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#375139 - 03/18/09 09:25 AM introduction
inky Offline


Registered: 03/18/09
Posts: 103
Loc: USA
Greetings. I have read as much on satanism as I could find (time permiting of course) and have found myself agreeing with the overall philosophy it has to offer. I look forward to future discussions.

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#375161 - 03/18/09 01:34 PM Re: introduction [Re: inky]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 12592
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Quote:
... found myself agreeing with the overall philosophy...


To begin then, what do you disagree with?

Issues you already agree with do not require discussion.

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#375184 - 03/18/09 09:02 PM Re: introduction [Re: Nemo]
inky Offline


Registered: 03/18/09
Posts: 103
Loc: USA
I hate to split hairs but Satanism is said to be the anti-religion but is described as a religion in various articles as well as the TSB itself.

I'm a little confused by that, however I believe in Magus Gilmore's forward to TSB, he described satinism as "religious philosophy" which I think means a form of structured intellectualism. Anton Lavey's writings being the groundwork and current members building on those ideas.

That's more of a pet peeve than anything else. I use the term "overall philosophy" because I am under the impression that it's constantly evolving.

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#375187 - 03/18/09 09:31 PM Re: introduction [Re: inky]
NapalmNick Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 08/23/08
Posts: 2153
Satanism is a religion because of its combination of philosophy and ritual. Both are written in books that have established the canon of Satanism.

While the individual Satanist does evolve, that is not to say that the philosophy veers away from the Satanic Bible.

Satanists are very diverse, but they all recognize the philosophy (and rituals) to be near and dear to them. Some Satanists, like myself, rarely use ritual. Others never perform a ritual in their whole life.

If we are to assume that ritual is necessary to make Satanism a religion, then those who don't use it could be labled "non-religious". However, Satanism as a whole is a religion.
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#375227 - 03/19/09 09:31 AM Re: introduction [Re: inky]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
Quote:
I hate to split hairs but Satanism is said to be the anti-religion but is described as a religion in various articles as well as the TSB itself.


Satan represents opposition. Satanism opposes all other religions because Satanism is the worlds first carnal religion. Hence it is the anti-religion.
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#375235 - 03/19/09 10:03 AM Re: introduction [Re: inky]
WolfMoon Offline


Registered: 04/03/06
Posts: 735
Quote:
I hate to split hairs but Satanism is said to be the anti-religion but is described as a religion in various articles as well as the TSB itself.


Satanism IS a religion. It's main focus is not merely fighting Christianity or some nonsense like that. Satan as a symbol simply opposes the death-loving, spiritual religions of the herd, and embraces a carnal, life-loving philosophy instead.

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#375241 - 03/19/09 10:47 AM Re: introduction [Re: inky]
Phineas Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 08/16/06
Posts: 8274
"...it's constantly evolving."

It is constantly adapting, but it is what it is. Satanism is based on the core principles expounded upon in the Satanic Bible. That doesn't change. The principles do not change.

The Satanic Bible is the bedrock of our religion.
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#375273 - 03/19/09 05:08 PM Re: introduction [Re: inky]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11565
Loc: New England, USA
To quote the ol' FAQ by Magister Paradise:

Satanism has been referred to as an "unreligion" in the sense that it does not subscribe to the notion of an anthropomorphic deity and, by extension, some being who must be worshiped, its most common misconception. Others say that Satanism is challenging popular notions of how 'religion' is defined, not content with the dictates of Judeo-Christian strictures. Both are valid opinions.

But for those who feel that deity worship and religion must be and always have been inextricably bound, it should be noted that Satanism's lack of deity belief and deity worship is not singular as Buddhism, Confucianism, and Taoism (all considered religions the world over) also share this viewpoint.



Personally I have no problem referring to Satanism as a religion.
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#375290 - 03/19/09 07:32 PM Re: introduction [Re: Bill_M]
Zaftig Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 3409
I've noticed, through browsing internet forums, that reasons to refuse viewing Satanism as a legitimate religion are:

A) often to do with an individual being bitter against organized religions

B) a desire to act in ways that are un-Satanic (usually involving illegal substances).

C) a bit of insecurity/hesitancy about fully adopting and committing to what Satanism means.

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#375292 - 03/19/09 09:11 PM Re: introduction [Re: Zaftig]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Originally Posted By: Zaftig



C) a bit of insecurity/hesitancy about fully adopting and committing to what Satanism means.


Oh no! Not the "commitment" discussion again! wink grin
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#375351 - 03/20/09 01:12 PM Re: introduction [Re: Zaftig]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11565
Loc: New England, USA
Originally Posted By: Zaftig
A) often to do with an individual being bitter against organized religions

Yeah, I suspect that's a big motivating factor.

One of the reasons I avoid the line of "Well Satanism is not really a religion. It's more of a [philosophy / fill in the blank]", is because EVERY religion does this. I have heard it all before:
"Well Christianity isn't really a religion. It's a relationship with Jesus."
"Well Judaism isn't really a religion. It's a convenant."
"Well Buddhism isn't really a religion. It's more of a journey."
"Well Mormonism isn't really a religion. It's more of a way of life."
Blah blah blah.

They do this because they obviously really want to feel that their religion is special and above the rest, not just another choice in the same category. Personally, I don't fear the comeptition!

I've also never understood the fuss over "organized religions". What does that term mean anyway? Is it any religion that has a name and more than 5 practicioners?
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Reverend Bill M.

http://www.devilsmischief.com: Carnal Comedy Clips, Netherworld Novelty Numbers,
New hour every week. Download the mp3 now!

http://www.aplaceformystuff.org: Tales of Combat Clutter and other Adventures

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#375355 - 03/20/09 01:44 PM Re: introduction [Re: inky]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1024
Inky,

Religion, anti-religion, philosophy, religious philosphy, overall philosophy... Why not, for the sake of discussion, dispense with all what it should/could be called, and instead deal with what it is: some kind of code.

Magus LaVey codified it, so let Us call it a code, or a set of rules, one that can be applied toward One's life, thinking, way of doing things, etc.

In Your original post, You stated that You agree with some aspects of the code.

You also elucidated that You perhaps disagree with or do not fully understand other aspects of it.

I think that idea--more or less--is what Magister Nemo was driving at in His question. It is a rather important question, for the answer to which at least bears on Your interaction here and, more importantly to You, if Satanism is really for You.

Any issues with the code?
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#375364 - 03/20/09 03:14 PM Re: introduction [Re: Bill_M]
Zaftig Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 09/23/06
Posts: 3409
In my highly unscientific method of collecting anecdotal evidence, I have noticed that if I press people on the "organized religion" point they usually bring up "wars" and "child abuse".

Of course, I think that these things can and most probably would exist regardless of which organization was enabling them. Your kid can get molested at the most secular kids camp just as atheists will want to conquer new territory and get rich doing it.

People have no sense of history.

I've had one or two snarky comments about Satanism not being a religion because they take some comments by LaVey (about all religion being a racket) and turn that sentiment into a reason for not calling it a religion, and not joining the organization. They cannot see the massive benefits of doing so.

Or they're insecure enough to think that by joining they are somehow being taken advantage of themselves. Although I suppose if they're not true Satanists, they are! wink

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#375444 - 03/21/09 04:26 PM Re: introduction [Re: Zaftig]
inky Offline


Registered: 03/18/09
Posts: 103
Loc: USA
Thank you all for the response.

Please excuse my earlier confusion. The explanations I've read have painted a clear picture and answered a few other questions I had about what Satanism represents.

I have no issues with anything codified in TSB. I'm on my third reading and still nod at the pages. Everything in it is pertinent to who I am and it's teachings have already impacted my life for the better.

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