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#393984 - 09/07/09 10:44 AM Why Can't We Grow New Body Parts?
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649


I thought this was particularly interesting.
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#393995 - 09/07/09 12:55 PM Question. [Re: Unknown]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

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Posts: 1649
After viewing this short clip do you think that science is currently pushing society towards a utopia?

I think that this is far from happening considering that any scientific improvement for the betterment of the biological system is thought of as playing god. Thus as a result there will always be those who deny or reject such advancement. In which case they will be left in the dust of those who seek out and accept this improvement.
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#394000 - 09/07/09 02:09 PM Re: Question. [Re: Unknown]
Hagen von Tronje Offline

CoS Priest

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 10118
What would suggest that even if science went forth uninhibited that the result would be utopic? Nothing we've seen so far has suggested it.

This isn't to say science is evil. Far from it. We're better off in terms of quality of life now than we were a century ago for certain. However, human nature hasn't changed at all.

Utopian visions usually involve a fairly egalatarian "everyone is happy" ideology. Besides the fact that this doesn't exactly mesh with Satanism, even if science were to grow to the limits of what we can currently even speculate on, such as:

- Medical breakthroughs extending life indefinitely and making injuries non-permanent
- Clean "unlimited" power
- Rapid, safe transportation
- Supreme hygiene
- Unparallelled entertainment

What would suggest that the common man would have access to this? Although there is a trend that eventually technology becomes cheap enough that most people can afford it, this is not a universal truth - look at medical technology. Cosmetic surgery has been around in various forms for centuries and has been used in a more or less modern capacity since the early 20th century, but it is still hardly an everyman luxury. The common man does not own a personal aircraft. He probably never will.

The best stuff is always kept by the richest sector and that will never change. Every social structure man has devised so far still had an upper class and they had the good shit. The majority still lived in squalor and will continue to do so.
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"The devil I'll bring you," answered Hagen. "I have enough to carry with my shield and breastplate; my helm is bright, the sword is in my hand, therefore I bring you naught."

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#394001 - 09/07/09 02:22 PM Re: Question. [Re: Hagen von Tronje]
reprobate Offline

CoS Warlock

Registered: 06/05/02
Posts: 7140
Loc: Canada
Suppose the common man did have access to every luxury. Would even that be utopian?

Or would people simply languish in vapid consumerism and petty self-importance, paving the way for the erosion of their freedoms?

If only I had a literary example.... wink
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#394003 - 09/07/09 02:27 PM Re: Question. [Re: reprobate]
Hagen von Tronje Offline

CoS Priest

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 10118
Exactly. Bottom line is, utopia is a pipe dream. Populated by not just philosophers but apparently Vulcans who never act on emotional impulse.

Just be glad you can flush your shit, it's not all that bad.
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"The devil I'll bring you," answered Hagen. "I have enough to carry with my shield and breastplate; my helm is bright, the sword is in my hand, therefore I bring you naught."

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#394005 - 09/07/09 03:19 PM Re: Question. [Re: Unknown]
Roho_the_Rooster Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/10/05
Posts: 6999
Loc: Pre-Apocalypolis
Originally Posted By: Unknown
After viewing this short clip do you think that science is currently pushing society towards a utopia?



If you dress a pig in a tuxedo, know what you got?
A pig in a tuxedo.

No matter what advances are made scientifically or otherwise, people remain what they are. Give them the capability to instantaneously broadcast the wisdom of the world, and they will fill it with videos of fart jokes and idiots getting hit in the balls.
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#394008 - 09/07/09 03:29 PM Re: Question. [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
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Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10562
Loc: England
>> No matter what advances are made scientifically or otherwise, people remain what they are. Give them the capability to instantaneously broadcast the wisdom of the world, and they will fill it with videos of fart jokes and idiots getting hit in the balls. <<

A better way of explaining it is the quote from Richard Burton as John Morlar in the brilliant film The Medusa Touch...


"Humans are inherently evil. We discover what powers the sun and we make bombs with it."
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#394022 - 09/07/09 06:31 PM Re: Question. [Re: Unknown]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6133
Loc: A Trailer Park
Quote:
... considering that any scientific improvement for the betterment of the biological system is thought of as playing god. Thus as a result there will always be those who deny or reject such advancement. In which case they will be left in the dust of those who seek out and accept this improvement.


Just to be a nit-picker (and because I'd rather not, as a conscientious consumer, be lumped together with hysterical jesus freaks)... I think there are a lot of reasons why people are wary of medical advances other than the "it's god's territory" fear. Plenty of perfectly valid reasons to be cautious about new and/or unfamiliar technology.

Science has a long history of being demonized. But, at the other end of the spectrum, there are some folks who seem to idolize it, mistake it for a kind of religion to worship. Either extreme is pretty disturbing.

A really fun, entertaining, insightful book on the history of the "Mad Scientist" scapegoat/stereotype is David Skal's Screams of Reason. Highly recommended.
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#394026 - 09/07/09 07:52 PM Re: Question. [Re: Shade]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

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Posts: 1649
Thank you Shade for the recommendation!

That is indeed a very valid thought to be considered. I view science as a wonderful tool to be used when it proves itself as benefitial. I can see the benefits of having our limbs and other body parts repaired as we age. But as far as something as deadly as nuclear bombs, I think that is worthy to fear since it can potentially kill me.
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#394028 - 09/07/09 07:56 PM Re: Question. [Re: Shade]
LucifersBlood Offline


Registered: 01/26/09
Posts: 21
Loc: Colorado
All I have to say is what is so wrong with this country that people can't accept this? Manipulated Christians... need to awaken to reality and gain some intelligence.
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#394033 - 09/07/09 09:06 PM Re: Question. [Re: Hagen von Tronje]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
Quote:
The best stuff is always kept by the richest sector and that will never change. Every social structure man has devised so far still had an upper class and they had the good shit. The majority still lived in squalor and will continue to do so.


Hmm not that I dispute this but technology may improve too fast for even the rich to keep up.

Shit does flow downwards but then even shit gets backed up sometimes.


Edited by Unknown (09/08/09 01:22 AM)
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#394096 - 09/08/09 06:50 PM Re: Question. [Re: Shade]
SINClair Offline


Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 320
Loc: Europe
Quote:
Just to be a nit-picker (and because I'd rather not, as a conscientious consumer, be lumped together with hysterical jesus freaks)... I think there are a lot of reasons why people are wary of medical advances other than the "it's god's territory" fear.



Can you give one example of another reason? Why are you wary of medical advances?
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#394097 - 09/08/09 07:02 PM Re: Question. [Re: SINClair]
Quaark Offline

CoS Reverend

Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 8781
Originally Posted By: SINClair

Can you give one example of another reason? Why are you wary of medical advances?


You're kidding, right?

"Medical advances" is a nice clean euphemism for the incredible series of historical fuckups, that is the beta-version guinea pig testing on the human herd, before feedback on what didn't quite work, and lawsuits, and legal statutes, and beyond all else, ego and the profit motive, force further progress, to where the "advance" can be used with confidence.

Thalidomide anyone? How bout a nice silicone breast implant? Or the first version of an artificial anything? Latest cure for itches? There's thousands of examples.

Not complaining mind you; it's just what is.

Always let other people's bodies be used to work out the kinks of the latest "advance" - THEN use it!!

coopdevil
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#394137 - 09/08/09 11:46 PM Re: Question. [Re: SINClair]
Hagen von Tronje Offline

CoS Priest

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 10118
For some reason drug commercials always end in a long list of warnings about how this may cause vomiting, dizziness, thoughts of suicide, depression, and risk of stroke.

Yeah, nothing to worry about with medical advances. They just make you want to kill yourself if you avoid a stroke!
_________________________
"The devil I'll bring you," answered Hagen. "I have enough to carry with my shield and breastplate; my helm is bright, the sword is in my hand, therefore I bring you naught."

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#394139 - 09/08/09 11:54 PM Re: Question. [Re: Hagen von Tronje]
Philotechnic Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 08/02/07
Posts: 745
Loc: NC, US
I'm just waiting until they have to start saying, "Warning, may cause diarrhea, vomiting and mild death."

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