I have had some time to calm down and really think about what is truly bothering Me and I suppose it is several things. One of which has already been addressed by another.

I don't 'know' too many Satanist (that is offline) but those that I do share something in common with Me. An affection towards animals. I have yet to meet a Satanist that didn't on some level adore animals.

I was taken a back a wee bit (OK a lot) when I read that comment by Rodim.

I reckon you do not have to love animals to be a Satanist, but you have to have a disdain (or so I thought) towards ANY illegal/criminal activity. The crime alone should at the very least put a bad taste in the Satanist mouth.

I suppose that people are drawn to others who share some type of common thread with them, be it a love of music, food, art, etc.

I thought deeper still, and is it any strong stretch of the imagination that the people I gravitate towards love animals? Certainly not. I couldn't be friends with anyone who didn't like animals. What would We possibly have to talk about being that anything they had to offer Me in a relationship would be trumped out by My concern for animal welfare. I would talk about animals and he or she would roll their eyes.

I am no longer angry for the wrong reasons...I'm sort of just blown away. I have yet to meet a Satanist (as I said) that didn't like animals. I don't want to either. Is that fair enough to say?

Ben Franklin talked about the abuse of animals being a trait that most serial killers share. That is true (at least from My own studies on Serial killers). Dahmer started with road kill if I recall correctly and then worked himself up to killing his own animals and then...the rest is History.

I do not condone any illegal act and this includes acts of violence on helpless animals. I do care and I am only concerned with rubbing elbows with others that care. Sorry. I'm a bigot.

haha You say unstoppable, and I say that isn't true. I probably strolled into an argument I'm not willing to finish, but you sir do indeed vote with your money. If the majority decided to say no to the meat industry and its insane practices it would indeed change said practices to accommodate the public which it serves. You do have a say. You are not a slave.


And despite your kneejerk reaction, Phosis, I will agree with you on the matter that it is beside the point of this whole discussion overall. I just find it revolting when people assume an aire of unquestionable moral superiority when they do indeed indirectly cause a similar state of affairs to exist in the broader strata of their own society.

Sorry I touched a nerve, man. But that's my opinion.

High Priestess Nadramia spoke of Doctor Laveys love of his cat Zambezi in the The black flame #15/Anton LaVey memorial issue.


here is the quote:

The doctor would only describe Zambezi as a "jungle cat".He is small,but his coat is golden like a couger's,with the sort of fluffy,caramel colored belly fur you only see on wild felines.He is quixotic,very affectionate but capricious;he would test Doctors patience by running across the keyboards and resetting all the synthisizers."Damn it,Zambezi!" you'd hear from the kitchen,then the doctor would mutter something about letting the cat compose his own music.

Thank you high priestess Nadramia for this magical gem.

That was beautiful.

Thank you for sharing this.

Where in the meat industry? Which specific companies? Which plants are you referring too?

It's a pretty broad industry, with varying standards throughout. This discussion has been had before, and in all honesty, I really don't feel like getting into it again. You can go ahead and keep bringing it up, but you're missing the point of the original conversation, which pertained to a very specific act being committed. Any acts of "moral superiority" being committed here are coming from you, if anyone; the people in this thread were expressing their disgust for cat murderers, and you jumped in and suggested they stopped eating chicken. Two different ball games, pal, and if you can't tell the difference, that's your own problem.

No, I'm not a slave. And I do have a say. But it's not my prerogative to "do something about it." If you handed me a petition to sign to put a cat killer in jail, I'd do it, because that is an issue that matters to me, very specifically. I never once claimed to be a would-be PETA member, however, and I'm not gonna stop eating beef to prove a point no one else would give a shit about. Remember, Satanism is about reality first and foremost. Can large groups of people make a difference? Yes, sometimes. Is it very likely to happen in this case? Hell no. Anyone who thinks they are "making a stand" is being a self-deluded idiot, and there are all sorts of avenues of REAL ACTION they could be taking in order to protest acts that they do not approve of.

And besides, for the amount of money I spend on meat products, I might as well call myself a tree-hugging hippy. Them shits is way too expensive for my blood, and back when I lived in an unheated basement and cooked my food on a radiator, I learned to go a long time without meat. So if that is indeed my "vote", then I cast it a long-ass time ago.

Now where have I seen this addressed before?

Oh yeah, I remember:

"Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food."
http://www.churchofsatan.com/Pages/Eleven.html

Actually, I am not interested in "bringing it up" again and again either. I introduced the paragraph in question with "As an aside", as in "You ordered broccoli, but I'm giving you some rice too." I am not suggesting anyone join PETA or any other organization of imbeciles with unassailable beliefs that defy good sense and reason. I just think people should make individual choices from an educated standpoint. I also made it clear that I was walking into an argument that I wasn't interested in finishing, so don't worry about this being one of those internet discussions that refuses to die.



Did I allege it was? You assume a great deal, don't you? I was only stating that it would be wise to consider how one may personally take responsibility for the suffering of animals. The manner in which I said it was easy to take personally though, so maybe I was asking for it when I was on the receiving end of your bitch fit. Again: Sorry to ruffle your cantankerous feathers. "My bad, dude!"

Look, you decided to take what I said and run with it tacking on impotent personal insults for good affect. I honestly don't care if you disagree. You claimed the whole situation was "unstoppable", which you now admit was not a wholly accurate statement by allowing room for the possibility for change. That's all I have taken issue with personally. I just made a broad statement previous to you trying to verbally cut me down, but I already addressed that above.



And that reality is by its very nature subjective. Which is why I simply agree to disagree; Especially since our argument is off topic anyhow. My fault, really. I brought it up after all.

You make a good point about moral positions in regards to my own behavior though. Maybe I was posturing. I'll have to consider that.

You do know how to read, right? I already stated I support hunting - it does not logically follow that I am suggesting people should not eat meat. I am personally opposed to the fact that the animals currently available in the super market are raised in torturous conditions where they are not allowed to socialize properly or eat a diet naturally suited to them by evolution. I am opposed to the fact that the animals are covered in feces when they are killed, and so as a result are so ridden with disease that baths of chemicals and radiation are employed to cleanse their flesh of all the weird shit that permeates it. As a Satanist I believe in the natural order. I believe in the justice and wisdom of embracing nature as it is, and respecting its balance and the sanctity of all portions of it.

Just to clarify: It is natural and therefore morally correct for man to kill and eat animals. It is natural for humans to feel exhilarated and pleased while killing said animals, as he is urged on by all natural urges with pleasure. It is NOT natural to eat a piece of meat from a genetically modified life form that is raised submerged in shit, and separated completely from the natural order of nature! That's all I have to say on the subject. I am not interesting in discussing this matter further.

Well, personal opinions aside what this kid is accused of is a horrible crime, in MY opinion. He definitely deserves punishment, but as with most animal cruelty cases, will probably receive only a fine. I do not think the punishment any receive for that is near harsh enough. The one thing that does strike me about the character of animals though,is how forgiving they are. An animal can be beaten, starved, and forgotten, and if they can be rescued and receive food, shelter, and the all important LOVE they can once again become the loving companions most Satanists know them to be.

I only insulted you once, and that was when I called you an idiot because you said something idiotic. You're the one getting his feathers ruffled here, and I still stand by the fact that you were mistaking strong personal opinion for overblown self-righteousness.

As for your opinion on the natural order, and all of those things, I couldn't agree with you...well, in some respects, less. Once again, this conversation was had elsewhere (I don't remember where, or how long ago, sorry.) and my opinion about that is that food being processed in factories IS part of the natural order, because it doesn't make sense for 6 billion people to be hunting animals the natural way.

About them being slathered in shit and what not, I'd have to ask you once more what your sources are, because so far you have insinuated that this is how this entire industry operates, which can't be anything but complete and utter exaggerated bullshit. There are a lot of scare tactics out there used by environmentalist, like the whole "chocolate milk being made with milk filled with cows blood", and oftentimes, not a lot of information to substantiate them. I'm not ignorant enough to think that shabby practices NEVER happen of course, but I highly doubt they happen across the board.

I have nothing against hunting, but it is important to note that there is nothing good about hunting simply for sport. I am not implying you do, but you never specified how you hunt, and it has been a sensitive issue here in the past.

Anyways, I realize my original statement was a little harsh and out of line. It was never meant to be so effectively cutting, but yeah, it reads that way. I tend to write how I might talk, and you'd be surprised how much different the tone would be in person. I was actually a bit surprised that you thought I was mad, but it makes sense.

Cheerfully withdrawn, I do apologize for that, though I still uphold the points in my last post.

I'm sincere when I say I'm done arguing about this.

I'm not interested in scouring the internet sources, arming myself with rebuttles, and protracting this any further. I will however thank you for attempting to be civil. We're all different in how we perceive things. You seem like a swell enough guy.

If you're interested in learning about how your food is procured, though, a good pill-form source of fascinating little bits is the new film "Food inc." which goes over a lot of the crazy things that happen in our society's food supply.

Oh and I don't hunt. Hunting is an example I use of the most extremely natural state of affairs. There is a happy medium, which is to eat meat from animals that have been raised ranch style and allowed to engage in their natural grazing and herding behaviors. The animals live comfortably, in relatively natural conditions before being slaughtered. Of course this meat is more expensive, but it also tastes better. And in regards to feeding six billion people, that's a whole nother can of worms and I'm not even touching it.

It is ridiculous comments like that which gives me the urge to order a steak.

I hear there were places that did all-you-can-eat steak. I don't know that I've found this promised-land of the carnivores just yet... maybe I'm just not looking in the right cities.

Phosis,

The more I read, the more I like.

If only You could get Mr. Sellers' aberrant hand in the pic...

I fear that soon Slim will be performing his errand. Hopefully not!