Page 3 of 7 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 >
Topic Options
#439262 - 12/03/10 05:38 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: Hagen von Tronje]
John Prophet Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 04/06/09
Posts: 996
Loc: My suburban lair
Originally Posted By: Hagen von Tronje
Africa and S. America, and parts of Asia, are becoming drastically overpopulated, and white populations in western nations are slowing down while immigrants breed vigorously.


I’m still of the opinion that those Africa, S. America, and Asia countries that you are talking about, will eventually follow the trends set by white/western nations as they become more urbanized and economically prosperous. I see this idea of populations slowing down their breeding as being a natural, reactionary step in this social/economic progression.

Since many of the more well developed nations, from many parts of Europe, to the U.S., to Japan are experiencing this leveling off or even drop in population, then I must conclude that this is a natural result of the type of culture which pragmatically arises from such developed environments. In many ways, this makes perfect sense (better means of birth control and less desire to take on the responsibility of having children do to various selfish motivations, convenience and general quality of life).

It’s just that some countries are behind others in this because their environments haven’t changed enough or for long enough to bring about this cultural shift. The more westernized some of those African, Asian and South American countries become, the more they will take on the reproductive characteristics of western countries since that will be the most pragmatic and convenient thing to do in adapting to their new culture, social and economic environment.

Of course this kind of thing will take some time, but I think that it will happen at a relatively accelerated or exponential rate compared to what we have seen so far.

Or, to really simplify things, overpopulation will work itself out in a fairly non-dramatic way.
_________________________


Top
#439265 - 12/03/10 06:13 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: Virus9]
Discipline Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/25/03
Posts: 6796
Loc: Forever West
Yes, definitely.

A toast with Dr. Pepper it is!
_________________________
"I've learned . . . that life is like a roll of toilet paper. The closer it gets to the end, the faster it goes." ~Andy Rooney

"At last I shall have time to devote myself seriously and freely to the destruction of all my former opinions." ~Descartes

“The first principle is that you must not fool yourself—and you are the easiest person to fool.” ~Richard Feynman

Top
#439266 - 12/03/10 06:21 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: Roho_the_Rooster]
Discipline Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/25/03
Posts: 6796
Loc: Forever West
Yes, I agree. We are not running out of land. There is plenty. But the issue then becomes do we want more land devoted to housing people and feeding people? I sure don't. I like spaces that I can run and hide from it all.

And yes again. Politics plays a major role in food resources and how they are displaced. The real question is should it be given out in charity or horded for those who live in privileged conditions? That is a question I am not certain on and neither can make a moral or economic decision about.

>>I also understand that most populations are having less children. That may not bring about zero population growth; but it does slow down the exponential factor.


This one I am not sure is correct. I think modern nations are having lower child births, but having an increase in immigration. Other parts, such as South America, Asia (minus Japan), and Africa are having a large problem with birth rates in comparison to housing, food, and employment.

>>All of these larger issues have so many factors that the best we can hope for is to form our own opinions based on the information we have, keep an open mind in the scientific sense and go from there. It just seems that when I hear a crisis gain popularity, there always seems to be a hook. Someone is making money. That doesn't mean there is no substance to the claims. It just makes me skeptical.

See, now this I think is a rational approach.
_________________________
"I've learned . . . that life is like a roll of toilet paper. The closer it gets to the end, the faster it goes." ~Andy Rooney

"At last I shall have time to devote myself seriously and freely to the destruction of all my former opinions." ~Descartes

“The first principle is that you must not fool yourself—and you are the easiest person to fool.” ~Richard Feynman

Top
#439269 - 12/03/10 06:45 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: Delta]
anna Offline


Registered: 09/27/10
Posts: 222
Loc: Poland
Quote:
If only they had more condoms in places like Africa.


One Ugandan doctor said: If a man's shirt is torn, you can be sure his condom is torn, too. If people live in extreme poverty they will not think of contraception. Often they just don't care what will happen to their kids.

Children are valued in African countries mainly because they help with domestic and agricultural work. Generally, people tend to have more children if they live in the country, because the more hands there are to work the better. In towns people have a different mentality as they are mainly consumers, they receive income for their work. Children are completely dependent on their parents and they do not contribute to the wealth of the family.
_________________________
Just gonna stand there and watch me burn. Well that's alright because I like the way it hurts.

Top
#439270 - 12/03/10 06:45 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: SatAnonymous]
Discipline Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/25/03
Posts: 6796
Loc: Forever West
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overpopulation

"Concern about overpopulation is relatively recent in origin. Throughout history, populations have grown slowly despite high birth rates, due to the population-reducing effects of war, plagues and high infant mortality. During the 750 years before the Industrial Revolution, the world's population hardly increased, remaining under 250 million.[11]

By the beginning of the 19th century, the world population had grown to a billion individuals, and intellectuals such as Thomas Malthus and physiocratic economists predicted that mankind would outgrow its available resources, since a finite amount of land was incapable of supporting an endlessly increasing population. Mercantillists argued that a large population was a form of wealth, which made it possible to create bigger markets and armies."
_________________________
"I've learned . . . that life is like a roll of toilet paper. The closer it gets to the end, the faster it goes." ~Andy Rooney

"At last I shall have time to devote myself seriously and freely to the destruction of all my former opinions." ~Descartes

“The first principle is that you must not fool yourself—and you are the easiest person to fool.” ~Richard Feynman

Top
#439273 - 12/03/10 08:09 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: anna]
Delta Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 12/18/07
Posts: 6755
Loc: Nar
Originally Posted By: anna
If people live in extreme poverty they will not think of contraception. Often they just don't care what will happen to their kids.


Now I wonder why they don't think to use condoms? Maybe because your fuhrer is lying to them. No, no that can't be it. It must be because they don't care about their kids. You guys have been a great inspiration for them- Save the sperm, forget the kids. Use 'em as slave labor and if they don't obey, stone them like the bible says. I'd sooner trust my offspring to the african slave trade than one of your priests anyhow...
_________________________






Top
#439293 - 12/03/10 11:51 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: SatAnonymous]
Pablovilla Offline



Registered: 06/26/09
Posts: 267
Loc: Victorville, California
There are plans in the works to solve the problem of overpopulation, but they are not overtly talked about.

One of those is United Nations Agenda 21 for sustainable development. This includes biodiversity and keeping people from developing all the land on the whole planet.

There are some people such as us that have become used to a lifestyle that uses more resources per person than most people live like in the rest of the world. I do not want to go down in living standards to support more people on this planet, and I'm sure that many others feel the same way.

Nature will solve the problem if we do not, or it might be a one world government that solves the overpopulation, or WWIII.

Only time will show how it plans out, and WikiLeaks might give us more insight on this as well.
_________________________
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting a different result - Ben Franklin

Top
#439314 - 12/04/10 02:27 AM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: John Prophet]
Hagen von Tronje Offline

CoS Priest

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 10146
That's very optimistic, but I disagree.

First, the US has one of the lowest population densities in the west, especially if you discount countries with vast tracts of uninhabitable artic tundra (namely Canada and Russia). So to say that urbanization helps, isn't really upheld. Especially as some of the shittiest nations on earth have extremely high population densities (Bangladesh?).

Second, many of these nations now have access to modern technology, but fail to put it to the same use. Indeed, the population problem is caused in part by our attempts to spring this technology on an ignorant and backwards populace. As it turns out, Kipling's idea of the White Man's Burden was quite stupid, not because of some PC anti-racist bullshit but because we tried that and it has failed miserably.

Third, I would say that many of the countries in question have reached a point of no recovery. The real key is education - western nations have an educated populace that is equipped to deal with technology. But how the fuck are you gonna educate millions upon millions upon millions of people who are scarcely literate, if that? You won't, there isn't enough manpower and money in the world to provide education to that many people even if they were motivated to learn, which is doubtful itself.

Fourth, culture is proving to be more insularized that we like to think. Sure, cultures soak up all kinds of things through contact, but they also retain their fundamental traits often in spite of the sometimes major changes that come about from such contact. Sometimes this works fine; Japan has formed a coherent, self-sustaining culture after modernization yet retains a very, very different culture from the west. Often, however, it doesn't seem to work out at all. Arab countries have certainly soaked up lots of western ways after acquiring wealth through oil, but it hasn't really worked out quite so well for them, has it?

Finally, there remains the fundamental fact that certain regions are fucked in terms of natural resources. The US is powerful for a number of reasons, and not least among them is uncontested control of a continent rich in resources. Europe is economically potent due to millenia of technological advancement and terraforming, and the fact that Europe has a pretty damn nice climate overall. When you compare the agricultural potential of Germany or France or the US to Somalia or Iran or Indonesia, etc etc, it becomes obvious who is going to do better. Fine farmland means plenty of food, food means leisure, leisure means education and technology which means power and wealth and comfort.

Japan would look like an exception to the above statement, but compare to New York City - NYC is an economically powerful "region" but it's entirely dependent on the rest of the nation to allow that, much as Japan depends on the rest of the world for import/export, to a degree much greater than most developed nations. To put it another way, it is one viable economic solution but it's also an exception and limited one. New York City works fine as a part of the greater US, but the US could only support so many cities of that kind (and indeed several such cities are now impoverished, such as Detroit, Cleveland, etc). So it is with the world; we can handle having Japan, but it seems doubtful that you could just turn every region devoid of stores of natural resources into an industrial and commercial powerhouse of that kind.

As for why white folks (and I do mean white folks, because even within western nations, non-whites tend to breed a hell of a lot more) are breeding less and less...good question. I could speculate that white culture has simply reached a degree of individual selfishness that we now consider quality of life a greater concern than reproduction, which is quite a feat when you think about it. But that's idle speculation, and I doubt if anyone has a definitive answer.
_________________________
"The devil I'll bring you," answered Hagen. "I have enough to carry with my shield and breastplate; my helm is bright, the sword is in my hand, therefore I bring you naught."

Top
#439319 - 12/04/10 04:08 AM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: Hagen von Tronje]
Zsche Offline



Registered: 04/17/09
Posts: 158
Loc: Where the 5.56 casings fall...
Originally Posted By: Hagen von Tronje
As for why white folks (and I do mean white folks, because even within western nations, non-whites tend to breed a hell of a lot more) are breeding less and less...good question. I could speculate that white culture has simply reached a degree of individual selfishness that we now consider quality of life a greater concern than reproduction, which is quite a feat when you think about it. But that's idle speculation, and I doubt if anyone has a definitive answer.

Indeed Priest Hagen von Tronje -

Originally Posted By: Anonymous1
And if we get overpopulated, how can we decrease the number of us?

Selective Cannibalism?

Couldn't certain responses of this thread be interpreted as the practical application of Pentagonal Revisionism point #1 by those who may or may not be psychotic and religious?

My curiosity overwhelms me...
_________________________
Originally Posted By: Phineas
My suggestion to you, besides obtaining a copy of The Satanic Bible and reading it, is to immerse yourself in the information contained at the Church of Satan website.

Originally Posted By: Hagen von Tronje
You can't guzzle whiskey and pinch pretty ladies' asses when you're dead.

Originally Posted By: Roho_the_Rooster
Love life. Live life. Don't fuck with people unnecessarily. Don"t let other people fuck with you. Simple guidelines that that will help you to make informed, intelligent and Satanic decisions.

Originally Posted By: Callier
Constructive criticism is one thing but people that just point blank tell others what they should be doing with their lives without any kind of permission can eat a bag of hairy balls.

Top
#439320 - 12/04/10 04:26 AM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: Midnight]
munt Offline


Registered: 09/13/10
Posts: 23
Loc: Land of viscosity
Originally Posted By: Midnight


The Australian Government proved their ignorance about 6 or 7 years ago when they introduced the 'baby bonus' where women were paid up to $5000 when they had their baby. When they ended it a couple of years ago the concluding comment from the treasurer at the time was that the baby bonus policy did everything it intended by successfully increasing the birth rate and population of Australia. I thought it had been introduced to support newborns financially not to increase the voting population of future governments!!!



I thought this a rather cynical attempt at providing future support for the aging population.
The general consensus is that it increased the population of the lower socio-economic class and sales of bigscreen TVs.
_________________________
Existence consumes time.

Top
#439321 - 12/04/10 04:28 AM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: Hagen von Tronje]
John Prophet Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 04/06/09
Posts: 996
Loc: My suburban lair
Those are all very good points and I appreciate your explanation. You brought up some things that hadn’t occurred to me.

“Fine farmland means plenty of food, food means leisure, leisure means education and technology which means power and wealth and comfort.”

This was probably the biggest problem in what I was thinking. Although I understood most of this chain of thought, I hadn’t factored in the “farmland” aspect of it. I was working under the assumption that food scarcity wasn’t actually the issue and it was just a matter of the economics of shipping it to some of these places and storing it. Basically, I thought the problem was not so much a lack of food or ability to produce enough food (globally) but a lack of money in certain regions, to have that food imported. Though looking at now, I can see how I may have been mistaken.

And as you stated, that is what would lead to the leisure and prosperity necessary for what I was talking about.

“I could speculate that white culture has simply reached a degree of individual selfishness that we now consider quality of life a greater concern than reproduction, which is quite a feat when you think about it.”

I tend to believe that this is the case and although it may not be possible to do, it would certainly be nice if we could get other cultures to adopt the same mentality.

“So it is with the world; we can handle having Japan, but it seems doubtful that you could just turn every region devoid of stores of natural resources into an industrial and commercial powerhouse of that kind.”

I guess I was working under the assumption that this type of industrial and commercial growth was the eventual destiny of most major cities and highly populated areas around the globe. But now that I think about it, that isn’t necessarily the case at all.

“The real key is education - western nations have an educated populace that is equipped to deal with technology.”

In a way, this parallels something that Nick said earlier in this thread-
“This is why I think assimilation into a secular and science-friendly culture is key.”

“Fourth, culture is proving to be more insularized that we like to think. Sure, cultures soak up all kinds of things through contact, but they also retain their fundamental traits often in spite of the sometimes major changes that come about from such contact.”

I don’t entirely agree with this. I don’t think it’s just a matter of “contact” or one culture rubbing off on another, it’s a necessary and pragmatic adaptation to a change in the social (and in the case of urbanization, physical) environment, based on economics and convenience. The environment dictates that people act a certain way and they will naturally adapt and over time, change their behavior based on that.

I don’t see any reason why, if given enough time and exposure to the right environment, the rest of the world wouldn’t began acting in a way that we see westerners acting now. It may take a couple of generations but there’s no reason to think that it’s impossible. Change the environment, material trappings, conveniences and options, and you can change the culture.

An example of this might be a developing nation that suddenly has a bunch of American fast food chains spring up within it. Something like that will change the physical landscape of the country as well as what people eat, and how they buy their food. It will also change their employment experiences. It could also affect how they view money or the value of the food that they order. And all of those things could lead to other, secondary changes in how people do things and view things. Other industries will spring up in response to these changes. The first generation that grows up in that environment could be radically different, in many ways, from the generation before them.

I honestly don’t know how realistic or unrealistic it would be to modernize a much greater portion of world, but I do agree that I was being a little optimistic.


Edited by John Prophet (12/04/10 05:13 AM)
_________________________


Top
#439344 - 12/04/10 02:38 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: SatAnonymous]
SINClair Offline


Registered: 10/06/08
Posts: 320
Loc: Europe
The Muslim are out-breeding every other race-religion-nationality-culture put together. Within a couple of decades, every single human in the planet will be a Muslim and as soon as that happens, they will all commit a mass suicide so they can all be in paradise with their Allah.

It is the transgression of mankind to its destruction, as once predicted the Greek philosopher, Aristotle.
_________________________
"Wer Nichts Wagt, Kann Nichts Verlieren"

Top
#439353 - 12/04/10 03:55 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: SINClair]
SatAnonymous Offline


Registered: 11/27/10
Posts: 85
Loc: Nowhere over the rainfall.
Originally Posted By: SINClair
The Muslim are out-breeding every other race-religion-nationality-culture put together. Within a couple of decades, every single human in the planet will be a Muslim and as soon as that happens, they will all commit a mass suicide so they can all be in paradise with their Allah.

It is the transgression of mankind to its destruction, as once predicted the Greek philosopher, Aristotle.


Isn't it a conspiracy theory? And as I heard it's about Europe only.
Humanity was different thousand years ago: people's lifespan, capacity, thoughts...etc. We just change our 'forms'. Every newborn is a copy. And copies are different always. Human now is not the human thousand years ago. Also we have the constructive side for balance too (more in women), not only the destructive (more in men). As a result, I think we won't destroy our race, but once we may run out of resources or something 'bigger' will (no more Sun or meteors...etc).

Overpopulation will not kill humanity, but decrease our life's quality.


Edited by Anonymous1 (12/04/10 03:57 PM)
_________________________
~ Might is Right ~

Top
#439357 - 12/04/10 04:44 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: Delta]
anna Offline


Registered: 09/27/10
Posts: 222
Loc: Poland
Quote:
Now I wonder why they don't think to use condoms? Maybe because your fuhrer is lying to them.


Oh I forgot. The pope forbids using condoms. So every night our guys check under the bed if the pope isn't hiding there. If he isn't, they can go on using condoms and doing other things. But seriously speaking, are these people kids? Don't they have their own reason? In the article, you posted, we can read that most of them don't agree with the pope's words, so probably they don't care about contraception because they have other problems.

As regards these young victims of priests, I just wonder where their parents were. Because most of them had parents. Do you need extremely high IQ to learn that your kid is being raped? The sad truth is that some people are only good at producing children, as it doesn't require too much effort, but they are less skilled in bringing them up. So they hope that the Country or the Church will take care of their offspring.

In the poor and overpopulated regions of the world people have sex and give birth to lots of children because they are used to it. It is natural and they do it without thinking. If they can't afford to feed their children, they just hope that the problem will solve itself. And even if their kids die so what? Many people die there from famine so they are used to death.
_________________________
Just gonna stand there and watch me burn. Well that's alright because I like the way it hurts.

Top
#439359 - 12/04/10 05:02 PM Re: Overpopulation? [Re: anna]
Delta Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 12/18/07
Posts: 6755
Loc: Nar
Agreed to some extent on the last bit, there are animals that reproduce in numbers and hope a couple live, and there are animals that produce a few offspring and protect them. But the rest of what you wrote...

The Pope might not be hiding under your bed but God sees all, doesn't he? And the Pope is his official spokesperson. You've proven a most unCatholic sort of Catholic so it doesn't surprise me you ignore the Vicar of Christ when it suits you. I wonder why you consider yourself a Catholic at all when you shuffle off your state of grace so often. Now don't get me wrong, the less Christian you are the more respect you have from me, but it comes at the cost of some hypocrisy. Why call yourself one when you constantly defend against its tenets?

You read the article so you know Benny is out there fanning the flames in the wrong direction. Don't make apathy from the idiots he evangelizes to out to be their salvation- If they survive and prosper only because they ignore your man in the tall hat, maybe they'd do even better if he cut the act altogether and left them alone. But no, they need Jesus don't they? Because the word of God has made Liberia so much nicer than the rest of Africa.

I find your comments on the parents to be all the more offensive, but will not discuss that topic here any more.


Edited by Delta (12/04/10 05:48 PM)
Edit Reason: couple snips
_________________________






Top
Page 3 of 7 < 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 >


Forum Stats
12281 Members
73 Forums
43880 Topics
404441 Posts

Max Online: 197 @ 10/04/11 06:49 AM
Advertisements