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#36448 - 04/24/04 05:32 PM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Abbott]
Wonka Offline
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Registered: 11/02/02
Posts: 638
Loc: The City of Red Lights
Quote:

I agree with you regarding the mundane aspects of watching a piece of garbage simply fall asleep, although permanately, but the entertainment value would wear out fast due to this method. Hangings were a better spectacle, especially when the offender's head occassionally popped off!




So maybe all we need is a bloopers video.
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#36449 - 04/24/04 07:21 PM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Wonka]
Shiva Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 10/31/01
Posts: 2762
Loc: Ormond Beach, FL
So maybe all we need is a bloopers video.

There are already several of those out there. Faces of Death and the like. Although I strongly suspect that many of those are staged a bit.
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Rev. Shiva Rodriguez
Shiva's World / Headless Historicals / Siren Productions Media / Predatory Moon

"The ugliest of trades have their moments of pleasure. Now, if I were a grave-digger, or even a hangman, there are some people I could work for with a great deal of enjoyment." - Douglas Jerrold

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#36450 - 04/24/04 08:19 PM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Shiva]
Abbott Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 04/05/02
Posts: 186
Loc: Atlantic City,NJ
I think they are mostly staged, even so, they're good for a laugh. My favorite was the guy who leap off a building and slapped the awning before the pavement. The best part was the eyewitness, an obvious wino of some sort who stated," It sounded like a piece o' leva hittin' da flo'"(translation= a piece of leather hitting the floor" classic man on the street reporting!!

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#36451 - 04/24/04 10:03 PM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Shiva]
Wonka Offline
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Registered: 11/02/02
Posts: 638
Loc: The City of Red Lights
Thank you, I almost forgot about those videos.

Yes, I also heard that most of the material on Faces of Death are staged. There is another "brand" of the same material that claims 100% authenticity, Traces of Death.

Unfortunately, they both lack cartoon sound effects. It ruins the whole experience.
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Believe Nothing. Test Everything.

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#36452 - 04/24/04 10:09 PM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Wonka]
Shiva Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 10/31/01
Posts: 2762
Loc: Ormond Beach, FL
I've pretty much watched them all, usually for research when I was doing SPFX. Always going for the realism in my work. While comparing some of the footage to actual forensic stills, you can tell when some of them took a few liberties with the stage blood.

So, getting back on my original argument, if they have to stage deaths on a "real death" footage video in order to make them more interesting to viewers... people would be bored to tears with the lethal injections of today.
_________________________
Rev. Shiva Rodriguez
Shiva's World / Headless Historicals / Siren Productions Media / Predatory Moon

"The ugliest of trades have their moments of pleasure. Now, if I were a grave-digger, or even a hangman, there are some people I could work for with a great deal of enjoyment." - Douglas Jerrold

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#36453 - 04/25/04 04:18 AM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Josephine007]
Anonymous
Unregistered


I think your "stay at home mom" grant is a wonderful idea. I personally have to agree that's one of the big issues in today's society on top of people not taking responcibilites for their own actions. But I do agree with Shiva that letting big buisness have any say as to who is executed would be a very bad thing. I say make big profile executions pay-per-view and make 90% of proceeds go to charity (PPV has to get something or else they won't want to show it) and the lower profile executions could be on late night television or even half-time shows at football games. I know that may seem like some sort of twisted joke but I would prefer to see a child molester hung than seeing another washed-up Jackson show off her breast.

DatheR

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#36454 - 04/25/04 07:26 AM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Shiva]
Josephine007 Offline
CoS Priestess

Registered: 01/31/04
Posts: 620
Loc: Zero Point Field
The couch potatoes think he's guilty and there's a million in it for you if he hangs."

I agree. But it seems like we already have a jacked up system anyway. Off topic, I was listening to NPR and they were doing a piece on the public defenders in the Louisiana Parishes...

I am having trouble reconciling the fact that WE have to pay for the lawyers for these dipshits that break the law and that is costing an arm and a leg too....when you think about how much of our money goes to 'defend' so many idiots...*sigh*

I am sure you and I could figure out some way around it though....


Shiva and Josephine 2008!!!!
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Josephine Seven
Cherchez La Femme
"Test Everything. Believe nothing."

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#36455 - 04/25/04 08:08 AM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Shiva]
Ringu Offline


Registered: 02/01/04
Posts: 144
Loc: NRW, Germany, Earth
Quote:

"Never mind that the strong DNA evidence points to the contrary, your Honor. The couch potatoes think he's guilty and there's a million in it for you if he hangs."




Yes i agree completly - no one should be able to pay for a kind of life execution. It should be more like on a broadcast station that everyone in the country can recieve - without pay any extra money. It also shouldnt be all the day of course more like some special event - as deternment. I guess there are strange people out there that would need such events. Also the law would become a bid more harder - i would appreciate that way. Of course they have to be sure that they kill the right guy and not someone from the street who was just on the wrong time in the wrong place. They should have straight prooves for that action. But well if i can be sure because of such prooves that the person really deserves it because for example he/she killed a other person without any "valid" reason ( or you know there exist various strange people that given a reason that they act because of the call of god ( that same shall be also done if he/she act on the call of satan )) then i would watch it yeesss.
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#36456 - 04/25/04 08:51 AM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Josephine007]
Shiva Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 10/31/01
Posts: 2762
Loc: Ormond Beach, FL
Shiva and Josephine 2008!!!!

Do we get to redecorate that big house?

And now for a moment of pessimism regarding the proposed "stay at home Mom grant"...

On one hand, I'd love to see more people (both men and women) take more of an interest in raising their offspring. But it occurs to me that we already have something in place that encourages people to stay at home by giving them money. It's called the welfare system.

Just going from what I've seen with my own eyes, government hand-outs such as this seem to encourage many people to breed more (more babies = larger checks) but doesn't improve the parenthood skills by very much, if any.

I'd be more for the idea of setting up more work-at-home programs that would allow mothers (and fathers, if they so desired) to be at home more and work on a schedule around their children.

I don't have so much of a problem with public defenders, given the costs of legal fees that many people, however innnocent, would not be able to afford. I just wish they'd match the right public defender to the cases. I get more angry at hearing about the repetitive and expensive appeals process based on inefficient council when a green lawyer found him/herself defending a capital case.

A few years ago, I suggested that in capital cases we should pull from active lawyers who specialize in such things. Call it a civil duty expected from those who practice law. After all, the jury itself is made up of everyday joes who were chosen by lottery (in a manner of speaking) and they are not well-compensated for their time and yet are expected to fight it out until a verdict is reached. And my gut tells me that many of these people have a hardship in taking the days off of work for a lengthy trial... an inconvenience that a high-tag lawyer wouldn't suffer nearly so much from.

I know, it's a Robin Hood attitude in a sense. But it occurs to me that if we are all expected to participate as productive members of any society, we should be assigned the chores we are best equipted for. I wouldn't mind being summoned to lend a hand in a court of law on occasion if I knew the job was going to be done right the first time.
_________________________
Rev. Shiva Rodriguez
Shiva's World / Headless Historicals / Siren Productions Media / Predatory Moon

"The ugliest of trades have their moments of pleasure. Now, if I were a grave-digger, or even a hangman, there are some people I could work for with a great deal of enjoyment." - Douglas Jerrold

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#36457 - 04/25/04 03:30 PM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions
lucifer_dracul Offline


Registered: 04/04/04
Posts: 14
Loc: Ohio
My self-defense instructor in the police academy had an interesting theory. Since we let inmates on death row live so long we should have a televised execution that is much more brutal and use the money to pay his bill at the prison so we taxpayers don't have to. I think that is an excellent idea. The question is how much would you pay to watch an execution?
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#36458 - 04/26/04 04:02 AM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Shiva]
Josephine007 Offline
CoS Priestess

Registered: 01/31/04
Posts: 620
Loc: Zero Point Field
Do we get to redecorate that big house?

Could you just imagine? ! ? !

And now for a moment of pessimism regarding the proposed "stay at home Mom grant"...

Oh yes....I totally understand all your logical arguments. This was me being completely 'head in the clouds' about it...and working with the assumption there would be an element of having to EARN the 'grant'. You know, submit a thesis paper and credentials and documentation to show why you DESERVED the grant vs just showing up with a grubby paw out like a large percentage of welfare moms do (not ALL welfare cases are like that I do know). LIke how you would have to apply for and justify receiving a grant in a University setting...that idea. Again...in my little nirvana that would also be sans about half the current planet's population I don't even think for a moment it would be realisitc or work in the current setting.

I don't have so much of a problem with public defenders, given the costs of legal fees that many people, however innnocent, would not be able to afford.

It's not public defenders in general...it is more the folks that KEEP getting in trouble so we KEEP having to pay the fees. A one off, or even a two off...hell...I give you THREE 'free passes' but after that then it's just another form of welfare that encourages stupidity and irresponsibility.

I just wish they'd match the right public defender to the cases.

They were explaining why that was in the NPR bit. It was very interesting to hear how the case load is handled and dispersed.

After all, the jury itself is made up of everyday joes who were chosen by lottery (in a manner of speaking) and they are not well-compensated for their time and yet are expected to fight it out until a verdict is reached.

That's not a bad thought....

I know, it's a Robin Hood attitude in a sense. But it occurs to me that if we are all expected to participate as productive members of any society, we should be assigned the chores we are best equipted for. I wouldn't mind being summoned to lend a hand in a court of law on occasion if I knew the job was going to be done right the first time.

*nods* And I don't see it as 'Robin Hood'. Just as one is expected to participate and 'give' to their family, I see community service the same way. This is not to say I think we should all have to dote on the loosers of society....more like in a close knit community you can extend those family type actions and really end up with a better community because EVERYONE participates and does what they do best. A good example would be my neighbor...she is a fantastic woman and a stay at home mom. To afford to do this, she doesn't have a car. I was on vacation last week and had some errands to run and I asked her if I could take her around with me so she could get some done too. I didn't HAVE to do this but I knew it would help her and her husband (who works very hard so she can stay at home with the kids). Or if I am running to the grocery store I will send one of the kids over to see if she needs anything. What does she do for me? She keeps an eye on my house during the day AND my kids AND my husband. I have come home exhausted and found everyone outside playing and she tells me she already fed them dinner and then marches me upstairs to feed me so I don't have to cook. Same as my neighbor on the other side. I usually end up watering her lawn for her when I do mine but I will get up Saturday morning and find her out seeding and fertilizing HER lawn and she has already done mine since she bought extra.

In a 'perfect' world I think it would work well but we don't live in a perfect world so for now it just seems to exist in little pockets and spots.
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Josephine Seven
Cherchez La Femme
"Test Everything. Believe nothing."

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#36459 - 04/26/04 09:28 AM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Josephine007]
Shiva Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 10/31/01
Posts: 2762
Loc: Ormond Beach, FL
I don't even think for a moment it would be realisitc or work in the current setting.

Sadly, I don't either. Then again, my own approach doesn't seem to fly very well either... and it's something I tried to do myself. Since my own home business has been growing steadily, I thought to extend a hand to those who would like to make money while staying at home. (Not one of those scams... I just needed a few good people who could sew!)

If I had a dollar for everyone who showed interest in the idea of working from home, I'd be retired now. But what happens whenever a big job comes in? It always boils down to the residents of my own home to get the job done. To be honest, I dread the idea that the time will come that I won't be able to keep up with things and can't find decent help, no matter how flexible of working situation and pay scale I offer.

Then again, unlike the welfare system, I actually require people to do something for money.


*nods* And I don't see it as 'Robin Hood'. Just as one is expected to participate and 'give' to their family, I see community service the same way.

I've observed a trend, particularly in the younger generations, that goes around with the attitude that they are "owed something" by their communities. I'm not entirely sure how this came about, but it's annoying.

I am forever hearing horror stories from my mother, who teaches in a school for students who were literally kicked out of public schools. They steal things because "they are owed them", and if they are caught, it's your fault for catching them. Everything is "I'm owed", but Hell if I can figure out what great service to the community these people gave that we are so richly indebted to them.

The mentality is maddening, and no doubt lends a hand to the growing problems in our courts today. The adults responsible for them (the faculty of this school) literally have their hands tied when it comes to any type of discipline. And the juvie courts are a joke... and the kids know it. The parents are pathetic, many on welfare with ample time on their hands to actually help in the child-rearing process but choose not to.

Granted, I know this represents only a small handful of the population itself, but these are the types you find clogging our prisons and death row.

My thought is that we (as a community) give entirely too many hand-outs and slaps on the wrist... both in welfare and in our judicial system.
_________________________
Rev. Shiva Rodriguez
Shiva's World / Headless Historicals / Siren Productions Media / Predatory Moon

"The ugliest of trades have their moments of pleasure. Now, if I were a grave-digger, or even a hangman, there are some people I could work for with a great deal of enjoyment." - Douglas Jerrold

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#36460 - 04/26/04 10:58 AM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Shiva]
Abbott Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 04/05/02
Posts: 186
Loc: Atlantic City,NJ
You both have my vote! Do you want me to write you in?

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#36461 - 04/26/04 11:35 AM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions
Bill_M Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11547
Loc: New England, USA
>And if we have to start executing people for lighter
>crimes then fine by me. My hard earned tax dollars won't
>have to go to some asshole sitting around in a cell all
>day jerking off, getting high, and watching tv.

Unfortunately, due to the way the system works in the US, it actually costs more to execute a prisoner than to keep him alive. I do still favor capital punishment in principle, but I don't buy a lot of the common arguments from the "pro" side. Besides being more expensive, it's not much of a crime deterrant, and it certainly doesn't help with prison over-population.

Though this is all the more reason why I think the process calls for some reorganizing! I like the idea of televised executions, so long as it would really save money in the end.
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#36462 - 04/26/04 04:45 PM Re: Pubilc/Televised Executions [Re: Bill_M]
Anonymous
Unregistered


Well that's just it, instead of waiting around on death row for 15 years (if memory serves that's the average wait in California, my home state) but after a year they are executed. That means 14 years less of having to pay for them sitting around. As much as I don't agree with lethal injection being used for public executions the total cost with of the injection itself is around $87. A far cry from 14 years of having to bathe, clothe, and feed some child molesting, raping, or murdering bastard. Also to make executions much more common place not only would it free up prisons because the population would dwindle and the wait for death row inmates would be chopped into a fraction of what it was, but some little "G" who gets to turn on his t.v. (you know the one he stole from your house) and see his homeboy just seconds before that trapdoor falls out from underhim. I'm not racist in any way shape or form, but growing up in an area where you turn on the news and all you hear about are turf wars and having to deal with white kids trying to be "ganstas" walking around with a loaded "gat" on them just wishing they could use it for some street credit. Those of us who have had guns pulled on us for no reason other than being different and still have scars from asshole skinheads stabbing us for being "fags" want nothing more than for those who live by the sword to start dying at the end of a rope. And the execution would be paid for by Sprite™ and then whoever gets to provide his last meal gets a free ad just before he drops. For any of you who know about hanging think about this, viagra could take credit for his priaprism after his fall stops abruptly.

DatheR

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