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#449515 - 04/14/11 09:14 PM Keeping Cool?
Liberterius Offline


Registered: 01/06/10
Posts: 241
I consider myself generally a very calm and rational person.

I'm definitely about a 4 o'clock according to The Satanic Witch; so I'm a very abstract, detached thinker, who tends to be agreeable with others. I don't run around looking for fights and open confrontation where it's not needed.

But all too often, I let my emotions get the better of me...usually anger, and I explode at people more than I should, or just get so pissed privately that it impedes my work, calm thinking, and general schedule of life. I also often am WAY overly critical of myself; and have irrational thoughts where I beat myself up for hours after I screw up at something, only realizing later how foolish such thoughts were. This makes me temporarily lose my self-confidence and inner-strength at critical times and I hate it.

Does anyone else have problems like this?
Especially those of you who are more "thinkers" than "feelers"?

To be honest I don't really DO much about it...I just have to wait it out, sometimes I can calm myself down by reminding myself of all the ways I'm great, or that I need to SOLVE the problem, rather than rage at everyone.

Again this isn't usual behavior for me but it's too often still and I'd like to see how other Satanists deal with it.

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#449517 - 04/14/11 09:37 PM Re: Keeping Cool? [Re: Liberterius]
Iscariot Offline


Registered: 06/08/09
Posts: 144
Loc: United States
In reading your description, I see many similarities to myself: generally agreeable, very self critical, infrequent yet disturbing and unpleasant bouts of anger, so yeah, I can relate.

Personally, healthy relationships with my family and significant others have been a great source of relief for me. My current partner is an excellent listener and I have a mostly positive relationship with both of my parents and sister. As I don't know your personal situation, I obviously can't tell your social own support network, but that's where I would look, if your own personality flaws are really starting to bug ya. (Mine drive me nuts cry) So yeah, that's my two cents.

Or you could always take it to Jesus in prayer... coopdevil


Edited by Iscariot (04/14/11 09:38 PM)
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#449519 - 04/14/11 09:52 PM Re: Keeping Cool? [Re: Liberterius]
Lamar Drummer Offline


Registered: 09/16/10
Posts: 133
Loc: Alabama
I'm about a 3 on the clock. I used to be similar to what you are describing. When I would fail at something I would take it out on myself, I had low self-esteem. I had anger problems as well, still do. I was a teenager then also. I really didn't do anything to overcome this, I just grew up. Immaturity. Although, I would say that having goals in life did help.
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#449520 - 04/14/11 09:53 PM Self Confidence = Self-Con. [Re: Liberterius]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
Quote:
I'm definitely about a 4 o'clock according to The Satanic Witch; so I'm a very abstract, detached thinker, who tends to be agreeable with others. I don't run around looking for fights and open confrontation where it's not needed.


Neither do 10, 11, or even 12 o clock's. I think that comes down to the person more so than a particular position on the clock.

Quote:
But all too often, I let my emotions get the better of me...usually anger, and I explode at people more than I should, or just get so pissed privately that it impedes my work, calm thinking, and general schedule of life. I also often am WAY overly critical of myself; and have irrational thoughts where I beat myself up for hours after I screw up at something, only realizing later how foolish such thoughts were. This makes me temporarily lose my self-confidence and inner-strength at critical times and I hate it.


May I provide you with some wisdom from Magister Nemo?

Quote:
Does anyone else have problems like this?
Especially those of you who are more "thinkers" than "feelers"?


I can honestly say yes. When I was a child I used to beat up myself for failure but as I matured I realized 2 very important things:

1. Failure is what produces experience. Learn from it and you won't have to repeat it.

2. I understand that there are somethings I am good and and somethings I am not so good at. To focus on all my negative qualities can be frustrating and even depressing. To focus on my strengths can be uplifting. I also understand that if there is something I desire to be good at then I must work at it. Chances are I will fail at it more than once, such is life. If I discover I cannot accomplish that which I desire then I must accept the reality of the situation. Usually anger, frustration, and depression comes from a refusal to accept things as they are. That's just my opinion and I hope it helps.


Edited by Unknown (04/14/11 10:17 PM)
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#449523 - 04/14/11 10:02 PM Re: Self Confidence = Self-Con. [Re: Liberterius]
Valtiel Offline


Registered: 03/19/11
Posts: 89
Loc: Hollywood
I actually couldn't place myself on the clock, which was curious, as I could almost everyone else I know.

I have broad shoulders, like an 11 or 12, but a slender waist and hips, more like a 5 or 6. Yet personality wise I'm far more towards 3 or 4. And am most interested in women who fit into the 12-2 category. So....complex.
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#449525 - 04/14/11 10:21 PM Re: Keeping Cool? [Re: Liberterius]
Isabel23 Offline
CoS Magistra

Registered: 12/17/02
Posts: 2041
Anger is a secondary response to a deeper emotion, scarcely felt any more.

Emotions are physical feelings accompanied by words you tell yourself -- which you don't even notice any more.

If you've got "buttons" that are pushed easily -- especially by family members -- then you've got automated reactions left over from younger days.

You may find Guide to Rational Living by Albert Ellis extremely useful in getting more co operation out of your emotions, instead of having them ambush you at inopportune times. It's an old book -- look for it used.

In addition, here's a video with Ellis explaining some of the concepts.
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#449528 - 04/14/11 11:18 PM Re: Keeping Cool? [Re: Liberterius]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12990
Loc: The Solid State
Dammit, Magistra Isabel beat me to it!

She's absolutely right that how you feel is often fueled by what you tell yourself about what you experience, and what it means.

She is also right that anger is typically a secondary emotion--meaning, that if one scratches its surface, one will often find sadness, loneliness, confusion, fatigue, hurt, grief, guilt, shame, and/or indignation underneath.

It may be helpful to track the triggering events in your life using this template:

http://www.cognitivetherapyguide.org/TraditionalThoughtRecord.pdf
http://www.addictionsandrecovery.org/thought-record-template.htm

To answer your question, though, I've been diagnosed as a 4:00, and I tend to be quicker to sadness, hurt, or confusion than I am to anger. When I finally get angry, it's often because I'm tired, and/or because I feel like "chased," pestered, or antagonized. (I also don't respond very well to repeated or egregious rudeness, ingratitude, or disrespect.)

I don't think I've actually blown my top since my teen years, but I will become increasingly snippy, sarcastic, quietly resistant, or subtly rebellious as I begin to approach the event horizon of "fed-up-ness."

Being able to retreat into my lair for a day (or two or three) and/or gripe to friends or family usually helps to get me back on track.
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#449587 - 04/15/11 05:55 PM Re: Self Confidence = Self-Con. [Re: Unknown]
anna Offline


Registered: 09/27/10
Posts: 222
Loc: Poland
Quote:
May I provide you with some wisdom from Magister Nemo?


Certainly, these are very wise words: You are not what you do. A lot of people identify themselves with the work they do so if they lose their job or fail their exams at school or university they think they are nobodies. Sometimes, even minor failures make them feel worthless.

Quote:
I understand that there are somethings I am good and and somethings I am not so good at. To focus on all my negative qualities can be frustrating and even depressing. To focus on my strengths can be uplifting. I also understand that if there is something I desire to be good at then I must work at it. Chances are I will fail at it more than once, such is life.


It can happen that we are hopeless at something but after some time of trying and hard work we start making progress. And it is very pleasant to learn new things and watch the progress we make.

Quote:
If I discover I cannot accomplish that which I desire then I must accept the reality of the situation. Usually anger, frustration, and depression comes from a refusal to accept things as they are.


It requires a bit of self-criticism, even humility to accept reality. Some have a distorted idea of perfection and think that they must be without a flaw, always successful in everything they do. However, the ability to accept your failure and learn from it is also a success.
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#449641 - 04/16/11 09:40 AM Re: Keeping Cool? [Re: Liberterius]
Riddles Offline


Registered: 10/16/10
Posts: 82
Loc: Maryland
Originally Posted By: Liberterius
I consider myself generally a very calm and rational person.

I'm definitely about a 4 o'clock according to The Satanic Witch; so I'm a very abstract, detached thinker, who tends to be agreeable with others. I don't run around looking for fights and open confrontation where it's not needed.

But all too often, I let my emotions get the better of me...usually anger, and I explode at people more than I should, or just get so pissed privately that it impedes my work, calm thinking, and general schedule of life. I also often am WAY overly critical of myself; and have irrational thoughts where I beat myself up for hours after I screw up at something, only realizing later how foolish such thoughts were. This makes me temporarily lose my self-confidence and inner-strength at critical times and I hate it.

Does anyone else have problems like this?
Especially those of you who are more "thinkers" than "feelers"?

To be honest I don't really DO much about it...I just have to wait it out, sometimes I can calm myself down by reminding myself of all the ways I'm great, or that I need to SOLVE the problem, rather than rage at everyone.

Again this isn't usual behavior for me but it's too often still and I'd like to see how other Satanists deal with it.



I don't think I've read a post that I've related to more. I'm about a 4 o'clock, and I'm generally agreeable. But when I get angry, I explode. I found that my main problem was that I wasn't expressing my anger enough. I was agreeable, but resentful. I've learned to complain more often, and get out my anger in a more healthy way. Now that it doesn't build up, I rarely explode like I used to.

My wife has called me passive-aggressive. I didn't consciously know it before, but I realized that she is right. From my experience, that isn't very healthy, and it's best to express anger and concerns in a more direct manner.

No one, not even the 3 o'clock, is a pure thinker. Emotions aren't rational, but they are part of us and serve their own purpose. You can't get rid of the monster under the bed, so learn to train it.
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--Mark Twain

"Egoism is the very essence of a noble soul."
--Friedrich Nietzsche

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#449643 - 04/16/11 10:12 AM Re: Self Confidence = Self-Con. [Re: Unknown]
Liberterius Offline


Registered: 01/06/10
Posts: 241
Thank you for your replies everyone!

Wow very good discussion here, and looks like my problem is more universal than I thought!

Unknown;
Thank you VERY much for the link to that post from Magister Nemo. It is one of the most inspirational things I have ever read, and is a genius way of looking at things that would have helped me so much had I thought of it earlier!

Like really, that's an amazing paradigm shift for me to realize that what I DO, isn't what I AM, and being shit at something or messing up once doesn't make ME less valuable, it just means I was shit at that thing.

Truly amazing advice; I didn't really have stage fright before per se (I can act and give speeches with skill and no fear) but with anything I do, when I screw it up I beat myself up on it which I realize is stupid; just have confidence in the individual things you do, and grow and improve that list of skills.

Everyone;

Very helpful posts. I definitely do need to start tracing my emotions and reactions when they happen to figure out why I go in such a pattern, and how to stop it.
I do believe my anger is quite often rooted in jealousy, or anguish at my failings...not always but I think my worst times of rage are from that. Again they're not too often but I hate when that does happen and I get all emotionally self-loathing too. But Magister Nemo's advice helps me a LOT on that count.

Also I'm definitely passive aggressive; I rarely confront people I'm mad at directly, I just fuck with them in other ways.
Often kinda childish.
Sometimes fun.
But sometimes I need to be more assertive with my feelings, sometimes just let them go and keep focused on rational goals.

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#449707 - 04/17/11 12:05 AM Re: Self Confidence = Self-Con. [Re: Liberterius]
Isabel23 Offline
CoS Magistra

Registered: 12/17/02
Posts: 2041
Originally Posted By: Liberterius
Like really, that's an amazing paradigm shift for me to realize that what I DO, isn't what I AM, and being shit at something or messing up once doesn't make ME less valuable, it just means I was shit at that thing.


Isn't that a relief!!! smile
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CoS Magistra

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#449722 - 04/17/11 11:33 AM Re: Self Confidence = Self-Con. [Re: Isabel23]
Liberterius Offline


Registered: 01/06/10
Posts: 241
It sounds so stupid and obvious now that I know it, but it really is an amazingly better way of living and viewing one's world.
I feel like I FEEL Satanism even so much more now than I did already.

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#449846 - 04/18/11 08:21 PM Re: Self Confidence = Self-Con. [Re: Liberterius]
Unknown Offline
Unknown

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 1649
You are most welcome. I would also like to just say that this is exactly what Anton LaVey talks about: a magician knowing his/her own weakness and strengths. Also, just because you failed at something doesn't mean you can be lazy about it. Magister Sass offers a great essay titled PROJECT FAUST in which he goes into detail about setting up goals and achieving them through reading and application within the real world.

You are as strong as your weakest link. Work hard and you may survive this world. Just my own opinion. Good luck!
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