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#409056 - 01/17/10 04:48 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
NapalmNick Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 08/23/08
Posts: 2151
I cannot truly comprehend what I have not experienced. I can only imagine. Some will argue that this too is empathy, but whatever works, works.

What would destroy me might be a pinprick to another, and vice versa. I can make generalizations, but I cannot read people's minds. Also, the physical ways of reading a person can vary depending on the individual. Some are more stoic than others, etc.

But yes, this is an essential tool for Lesser Magic. For those who are less in tune with the minds of others (such as myself) there are short-cuts that can be learned, and while it is difficult it also helps you understand more about yourself.
_________________________
"Logic is the beginning of wisdom, Valeris; not the end." --Leonard Nimoy as Captain Spock in The Undiscovered Country

"May the forces of evil become confused on the way to your house." --George Carlin, Playin' With Your Head

"[There is] no contradiction between saying 'evolution has no purpose' and 'organisms have purposes'; just different vocabularies for different levels of description." --Sean Carroll

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#409057 - 01/17/10 04:55 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: NapalmNick]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10568
Loc: England
>> What would destroy me might be a pinprick to another, and vice versa. <<


All that is just semantics, Nick.

Being selfish is also a normal human attribute.

But, mark my words, being downright mean-spirited is the sign of a truly impoverished ego. A truly wretched person who deep down inside, hates themselves. Their hatred of the world is a projection of their own inner feelings.

I love the world. And I like humanity as a whole - with all its foibles. And unlike a lot of people here, I am not afraid of admitting and acknowledging my susceptibility to emotions - because I am not trying to hide behind a big, tough, "Satanic" facade.





_________________________
"u.v.ray is truly an outsider, yet he's also a member of a club that includes greats such as Bukowski, Fante, and Salinger"

www.uvray.moonfruit.com





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#409058 - 01/17/10 05:07 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: J. Favenris]
verszou Offline



Registered: 09/05/07
Posts: 1812
Loc: Denmark
Originally Posted By: Favenris
How do you feel about this earthquake? Do you feel sympathetic towards its victims, or enjoy that it's nature's form of decreasing the human population? Any opinion is welcomed.


One of my first thoughts was "Couldn't have happened to a more fucked up place", because we know that the country as barely keeping together as it is. And not very surprisingly it is now descending into barbarism.

After that my thoughts went to the Danish film-maker, poet, TV commentator etc. Jørgen Leth who lives there when he is not working. So I was worried about whether he had been there and whether he was alive or not. It turns out that he was lucky.

And I must admit that the third train of thought was the very cynical "I wonder how long it will take before the first fake charities turn up", because I could see on twitter how all kinds of people were retweeting "Donate to this" messages, and in very emotional moments like when we hear about natural disasters and are reminded that we are mortal and this could potentially happen to us, we tend to disengage the critial thinking that would filter out scam artists if they approached us on a regular day.

Personally I'm not donating, but I'm confident that my government will do something - that's part of our semi-socialist way of life here (not trying to be political in any way, just clarifying how things work here, since it is very different from how it is done in the US).
_________________________
While having never invented a sin, I'm trying to perfect several.

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#409059 - 01/17/10 05:10 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: J. Favenris]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
Originally Posted By: Favenris
Do you feel sympathetic towards its victims, or enjoy that it's nature's form of decreasing the human population?


Interesting choices. smile

Do I or don't I care. How or what or why. I feel like that's something for me to settle with myself, in the privacy of my own skull. I'll tell you one thing though; I don't want to care. I don't have the stamina for it.

When reading about/experiencing cases like this, I try to consciously compartmentalize. Doing differently costs me. Dwelling on it for too long feels like a big crushing wave of brain-bruise. I am not apathetic but really wish I was. I mean genuinely, not just the pretense. There's a price to pay for compassion. A price that can throw my internal books badly out of balance.
_________________________
"What happens in the shadow, in the grey regions, also interests us – all that is elusive and fugitive, all that can be said in those beautiful half tones, or in whispers, in deep shade." ~ The Brothers Quay

We're Just Regular People

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#409062 - 01/17/10 05:13 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
NapalmNick Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 08/23/08
Posts: 2151
Sorry for the word games, I did not intend them.

Quote:
Whoever thinks that constantly being a petty asshole is Satanic is a shit-hole of a human.

This is something I posted earlier in this thread.

As much as I dislike most of humanity, I can't pretend that I'm not human. Anyone who has experienced compassion from another knows how good it feels. The same goes for more intimate emotions such as love.

I can't blame anyone for having their heart in the right place. Because that is something I know.
_________________________
"Logic is the beginning of wisdom, Valeris; not the end." --Leonard Nimoy as Captain Spock in The Undiscovered Country

"May the forces of evil become confused on the way to your house." --George Carlin, Playin' With Your Head

"[There is] no contradiction between saying 'evolution has no purpose' and 'organisms have purposes'; just different vocabularies for different levels of description." --Sean Carroll

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#409065 - 01/17/10 05:51 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: NapalmNick]
Original Sly Offline


Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 205
Loc: New Zealand
I just want to put this out there, but with such an emotionally loaded subject of discussion, there was bound to be some really good points made. Reverend Daark and Reverend Strongbone and NapalmNick have all said things in this forum which I think with further reflection will help me in my path.

I want to draw attention to the following quote by Reverend Strongbone:

Quote:
Both empathy and sympathy are essential attributes of lesser magic. An inability to comprehend people and human suffering puts us at a distinct disadvantage in dealing with other people.


Bravo, good Sir. That is not something I'd ever thought before. It will serve me well!
_________________________
"It stands to reason that where there's sacrifice, there's someone collecting sacrificial offerings" - Ellsworth Toohey, Ayn Rand's The Fountainhead p.637

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#409069 - 01/17/10 06:21 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: reprobate]
Spelled Moon Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 12/25/08
Posts: 1691
Originally Posted By: reprobate
38% of the population of Haiti is 14 years of age or less. That's thousands of kids dead, thousands more who are now homeless, because of poverty. Whatever the country's problems, they are the ones who suffer and who are going to inherit it.


From all the points said here, this one strikes the most... It's really something what no one wishes to live, and inherit, and be marked by it.

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#409070 - 01/17/10 06:22 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: Original Sly]
Shade Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/08/06
Posts: 6135
Loc: A Trailer Park
I'd only add that I think there's a big difference between inability and unwillingness. Empathy does have its advantages but I also think it can be an Achilles' heel. Something that may appear to be or actually be exploitable.

Color me conflicted. smile
_________________________
"What happens in the shadow, in the grey regions, also interests us – all that is elusive and fugitive, all that can be said in those beautiful half tones, or in whispers, in deep shade." ~ The Brothers Quay

We're Just Regular People

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#409071 - 01/17/10 06:49 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: J. Favenris]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3969
Loc: The Deep South
My feeling about the earthquake? Fear and worry.

Why? Because of the only reason it will affect me personally.

I live in Miami, a city with an already large Haitian community. I'm worried about a massive exodus of Haitians and the effects it will have on this city.

You may remember the massive immigration of Cubans in 1980 and the astronomical increase in crime and violence that it brought to Miami.

I fear a similar phenomenon happening now.
_________________________
You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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#409078 - 01/17/10 08:11 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: Drake_Bamboozle]
Mr. Obsidian Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 3120
Loc: Ohio
Isn't the absence of empathy also the mark of a sociopath?

Quote:

I love the world. And I like humanity as a whole - with all its foibles. And unlike a lot of people here, I am not afraid of admitting and acknowledging my susceptibility to emotions - because I am not trying to hide behind a big, tough, "Satanic" facade.

Well said.
I have a simultaneous fondness and contempt for humanity-at-large. I've long felt that curmudgeonry stems from the disappointment in seeing how the human animal--with all his wondrous potential--so often squanders his virtues and turns his habitat to shit. Mankind is composed of one part brilliance and two parts tragedy.
_________________________
~ Mr. Obsidian (JP)

Olio/Etcetera

Flesh and Bones
_______________

“For those who believe in God, most of the big questions are answered. But for those of us who can't readily accept the God formula, the big answers don't remain stone-written. We adjust to new conditions and discoveries. We are pliable. Love need not be a command nor faith a dictum. I am my own god. We are here to unlearn the teachings of the church, state, and our educational system. We are here to drink beer. We are here to kill war. We are here to laugh at the odds and live our lives so well that Death will tremble to take us.”
~ Charles Bukowski


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#409080 - 01/17/10 09:30 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: Old_Pig]
Phineas Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 08/16/06
Posts: 8265
Puerto Rico has just as much to worry about, if not more, than Miami does.
_________________________
"Consensus is the absence of leadership." Margaret Thatcher

"I'm fascinated with how primitive the human mind still is. It can be misdirected so easily." John Gaughan


"Success is uncommon. Therefore, not to be enjoyed by the common man." Cal Stoll

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#409085 - 01/17/10 09:58 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: Pablovilla]
Quaark Offline

CoS Reverend

Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 8840
Your comparison between conditions in Southern California and Haiti is utterly, completely ludicrous.
_________________________
T’aa hwo’ aaji t’eego.

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#409086 - 01/17/10 10:28 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: J. Favenris]
Lust Offline


Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 4214
Great news: I was not there nor was anyone that I care for.
_________________________
�Love is one of the most intense feelings felt by man; another is hate. Forcing yourself to feel indiscriminate love is very unnatural. If you try to love everyone you only lessen your feelings for those who deserve your love. Repressed hatred can lead to many physical and emotional aliments. By learning to release your hatred towards those who deserve it, you cleanse yourself of these malignant emotions and need not take your pent-up hatred out on your loved ones.�
Anton Szandor LaVey, The Satanic Bible

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#409094 - 01/17/10 11:51 AM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: J. Favenris]
Direktor Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 01/12/08
Posts: 499
Whenever something like this occurs, regardless where, I tend to think about animals first. I always have. And with the exception of the few organizations that provide food, medical, etc where they can, nonhuman animals are essentially abandoned.

Yet, they can (and will) survive.

Quite remarkable, and they don't need a penny from celebrity saturated telethons, either. wink

It would just mean more to me to know my $50 bought a couple of bags of dog food, or treated an injured cat. Just saying...
_________________________
"A complete education in Satanic philosophy is available at your local video store."
-Magistra Blanche Barton, The Church of Satan


"I have studied many philosophers and many cats. The wisdom of cats is infinitely superior."
-Hippolyte Taine



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#409106 - 01/17/10 01:58 PM Re: The Haiti Earthquake and Natural Disasters. [Re: J. Favenris]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12990
Loc: The Solid State
When something like this happens, my feelings tend to be mixed.

On the one hand, I feel bad for the children, the creatures, and the other innocents who are suffering through no fault of their own, and who are having to struggle against incredible odds, just to keep their heads above water. I recognize that life isn't always fair, and that it doesn't always automatically reward hard work, good works, or good intentions.

(Though, I admit I sometimes end up on fence with children, depending, because today's innocent-looking waif may very well become tomorrow's jihadist or Janjaweed-ist or fundamentalist, and either way, they're another mouth to feed, and they may come to represent yet another car on the road--so!)

On the other hand, I also feel anger, disdain, and contempt towards those whom I see as perpetuating, exacerbating, or contributing to the problem. How and where I decide to point that finger tends to depend on different factors.

And, yes, right or wrong, my extremely-claustrophobic inner ecologist does breathe a sigh of relief when it sees the death toll from this kind of event, just as it automatically seizes up in response to birth rate and population stats, and articles about Octo-mom or the Duggars wink.

I think Haiti actually has a real opportunity here to rebuild themselves in a new image, but I'm not at all confident that either we, or they, or anybody else, will seize it. Even when you aren't dealing with corrupt governments or corroded systems, knowing just how to allocate funds or direct manpower so that you'll get full bang from your buck takes a lot of foresight and insight, because humans tend to think in terms of the "right now," and act accordingly.
_________________________
"Gentlemen, the verdict is guilty, on all ten counts of first-degree stupidity. The penalty phase will now begin."--Divine, "Pink Flamingos."

"The strong rule the weak, and the cunning rule over all." HS!

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