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#452803 - 05/26/11 02:28 PM Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda
AdamBomb Offline


Registered: 05/25/11
Posts: 75
I'm obviously a non-member and have questions in regards to what a Satanist would consider to be Satanism.
Satanists believe in greed, lust, and sloth. I read the Satanic Bible 8 years ago so I'm very rusty with all it's principles.
I'm going to start with Lust which was rather interesting because Anton Lavey did mention even asexuals can be considered Satanists. I thought this was a little weird since Satanism would be a super sexual religion and someone who would not be sexual, would not be considered a Satanist.
I would like some clarification on that.
Next, I got questions on Greed. Lavey gives Greed a rather simple definition of simply wanting more than you have. Generally, when I think greed, I would think of selfishness to the point of harming others financially or life-wise.
An example I have for Satanists is corporate greed like the Enron Case. I know Satanists all have different views since they are all unique individuals. Would Satanism or the Founder approve of these types of scenarios as simply Satanic principle?
I'm also getting into Political agenda with Greed. Anton Lavey seems to have been a strong advocate for Capitalism and Darwinism. "Survival of the Fittest". It makes sense because this is what Satanism seems to be all about - an elitist state of mind. Now, Anton mentioned about asexuals still can be considered Satanists, would the same go for someone who speaks out against Capitalism? Satanists are all individuals so would a Socialist, Communist, etc. still be considered a Satanist even though these Political systems have compassion which Capitalism lacks?
Finally, Sloth which comes off weird because it is considered a good thing by the founder. I think Sloth is laziness and lacks ambition and drive which what I think a Satanist would value highly. I guess the most valuable thing for a Satanist would be self-indulgence and whatever fits them, they do. Guess you don't have to clarify that for me, but if you can clarify it to a great extent, please do so. It is much appreciated.

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#452807 - 05/26/11 03:05 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: AdamBomb]
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 06/25/02
Posts: 10573
Loc: England
Greed can be detrimental to others, yes. Not always, but it can. I am afraid we live in a dog eat dog world, whether anyone wants to acknowledge that or not.

There is no requirement to be "super sexual" as you put it. It is a matter of personal choice.

In regards to laziness. Human beings can certainly be lazy. Amongst Satanists it would, again, be a matter of personal application. The yardstick, as always, is indulgence not compulsion.
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#452810 - 05/26/11 03:18 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: AdamBomb]
Quaark Offline

CoS Reverend

Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 8867
I'd suggest re-reading The Satanic Bible before posting any more questions here. In fact, I suggest this strongly.

For example, the question about lust is incredibly far off the mark. Satanism is about doing what works for you, not anyone else. There is no particular approach to sexuality that is or is not more or less Satanic, as long as it is done in a law abiding, consensual, and responsible manner.

It is certainly not about being "super-sexual", whatever that means. Being a porn star is not any more "Satanic" than being a virgin or celibate by choice, if both choices work for the individuals in question.

Satanism was the first religion in the world to accept gays, lesbians, and bisexuals from the very first day; it would be a bit odd to exclude anyone based on their choice to be less sexually active rather than more.

As for Satanic political perspectives, read:

http://www.satannet.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showthreaded&Number=393601
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#452811 - 05/26/11 03:41 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: Quaark]
AdamBomb Offline


Registered: 05/25/11
Posts: 75
I see how the super sexual religion came off wrong. I'll check out the link with Satanic Political Perspectives some time later...going away for a couple days.

I appreciate the quick and sincere responses.

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#452871 - 05/27/11 04:10 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: AdamBomb]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11560
Loc: New England, USA
In addition to the advice and explanations already given:

Originally Posted By: AdamBomb
I think Sloth is laziness and lacks ambition and drive which what I think a Satanist would value highly.

Then you don't understand "sloth" very well, especially in terms of indulgence and the Seven Deadly Sins.

Quote:
I guess the most valuable thing for a Satanist would be self-indulgence and whatever fits them, they do

For many of us, that includes some sloth. For example, leisure time.

From time to time we get questions from non-Satanists in the form of "Doesn't part X contradict statement Y in this sort of scenario?" For ANY established set of behavior codes, I'm sure it's possible to dream up some hypothetical situation that would lead to a dilemma. People who think this is a problem for Satanists fail to understand that Satanism isn't meant to be dogma for people that need to be taken by the hand on everything and can't think for themselves. It is built upon a philosophy that resonates with a personality type that's already held by the Satanist.

I do productive things with my life, and I also make time to do fun, unproductive things from time to time. There's no real mystery to it. I don't know why you're trying to make this out to be more complicated than it is.
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#452963 - 05/28/11 09:34 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: Bill_M]
AdamBomb Offline


Registered: 05/25/11
Posts: 75
Part of being a devil's advocate I guess. I like disagreeing with people and finding understanding, common ground, and/or explanation of things.
I don't want people to think I'm attacking the Church.


Edited by AdamBomb (05/28/11 09:52 PM)

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#452964 - 05/28/11 09:50 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: AdamBomb]
AdamBomb Offline


Registered: 05/25/11
Posts: 75
What makes a Satanist a Satanist? What criteria should EVERY Satanist have to be considered a member?
From what I understand, someone who does not believe in god, is their own god, and lives his/her life as he/she pleases. It seems to be more of a way of life like Tao is to people. However, I do not believe Tao has a set faith system or "lack thereof" like Satanism does.
For instance, someone who believes or doesn't believe there is god still can be considered a Taoist. The same with believing in heaven/hell, reincarnation, the five plateaus, no afterlife etc. would not affect someone's status as a Taoist.
Would someone who believes there is a supreme supernatural being and for this instance let's say...doesn't believe in an afterlife like people do in Judaism, can be a member of COS?

Or would the criteria mentioned in the beginning has no exceptions to the rules of being a member of the Church?

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#452965 - 05/28/11 09:59 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: AdamBomb]
Phineas Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 08/16/06
Posts: 8269
Would someone who believes there is a supreme supernatural being and for this instance let's say...doesn't believe in an afterlife like people do in Judaism, can be a member of COS?

Technically yes, but why would they want to? Seems like someone like that may be inclined to be a devil worshiper.

The Satanic Bible, along with the Church of Satan website, clearly explain who a Satanist is.
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#452966 - 05/28/11 10:09 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: Phineas]
AdamBomb Offline


Registered: 05/25/11
Posts: 75
Interesting, I actually thought it wouldn't just because a Satanist is his/her own god therefore would not worship anything but his/herself. Even if you subtract all the superstition, religious tradition, costumes, hairstyle, the Jew would not have the criteria for being their own god, but can still be a member.
I'm probably driving you people nuts with the technical questions here, but I hope you all see it doesn't negatively affect the perception of the Church at all. It actually makes it look more open-minded than I even thought it ever was to differences.


Edited by AdamBomb (05/28/11 10:10 PM)

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#453034 - 05/30/11 01:38 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: AdamBomb]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Reverend

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11560
Loc: New England, USA
Originally Posted By: AdamBomb
Part of being a devil's advocate I guess. I like disagreeing with people and finding understanding, common ground, and/or explanation of things.

There is nothing inherently wrong with disagreeing or to ask questions. But there's a difference "being a devil's advocate" and compulsively debating for the sake of debate, or asking questions that we've already been answering for over 40 years.

Originally Posted By: AdamBomb
What makes a Satanist a Satanist? What criteria should EVERY Satanist have to be considered a member?
From what I understand, someone who does not believe in god, is their own god, and lives his/her life as he/she pleases.

There's a lot more to being a Satanist than that. I've seen plenty of non-theistic people who have convinced themselves that they are "living life as they please" but also happen to live by incredibly unsatanic beliefs and behaviors.

Originally Posted By: AdamBomb
I'm probably driving you people nuts with the technical questions here, but I hope you all see it doesn't negatively affect the perception of the Church at all.

Nope, just some people's perception of you. wink
_________________________
Reverend Bill M.

http://www.devilsmischief.com: Carnal Comedy Clips, Netherworld Novelty Numbers,
New hour every week. Download the mp3 now!

http://www.aplaceformystuff.org: Tales of Combat Clutter and other Adventures

(Wenn du Google's Übersetzer verwendest, um diese Worte zu lesen, dann bist du ein Arschloch.)

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#453528 - 06/07/11 12:24 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: AdamBomb]
AdamBomb Offline


Registered: 05/25/11
Posts: 75

I still would like to know how the Church feels collectively on Corporate Greed. Good or bad? Is this one of those topics that varies with Church member to Church member or is there one collective agreement on it being Greed is a good thing to the Satanist?
Indulgence, not compulsion I get that. But here's the issue, I know other religions such as Catholicism, Buddhism, Judaism, etc. would view corporate greed and capitalism as something negative. If the Church of Satan, feels the same way on corporate greed, then you would have an agreement on moral values with COS and other religions that it is supposedly opposing in views.

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#453529 - 06/07/11 12:28 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: AdamBomb]
Quaark Offline

CoS Reverend

Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 8867
http://www.satannet.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showthreaded&Number=393601

The above link was already provided in this thread to answer your questions about the Church of Satan and political stances.

You promised to read this before, but obviously didn't.

You're close to a ban for being excessively and repeatedly obtuse.
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T’aa hwo’ aaji t’eego.

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#453638 - 06/08/11 07:23 PM Re: Greed, Lust, and Sloth - Also Political Agenda [Re: Quaark]
AdamBomb Offline


Registered: 05/25/11
Posts: 75
I'll actually be getting the Satanic Bible pretty soon once I get my God-dam Kindle. I ordered it last week, should get it by tomorrow. It's great that it's available as an e-book on Amazon. The pricing is a bit ridiculous, it's shockingly more expensive than the paper-back. Usually, the books themselves are more expensive than the electronic ones.
I used to have it actually...8 years ago when I was a teenager still, but I think my Polish Catholic mother threw it out one day when she got the chance. You know how those kind of moms can be.

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