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#431472 - 09/08/10 09:31 AM Amusing Picture
dan724 Offline


Registered: 08/25/10
Posts: 2
I found this picture thought it relevant. It perhaps belongs in the "Satanism by example" forum if someone wants to post it there but I am not allowed.

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#431473 - 09/08/10 10:15 AM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
MoongleMoose Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 11/09/09
Posts: 76
Loc: South O' Sydney
Great poster, probably something you'd see at an Atheist motivation convention. Thanks for the post, pic has been saved!
laugh

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#431476 - 09/08/10 11:44 AM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
LordofDarkness Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 757
Loc: Tennessee, U.S.
That's a very good poster!

It's very precise on how it explains the universe and the world being meaningless. Very informative for the uninformed.
_________________________

"Any group or collective, large or small, is only a number of individuals. A group can have no rights other than the rights of its individual members." - Ayn Rand

"Laws are there for a reason. You may not agree with them but you gotta obey them. Nobody wants to be in court." - Sonic the Hedgehog

"Satanism is not a white light religion; it is a religion of the flesh, the mundane, the carnal - all of which are ruled by Satan, the personification of the Left Hand Path." - Magus LaVey

"Test Everything, Believe Nothing." -

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#431482 - 09/08/10 01:32 PM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
Venom Offline


Registered: 04/15/10
Posts: 295
Loc: In the Belly of the Beast.
I like it. Thanks for posting.
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#431488 - 09/08/10 04:10 PM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
I actually disagree with this poster in some respects.

Choose what you want to find meaningful and live, create, hate, cry, destroy, fight, and die for it.

Sounds like martyrdom to me.
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#431494 - 09/08/10 07:13 PM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
Lust Offline


Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 4214
Satanism distinguishes a morality that is strong and healthy. The Satanist is aware that he/she is constructing it. This morality presents us with meaning and makes for vibrant life.

The poster and its message is obviously promoting nihilism. If this works for anyone then have at it. I agree with Nietzsche and view it as a danger. Why devalue life? Through valuation people face danger, hard reality and take risks. Fuck Emo Culture! Fuck Nihilism!

Hail Satan!
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�Love is one of the most intense feelings felt by man; another is hate. Forcing yourself to feel indiscriminate love is very unnatural. If you try to love everyone you only lessen your feelings for those who deserve your love. Repressed hatred can lead to many physical and emotional aliments. By learning to release your hatred towards those who deserve it, you cleanse yourself of these malignant emotions and need not take your pent-up hatred out on your loved ones.�
Anton Szandor LaVey, The Satanic Bible

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#431502 - 09/08/10 08:17 PM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: Lust]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
Quote:
Why devalue life?


Exactly!

I'd also like to add that the Satanist cherishes the world in which we live. Satanism is a WORLDLY religion for a reason.

Also the world is an anchor for survival. There is no life after death so in essence what you see is what you get.
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#431504 - 09/08/10 08:24 PM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: Lust]
RandomStranger Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 03/09/05
Posts: 2770
Loc: Here.
Originally Posted By: "The Big Lebowski"

Donny: Are these the Nazis, Walter?
Walter Sobchak: No, Donny, these men are nihilists. There's nothing to be afraid of.


My first thought looking at the picure. It reminds me that there are people out there who want others to be as unhappy and disillusioned as they are.

What's so Satanic about prosthelytizing one's personal philosophy on a poster around town?
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#431528 - 09/09/10 02:01 AM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
MoongleMoose Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 11/09/09
Posts: 76
Loc: South O' Sydney
This is true, but is it not also true that objects are meaningless unless we (humans) assign meaning to those?

Quote:

Choose what you want to find meaningful and live, create, hate, cry, destroy, fight, and die for it.


This is true in almost every form in the world, no matter what culture in society. This statement, I find to be a more advertisement of this way of thinking as well as an exploitation. To that end I agree Tier Instinct on its nihilistic and 'emo' nature.

However at the end of the day... the statement is indeed true from an objective point of view. In a nut shell... we have all these amazing feelings and emotions, yet it is up to the individual on how we go to assign meanings and cultural identity to those. The exact opposite being that everything HAS meaning, and that meaning is and always was there is a very Theistic form of thinking, I've tended to find.

I'll go through the examples given:

Live - Broad term, but we find meaning in what does it for us and thus assign that meaning to "Live" our lives.

Create - Every individuals creative interests are those that have meanings, whether be individually assigned, or culturally assigned.

Hate - Once an object has been assigned meaning, is it not natural to hate those who wish to refute you and your meaning?

Cry - Expansion of hate. Cultural and individual meanings when assigned are those that also assign emotions unto them, including 'crying'.

Destroy, Fight, and Die - Now these are interesting, and are yes I agree a form of martyrdom. All of these are currently evident in our society, not just in the past. Of course the biggest exmaple we can find to this are the fanatical muslims who will DESTROY, FIGHT and DIE for THEIR meanings and values... however what they can't seem to grasp is the idea that THEIR meanings and values are man made... not by a god.


We don't have to agree with it, but this author of this poster is spot on. I do think he's a bit of a silly ducky for putting the "DESTROY, FIGHT and DIE" part in there... as it more or less condones martyrdom and other dumb ass related behavior.






Edited by Maikeru (09/09/10 03:19 AM)

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#431535 - 09/09/10 03:58 AM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
Machismo Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 02/05/10
Posts: 1132
Loc: New Jersey
I dislike "Die for it" as it can prompt the donning of dynamite underwear, but delete those words and the remaining message of the signage under discussion is an accurate rendition of my own view.

Two questions, and my answers:

1. Do we discover meaning, or create it? I answer, the latter.

2. Is meaning imposed on us by the universe, or on the universe by us? I answer, the latter.

Earth, flesh, choice, and doubt shall overcome God, soul, law, and faith. Spirit is a Euclidean quadrangle, in that, if three of its angles are known, the fourth is determined by unyielding logic. Given earth, flesh, and doubt, we cannot remain logically consisten unless we take in choice as the fourth unholy perspective, and that is all the signage under discussion is really saying. No God, only earth; no soul, only flesh; no faith, only doubt; given all that, we are left with no law, only choice. This is more complex than mere nihilism. It is nihilism without man but with him it is something else entirely. Out of the chaotic, impersonal, amoral flux emerges that which can choose order, choose the personal, and even choose morality - your own self. What else is I-Theism but this? We cannot be our own gods and then ask the universe what our lives should mean. Rather, from the Olympus of our own thought, we utter, "Let there be," and if we are brave enough, and strong enough, and cunning enough, and prudent enough, then our word shall be made flesh, and pitch its tent among men.
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#431545 - 09/09/10 07:18 AM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
dan724 Offline


Registered: 08/25/10
Posts: 2
I too, dislike the "Die for it" section of the poster but it is a fairly natural continuation of the rest of the sentence for most people. It wasnt intended to be perfect, as I imagine the person who wrote it has no knowledge of satanism. Most of the rest of it seems decent.

I wasnt planning on posting this about town, or using it to proselytize at all and was unaware of it ever being used for that. It was intended to be an amusement. I have not the time, energy or inclination for telling others "how they should live their lives".

I dont think this poster devalues life either or promotes any philosophy that would be palatable or recognizable to a nihilist. It simply acknowledges that life has no *inherent* meaning. This doesnt mean that we cant assign it one if we like and doesnt mean we cant assign it as the most important thing. Most nihilists get stuck on this point and never make it any further. The poster makes it a point to go further and continue past simply moping about the fact that the universe has no inherent purpose.

To each their own. Thanks all for the replies.

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#431585 - 09/10/10 12:17 AM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
Cryptodelic Offline


Registered: 07/17/09
Posts: 134
Loc: Seattle
Don't eat the menu, or as Polish-American scientist and philosopher Alfred Korzybski remarked that "the map is not the territory", encapsulating his view that an abstraction derived from something, or a reaction to it, is not the thing itself.
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#431588 - 09/10/10 01:27 AM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: dan724]
TheAbysmal Offline


Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 1024
That brings to mind this, which is not a painting. wink

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Refuse to die.

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#431601 - 09/10/10 07:25 AM Re: Amusing Picture [Re: Machismo]
Machismo Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 02/05/10
Posts: 1132
Loc: New Jersey
Below the line of dashes is a cut and paste from something I posted Downstairs. I think it is appropriate to this thread, as one of the subtexts I discern here is the amorality of the universe in general and what that means for man. In my view, because the universe is amoral, a system of morality cannot be discovered, but can only be created. The universe in general does not impose morality on man, but man can impose morality on the universe. This kind of moralist would be in the same broad category as the architect or the engineer, and it may be symbolically poignant to some of us that Howard Roark was an architect, and John Galt, an engineer. This kind of moralist would be an avatar of the will to power, and an epitome of the I-Theist. How might such a one proceed or at least begin? See below.

------------------------------------

If we proclaim our will to be moral as something we are imposing by our own fiat onto our own lives, then we would reasonably ask ourselves what a minimum requirement for any moral system would have to be. I think precluding unprovoked murder would have to be that minimum requirement, for if a system doesn't at least do that, then we are living under a might is right intellectual regime, the very definition of amorality.

To preclude murder, we would have to uphold the value of human life. Value must be to something. Let's call that something, X, and the value of human life to X, v(X). Both X and v(X) must be demonstrable. Furthermore, X must be something in which we somehow participate, or else we have no reason to care. Let's call our participation in X, which must be demonstrable, p(X). Finally, v(X) must be categorical (unconditional) rather than contingent (conditional) or else we might well be signing our own death warrants.

Some (none of us on this message board, probably) would posit X to be God. But if X were God, then X wouldn't be demonstrable, nor would v(X) be demonstrable. Rejected.

X could be the State, and if so, X would be demonstrable, and v(X) would in most cases be demonstrable, and p(X) would be demonstrable, but v(X) would be contingent rather than categorical, since a citizen can become a net burden, so if we choose the State as X, we might be signing our own death warrants. Rejected.

X could be the ecosystem, and if so, X would be demonstrable, but v(X) wouldn't be. Rejected. [Note: Remember that v(X) is the value of human life to X. It isn't the value of X to human life.]

X could be civilization, and if so, X would be demonstrable, and v(X) in some cases would be demonstrable, and p(X) would be demonstrable, but v(X) would be extremely contingent, as very few individuals would be missed by civilization. Rejected.

X could be your family and friends, and if so, X would be demonstrable, and v(X) presumably would be also, but p(X) for me wouldn't necessarily be demonstrable with respect to you. Rejected.

X could be yourself, and if so, X would be demonstrable, and, barring lunacy or idiocy, v(X) would be also, but p(X) for me would of course be false with respect to you. Rejected. However! If we make X the self as a class, such that any self would be X, then X would be demonstrable, and, barring lunacy or idiocy, v(X) would be also, and p(X) for anyone would be demonstrable, and, barring lunacy or idiocy, v(X) would be categorical. We have a winner! We will make X the self as a class! X will be any self!

But look what we've done! We've made the value (of its life) to any self our reason for precluding murder. It would be reasonable for us to extrapolate that principle such that the value (of anything) to any self would preclude us from destroying or otherwise making unavailable that thing which is valued. We would reasonably conclude that if we want possession of, access to, or control of anything at all that some self values and currently possesses or controls, we must ask for it, or bargain for it, since we can't otherwise make it unavailable to that other self without violating the moral regime we are voluntarily imposing on ourselves due to our sovereign will to be moral. Negotiation would be mandatory.

Thus our will to be moral became the will to preclude murder, which in turn became the will to respect the value of anything to any self, which in turn became the will to negotiate.

Seems reasonable.
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