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#37704 - 04/28/04 06:44 PM Labels/Definitions
GoldenCalf Offline


Registered: 12/03/03
Posts: 93
Loc: Huntsville, Alabama
My understanding:

Satanism is a religion built around a very sound philosphy.

A SatanIST is one who both practices the religion of Satanism and fits a certain personality type.

What if one agrees with the basic philosophy, but doesn't use the Satanic symbolism and ritual, and doesn't really fit the personality type?

For instance, he agrees that the carnal is a much more worthwhile pursuit than the spiritual, that indulgence is a virtue, that his own interests rightfully come before anyone else's, that earthly accomplishment is to be respected and striven for, that a healthy ego is a must, and that man's animal nature should be celebrated instead of hidden in shame. However, he finds no stimulation in the symbolic Satan, nor has he been particularly successful in the pursuit of earthly success. He is prone to self-doubt, occassional loss of self-control, laziness, bad habits (television and smoking, let's say), a few insecurities, and other imperfections.

What would this person be called? A Satanist? I think not. Then what?

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#37705 - 04/28/04 06:55 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Quaark Offline

CoS Reverend

Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 8824
I am not going to attempt to answer your question.

Others will do that shortly, with varying degrees of insight and courtesy.

I am however going to salute your honesty and clarity. I admire that.

Very Satanic.
_________________________
T’aa hwo’ aaji t’eego.

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#37706 - 04/28/04 07:01 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: Quaark]
GoldenCalf Offline


Registered: 12/03/03
Posts: 93
Loc: Huntsville, Alabama
Many thanks.

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#37707 - 04/28/04 07:01 PM Your Satan... My Satan... [Re: GoldenCalf]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3969
Loc: The Deep South
He is prone to self-doubt, occassional loss of self-control, laziness, bad habits (television and smoking, let's say), a few insecurities, and other imperfections.

You talk like you know the guy in person. What Satan are you talking about?

Satan is a symbol, and different people understand symbols in a different way. Satanists see Satan as embodiment of carnal existence and non conformism. That’s the way we interpret Satan. Other religions interpret Satan as a real guy with horns and tail who has some compulsion for collecting souls.

Looks like your Satan smokes and watches TV a lot... Mine doesn't, thought he drinks a lot of beer some times.
_________________________
You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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#37708 - 04/28/04 07:34 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Entity Offline

CoS Reverend

Registered: 03/23/02
Posts: 1773
Loc: Avalon UK
Quote:

However, he finds no stimulation in the symbolic Satan, nor has he been particularly successful in the pursuit of earthly success. He is prone to self-doubt, occassional loss of self-control, laziness, bad habits (television and smoking, let's say), a few insecurities, and other imperfections.

What would this person be called? A Satanist? I think not. Then what?




Does it matter?

What a person does is not what they are. And behaviours can be changed...
_________________________
~ Reverend Entity

Nothing is better than to live according to one's taste. - François Villon

Test Everything. Believe Nothing.

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#37709 - 04/28/04 08:15 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Shiboleth Offline


Registered: 01/06/04
Posts: 113
Loc: Alberta, Canada
"What would this person be called? A Satanist? I think not. Then what?"

I call them "most people".
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this is a recording...

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#37710 - 04/28/04 08:27 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11547
Loc: New England, USA
>For instance, he agrees that the carnal is a much more
>worthwhile pursuit than the spiritual, that indulgence is
>a virtue, that his own interests rightfully come before
>anyone else's,

I suppose you might agree with a few things found in Ayn Rand's Objectivism...
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#37711 - 04/28/04 10:17 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Hagen von Tronje Offline

CoS Priest

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 10121
I call them in need of a good dose of egotism and self-discipline. Many a worthwhile Satanist has come from hard beginnings to correct programmed problems.

If this fails, then I'd simply say that if they cannot taste the forbidden fruit, then at least they had the pleasure of glimpsing it. My recommendation at that point is to attempt to keep lessons learned in mind; i.e., apply what you can of Satanic principle for self-gain. No reason to throw out something good, even if you're only halfway using it.
_________________________
"The devil I'll bring you," answered Hagen. "I have enough to carry with my shield and breastplate; my helm is bright, the sword is in my hand, therefore I bring you naught."

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#37712 - 04/28/04 11:55 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Scratch Offline


Registered: 09/30/03
Posts: 207
Loc: Austin, TX
Quote:

What would this person be called? A Satanist? I think not.



There ya go! Not a Satanist. I hardly think it matters what this guy is, but it's good that you picked up on his laziness and loss of self-control. Perhaps you have been able to see the drawbacks of his life choices and grow from them.

It's also important to recognize that everyone has imperfections. We all make mistakes sometimes. What sets us above the herdlings is our ability to recognize our errors, rationalize our problems, and realize the improvements necessary for the betterment of the quality of our lives.

Remember that it's okay to make mistakes as long as they help you to learn and to improve the quality of your life.
_________________________
"Stupid people do stupid things... smart people outsmart each other... then themselves." --DDevil-SOAD

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#37713 - 04/28/04 11:57 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: Hagen von Tronje]
Scratch Offline


Registered: 09/30/03
Posts: 207
Loc: Austin, TX
Gorgeous. I should have read yours before making a similar post. Needless to say, I agree with you. LOL
_________________________
"Stupid people do stupid things... smart people outsmart each other... then themselves." --DDevil-SOAD

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#37714 - 04/29/04 12:17 AM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Discipline Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/25/03
Posts: 6796
Loc: Forever West
However, he finds no stimulation in the symbolic Satan, nor has he been particularly successful in the pursuit of earthly success. He is prone to self-doubt, occassional loss of self-control, laziness, bad habits (television and smoking, let's say), a few insecurities, and other imperfections.

What do you consider success? Are you currently happy with how your life is? Do feel there is something lacking? If so, fix it. A Satanist does not need to be a millionaire. A Satanist is someone who seeks out self-improvement for gratification. You can be a Satanist and work at JC Penny as long as you are happy it does not really matter. If you dislike any aspect of your life you shouldn't continue to subject yourself to it. Go out and get what is desirable.

I don't like the word self-doubt. I'd rather use the saying constructive thinking. Constructive thinking leads to self-improvement. Thinking your actions out clearly is beneficial. It nourishes confidence. Self-doubt is counterproductive. Thinking that you are destined to failure predisposes you to failure. Don't doubt yourself, know yourself, and improve yourself. I judge myself against my own standards. If I am lacking I fix myself.

There is a difference from loss of self-control and indulgence. One brings pleasure while the other is lazy and self-destructive. Occasionally enjoying the simple things in life such as lazyness is fun but you must understand that there are limits. Watching TV all day because there is nothing better to do is lazy. Watching TV because there is a show on that you really enjoy is indulgence. One is the zombie the other is the commander.

Insecurities can be overcome and become secure. Imperfection, well there is no such thing in my book. You can always improve. Just look at imperfection as a motivator to reach perfection.

Did I help any? You may not be a Satanist but these things are still useful tools.


Edited by Discipline (05/05/04 05:50 PM)
_________________________
"I've learned . . . that life is like a roll of toilet paper. The closer it gets to the end, the faster it goes." ~Andy Rooney

"At last I shall have time to devote myself seriously and freely to the destruction of all my former opinions." ~Descartes

“The first principle is that you must not fool yourself—and you are the easiest person to fool.” ~Richard Feynman

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#37715 - 04/29/04 04:26 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Nyarlathotep Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 08/10/03
Posts: 959
Loc: Nashville, TN
Quote:

However, he finds no stimulation in the symbolic Satan, nor has he been particularly successful in the pursuit of earthly success.



There are in fact many symbols for Satan; not just the ones we use. Maybe if you (or your friend) does some research...?

Quote:

He is prone to self-doubt, occassional loss of self-control, laziness, bad habits (television and smoking, let's say), a few insecurities, and other imperfections.



I call that just being human, something we Satanists all are. But they're nothing that can't be gotten over. I admit I have my fair share of bad habits, but I am getting over them.

If you or your friend aren't Satanists, that's perfectly okay. What's really important is that you all are honest with yourselves. Read the first of the quotes in my signature .
_________________________
"I think, therefore I am dangerous."

"So now you'll see that evil will always triumph...because good is dumb."
-Dark Helmet, Spaceballs

HAIL SATAN!!

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#37716 - 04/29/04 05:28 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: Nyarlathotep]
Dan_Dread Offline


Registered: 10/08/03
Posts: 523
Loc: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Quote:


"It's better to be hated for what you are than to be loved for what you're not."




I disagree. Being loved will always afford you more power than being hated, regardless of other factors. It's called lesser magic.
_________________________
"One thing I have learned in a long life: that all our science, measured against reality, is primitive and childlike and yet it is the most precious thing we have." - Albert Einstein --------------------

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#37717 - 04/29/04 07:23 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Anonymous
Unregistered


It is my perception that Satanism has nothing to do with Satan or any of the other "devilish" fantasy characters. There are many who follow the philosophy without knowing that such a cabal exists. Hell, I didn't even know I was a Satanist until half a year ago, but I haven't changed since that realisation.

Only those that have truely researched the religions and philosophies of the world can find the irony in calling this particular philosophy Satanism.

It doesn't matter what you call yourself, but I suggest, if you're interested, you do some research on the history of the religious world. Then you, too, could maybe take pride in calling yourself a Satanist.

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#37718 - 04/29/04 09:52 PM Re: Labels/Definitions [Re: GoldenCalf]
Sarn Offline


Registered: 03/18/04
Posts: 29
Loc: Long Island, NY
I don't think it matters if other people think you are a Satanist, it only matters that you know you are.

Changing the way you act just so you better fit what you or others think is the best fit for the Satanist mold is not the way to go. Satanism, for me, is about freeing yourself from constraints, if you have to do that by even lying to people, for instance saying you are not a Satanist, then Satanism has no problem with that. Lying to yourself is the true sin.

Are you happy with who you are? Great! No? Fix it!

I know a great deal of stressed out workaholics who could do with a bit more laziness in their lives.

I know some conceited mother fuckers who could do with some self doubt too.

I know some rigid perfectionists who could do with some loss of self control.

And if smoking and TV are among the worst of your bad habits you are better off then a huge percentage of the world.

And finally, the biggest factor, for me, concerning Satanism. There is no perfect. There is no perfect being, state of being, no transcendence, there is nothing better then what you have now. There are only better ways to use your time and energy and resources.

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