Posts: 28
Loc: Uk
The law of conservation of energy states that energy can not be created or destroyed it can only be changed from one state to another
Its a small consolation that when we return to the earth our energy will also return and enter the food chain, in turn it will become one with the trees, animals, soil and even the heat that warms the earth.

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#465602 - 12/08/11 05:41 AM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Evil_Eve]
Janina Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 1501
Loc: Center of my own Universe
Originally Posted By: Evil_Eve
What if Heaven is real...

A better question would be this:

WHO CARES? I don't care if there is some big Ju Ju in the sky. I simply don't give a good god damned. Go with God. sick

Quote:
what if pink unicorns are real?


OK, that cracked Me up. Thank you. I really needed to laugh today. jack



In my mind the question about what if there is a heaven or whath if there is a god judging human beings is not interested.
When I want to think some of these philosphical questions with my mind I do ask What was that what was before the god came or where the god was before he became a god?

With these questions I remember the answer that I, a human being, am the god for myself.

If somebody believes anything they want and it suites for their needs and purposes, thats great. People have the right to choose what they want to believe or not!

In my personal thinking this issue about heaven and god is bit escapist. It makes us escape the reality of this moment which is fantasy, not living in real world.

I don´t think the question about heaven or even hell is important to me. What in my life is important is live fully and fullfil my needs in this moment (which gives me opportunity to live in heaven all the time) and thinking about something after dead thing creates nothing to my experience about moment. Thats why I let smarter people worry about these things and use my life for living instead of that.

I do my rituals, take care of my job and give compassion for my loved ones and animals. Everything else is something which I dont feel quite interesting for me!

Hail Satan !


Edited by Janina Paasonen (12/08/11 06:10 AM)
_________________________
Devil´s Advocate

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#465634 - 12/08/11 02:01 PM Re: What if Heaven really exists? [Re: Janina]
LKRice Offline

CoS Priestess

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 6363
Please check the age of a thread before you reply to it.
_________________________
Director
Committee for the
Promotion of Vice and
Prevention of Virtue

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