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#394629 - 09/13/09 03:21 AM Re: English / Off-Topic [Re: Frosty]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1020
Quote:
It's the same mechanism, not the same scale; especially not in modern society. We still have wisdom teeth and appendixes, yeah? Tribe mentality is a left over triviality.


That is quite an interesting way to look at charity, and that it could be an inherited vestigial behavior is entirely possible. I likely have much vestigial behavior from say, childhood. While I am uncertain of how much nature versus nurture affects human behavior, I think both definitely play a role. Nice. This is something I will think about for a while.

Quote:
Even human action is the path of least resistance. Even it appears otherwise, it's to avoid something more complicated, like guilt, for example. Humans aren't above physics.


I do not quite agree, or perhaps I misunderstand something fundamental--I am no physisist. I think that humans may or may not be "above physics" as you put it, and really I might say "beneath physics". I think that humans do not necessarily act on all information available to them, and may not even be aware of some information at all. Ignorance can obscure the path of least resistance. Flowing water or electricity, on the other hand, appears to use all information available for it to take the path of least resistance. There is nothing hidden from water or electricity for it to somehow flow otherwise, uphill or through an insulator for instance.

I do think that humans seek the path of least resistance, however. (And, I am not just trying to play word salad here or match wits as it were.) The idea of charity as a vestigial behaviorial mechanism for survival even makes sense in that respect. I think humans seek the least resistant path with only the information they have available and choose to consider, and in doing so, take whatever path seems least resistant. In other words, humans have to think, weigh options, and make decisions (or not), and water just flows.

Am I making much sense?

Thanks for the reply, Frosty. You have given me some ideas to consider, and I am curious of your thoughts on the seek/take argument I posed.
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#394630 - 09/13/09 03:22 AM Re: English / Off-Topic [Re: Frosty]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1020


Edited by Vitaeviternus (09/13/09 03:24 AM)
Edit Reason: Duplicate Post
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#394631 - 09/13/09 03:22 AM Re: English / Off-Topic [Re: Frosty]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1020


Edited by Vitaeviternus (09/13/09 03:25 AM)
Edit Reason: Duplicate Post
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#394632 - 09/13/09 03:22 AM Re: English / Off-Topic [Re: Frosty]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1020


Edited by Vitaeviternus (09/13/09 03:26 AM)
Edit Reason: Duplicate Post
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#394633 - 09/13/09 03:29 AM Re: English / Off-Topic [Re: Phineas]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1020
Magister Phineas,

His post was in reply to me. I cannot say for sure that he is experiencing the same thing, but the board has been acting funny for me, posting many copies of my replies upon submission.
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#394634 - 09/13/09 03:29 AM Re: English / Off-Topic [Re: Phineas]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1020


Edited by Vitaeviternus (09/13/09 03:34 AM)
Edit Reason: Like this one.
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#394648 - 09/13/09 07:30 AM Re: Lavengro [Re: TheAbysmal]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
Originally Posted By: Vitaeviternus
... the hamster with a pancake on his head was cute.


Well, at least you didn't call Original Sly a hamster. grin

(Hint: Pancake-bunny is a bunny, not a hamster. I'm afraid that is the limit to what I can contribute to this thread. I'm going to go put a pancake on my head now. smile )
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#394667 - 09/13/09 12:52 PM Re: Lavengro [Re: Shade]
Frosty Offline


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 9
Loc: Washington State
Originally Posted By: "Vitaeviternus"
I do not quite agree, or perhaps I misunderstand something fundamental

Allow me to clarify; human psychology is not above physics. Consider this: An object in motion tends to stay in motion, and if a wo/man leaves her/his romantic partner especially for another one, there's a good chance s/he'll leave that one for another again. A girl I knew back in highschool left a friend of mine for me, then left me for another friend, then left him for a coworker all in a span of two years.
An object at rest tends to stay at rest, and the longer an individual adheres to a routine or specific way of life, the more difficult it is to adjust to any other. Institutionalization is an adequate example: convicts committing crimes right before they're about to get out of prison because they now fear the outside just as much as they used to fear the inside. It also works with relationships: the longer one exists, the less likely it'll end.

Originally Posted By: "Viv"
I think humans seek the least resistant path with only the information they have available and choose to consider, and in doing so, take whatever path seems least resistant. In other words, humans have to think, weigh options, and make decisions.

And with that consideration, take the least difficult path. At that point, it was simpler as a whole for the individual not to be entirely informed.


Edited by Frosty (09/13/09 12:54 PM)

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#394668 - 09/13/09 01:13 PM Re: Lavengro [Re: Frosty]
verszou Offline



Registered: 09/05/07
Posts: 1812
Loc: Denmark
Originally Posted By: Frosty
Originally Posted By: "Vitaeviternus"
I do not quite agree, or perhaps I misunderstand something fundamental

Allow me to clarify; human psychology is not above physics. Consider this: An object in motion tends to stay in motion, and if a wo/man leaves her/his romantic partner especially for another one, there's a good chance s/he'll leave that one for another again. A girl I knew back in highschool left a friend of mine for me, then left me for another friend, then left him for a coworker all in a span of two years.
An object at rest tends to stay at rest, and the longer an individual adheres to a routine or specific way of life, the more difficult it is to adjust to any other. Institutionalization is an adequate example: convicts committing crimes right before they're about to get out of prison because they now fear the outside just as much as they used to fear the inside. It also works with relationships: the longer one exists, the less likely it'll end.


Physics often get abused by people who want to add some extra credibility to their arguments, even though the examples they apply physics to had nothing to do with that area in the first place.

The examples and the anecdotal evidence you bring out here has nothing to do with physics but a lot to do with human psychology. The laws of physics you mention are based on general repeatable experiments. You now select anecdotal stories and subgroups of people and try to pass it off as some convergence of two areas that does not exist.

All I need to do is bring about af few other anecdotal pieces of 'evidence' of people who "got around" in their youth and ended up "settling down" with one partner and your whole alleged proof falls apart.
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#394669 - 09/13/09 01:15 PM Re: BOB [Re: Frosty]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10566
Loc: England
Frosty,

I agree with what you're saying in regards to human psychology.

Off topic, but...

No real reason or problem, I'm simply curious. Are you a member of the Church Of The Sub-Genius? I ask because that's "Bob" you've got as your avatar.
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#394673 - 09/13/09 02:39 PM Re: Lavengro [Re: Frosty]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1020
I had considered the idea that information gathering itself contributes to resistance. I wondered if that is where you might have gone, and you did. I was trying to avoid that area, not because I feel it is damning to my argument necessarily--and it could be--but because I lack the language needed to state what I mean exactly and understandably.

I am not disuaded, but I also think you present your position well, and I am thinking on it. And, yes... Your character is quite shining through your posts as you stated in your introduction. smile
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#394675 - 09/13/09 02:58 PM Re: People Don't Give a Shit about You [Re: TheAbysmal]
Evilives Offline


Registered: 08/29/09
Posts: 14
I don't give. Not even a shit.
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#394678 - 09/13/09 03:19 PM Re: People Don't Give a Shit about You [Re: Evilives]
Frosty Offline


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 9
Loc: Washington State
Originally Posted By: "Strongbone"
No real reason or problem, I'm simply curious. Are you a member of the Church Of The Sub-Genius? I ask because that's "Bob" you've got as your avatar.

Oh I'm familiar with "Bob". I'm as much a member as you really can be.

Originally Posted By: "verszou"
You now select anecdotal stories and subgroups of people and try to pass it off as some convergence of two areas that does not exist.

I'll provide scientifically demonstrable evidence for my argument when you can provide scientifically demonstrable evidence against it.

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#394679 - 09/13/09 03:41 PM Re: People Don't Give a Shit about You [Re: Frosty]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1020
Well, the Church of the Sub-Genius has quite the funny site. I am not entirely sure what to make of it, but I just had to order some of their books. Very interesting in a "Real Ultimate Power Ninja" kind of way. smile
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#394696 - 09/13/09 07:30 PM Re: People Don't Give a Shit about You [Re: Frosty]
John Prophet Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 04/06/09
Posts: 992
Loc: My suburban lair
Originally Posted By: Frosty
I'll provide scientifically demonstrable evidence for my argument when you can provide scientifically demonstrable evidence against it.


Verszou is correct, what you’re describing is not physics. At best you’re just using physics as an analogy for psychology and social interaction.

He doesn’t need to “provide scientifically demonstrable evidence against it” because your argument has no real scientific basis to begin with (and I would think that this should be obvious).

All he was saying was that what you’re talking about has nothing to do with physics and he is absolutely right!


Edited by John Prophet (09/13/09 07:30 PM)
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