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#475593 - 06/28/12 06:49 PM How to apply stratification?
Jupiter Offline


Registered: 03/20/09
Posts: 100
Obviously, stratification is a keyword to Satanic philosophy, and it's a natural process. It happens whether we like it or not.

I was thinking about the Pentagonal Revisionism, and I wonder how each Satanist apply stratification is his life and life in general. After all it is one of the main things we as Satanists do or want to do.

I feel that this is a bit of an awkward question but still, how I can apply stratification on myself, and on society? How do you as a Satanist work with/on stratification?
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"The finest trick of the devil is to persuade you that he does not exist" ~Charles Baudelaire

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#475601 - 06/28/12 09:14 PM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
JDBones Offline


Registered: 01/27/12
Posts: 102
In the country where I live it seems that the lowest life-cells (can't really call them persons) seem to prosper best right now while people with education and intellect as well as achievements in arts and science are on the brink of poverty. That's the environment our government supports and we have let it happen (during the process of moving from communism to western models of governing). However, most of those people's prosperity is generally based on illegal activities, 'cracks' in laws and also corruption which won't lead to anything good for those who practice this, so people like me and my friends count on making the most out of what we have - some of us utilize this very well, some of us don't. Those who don't are learning it the hard way and the ones who fail will only hope, suffer and complain.
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#475620 - 06/29/12 05:20 AM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
Jupiter Offline


Registered: 03/20/09
Posts: 100
I live in a similar political environment, where the criminals cheats and thiefs ripe the fruit of others labor. I don't blame the government, human nature, etc. Satanism is concerned about reality as it is, not as it should be. One cannot just 'hang in there' and 'have patience' something need to be done right now this is where stratification comes in, but how to enforce stratification, and the Satanic ideal of rewarding the creative and punishing the parasites who merely feed on the system, that in fact supported by another type of parasites?
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"The finest trick of the devil is to persuade you that he does not exist" ~Charles Baudelaire

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#475700 - 07/01/12 11:13 AM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
J. Favenris Offline



Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 152
Loc: Portland, Oregon
I always thought that the Pentagonal Revisionism was a plan of action on society, things that we would like to see changed in the new Satanic Age. Stratification in that sense, I guess, would be the complete opposite and anathema of concepts such as Communism, welfare states, affirmative action, egalitarian pay structures, etc.

Letting nature takes it course is pretty much what stratification means to me, and of course, we all know Mother Nature is a fascist and different hierarchies and classes between people would develop. However, I also think you can apply stratification to your own life by cutting people who don't benefit you nor deserve to be in your presence, as well as having healthy competition within yourself to rise to elite in whatever field you choose to work in.
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"Training is nothing! The will is everything! The will to act." - Ra's al Ghul

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#475705 - 07/01/12 04:55 PM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
Jupiter Offline


Registered: 03/20/09
Posts: 100
Even if Communism was applied, stratification would still take place, cause as you said, it a natural process and it will happen on its own. Do you think that there maybe a plan of action for governments to aid in the natural process of stratification and make it more potent? For example, the homeless, they serve no useful purpose in society, they just feed on the society, do you think they should executed? or put to some useful use? smile

Stratification on the individual level is easier to maintain, I guess. It even sometimes happen contrary to personal benefit, is there a secret to it? The only thing I can think of is that Stratification too is like Magic, to make it work one would have to work with nature not against it, what do you think?
_________________________
"The finest trick of the devil is to persuade you that he does not exist" ~Charles Baudelaire

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#475727 - 07/02/12 02:03 AM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
Dax9 Offline

CoS Member

Registered: 10/16/10
Posts: 768
Loc: near Baton Rouge, LA
Without getting involved into a political debate I submit that I support much of what Nietzsche has postulated in The Will To Power , i.e., the notion of a ruling class based on qualities like intelligence, courage, artistic ability, and other attributes of the Renaissance Man.

This model sounds ideal on paper, but it is highly doubtful that such a newly erected aristocracy would continue to truly possess the lofty characteristics. For example, members of the ruling class would probably not allow their children to be outcast to the proletariat even if they were not very cerebral or ambitious. Once again, a sterling theory but a faulty practice.

In alignment with what Favenris has stated I think that stratification best begins with oneself. My current friends and associates tend to be those who are on my level and share my goals or are a small bit more successful than me. As far as old friends who have proven to be unproductive and stagnant -- I may still give them a friendly call or text, but I will not share any of my valuable time with them.

As an aside, I feel that convicted death row inmates should be used as guinea pigs for medical research instead of animals.
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"The difference between the man or woman who's a practicing Satanist, from an identity Satanist is that the practicing Satanist looks at the picture, while the identity Satanist studies the frame."
-- Anton Szandor LaVey

"Anyone without a sense of humor is too pretentious to be a good magician."
-- Anton Szandor LaVey

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#475729 - 07/02/12 03:09 AM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
TheMerryRose Offline


Registered: 06/25/12
Posts: 54
Loc: the City Of Sin.
I think any human "recycling" should be handled case by case. I mean what about the computer nerd who spends his whole life playing WOW, or the welfare mom who spends her life creating kids for all of us to raise while smoking crack with her boyfriend who also dosent work? I think these would be much better canidates for "recycling" then some guy who just likes sleeping outdoors and is not bothering anyone.


Edited by TheMerryRose (07/02/12 03:10 AM)
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#475730 - 07/02/12 03:09 AM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
J. Favenris Offline



Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 152
Loc: Portland, Oregon
Originally Posted By: Shaitan9
Even if Communism was applied, stratification would still take place, cause as you said, it a natural process and it will happen on its own. Do you think that there maybe a plan of action for governments to aid in the natural process of stratification and make it more potent? For example, the homeless, they serve no useful purpose in society, they just feed on the society, do you think they should executed? or put to some useful use? smile

Stratification on the individual level is easier to maintain, I guess. It even sometimes happen contrary to personal benefit, is there a secret to it? The only thing I can think of is that Stratification too is like Magic, to make it work one would have to work with nature not against it, what do you think?


I don't think the homeless "feed on society" but rather people with indiscriminate altruism or good guy badges. Perhaps eliminating funding and taxes for homeless programs, and letting them survive on pure donations, would be an appropriate action, but I'm not in support of executing people simply because they made wrong choices in life or (as it is in most cases) come from a fucked up family background or suffer from mental illness.

Letting nature take its course is most comfortable with me, because who knows, maybe among the sewage of losers a lone star will get his shit together and accomplish much. Hopefully.
_________________________
"Training is nothing! The will is everything! The will to act." - Ra's al Ghul

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#475731 - 07/02/12 03:16 AM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Dax9]
J. Favenris Offline



Registered: 04/12/09
Posts: 152
Loc: Portland, Oregon
Originally Posted By: Dax9
In alignment with what Favenris has stated I think that stratification best begins with oneself. My current friends and associates tend to be those who are on my level and share my goals or are a small bit more successful than me. As far as old friends who have proven to be unproductive and stagnant -- I may still give them a friendly call or text, but I will not share any of my valuable time with them.

As an aside, I feel that convicted death row inmates should be used as guinea pigs for medical research instead of animals.


It was greatly appreciated when you said that you would not share your time with those who do not deserve it - that was precisely the idea of stratification within oneself that I was trying to present. I would also extend this to pretty much anything in life, such as a workplace that isn't as rewarding as another, or a relationship that doesn't meet your standards, a lifestyle that doesn't help you meet your goals, etc.
_________________________
"Training is nothing! The will is everything! The will to act." - Ra's al Ghul

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#475733 - 07/02/12 04:20 AM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: J. Favenris]
Jupiter Offline


Registered: 03/20/09
Posts: 100
Okay, thank you for clearing that.
_________________________
"The finest trick of the devil is to persuade you that he does not exist" ~Charles Baudelaire

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#476049 - 07/06/12 09:18 PM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
Emily Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/08/06
Posts: 114
Loc: Colorado
I apply stratification on a daily basis any time I'm interacting with others.

Specifically, stratification to me involves setting various personal boundaries, and deciding particular standards by which I judge others. I then allow other people to determine their role in my life based on how they do or do not reach these particular standards.

For example, one standard I have with friends is that the friendship be based on a mutual effort from both parties. As a result, if I feel that someone is putting less effort to interact with me or connect with me, I tend to back off. If the person is busy, then they will generally get back in touch with me when they have more time. If they are less interested in the friendship for whatever reason, I see no reason to pursue something if it doesn't appear to be as important for the other individual as it is for me.

Another way in which I apply stratification, is that I present my expectations and standards to others, and I allow the other party to decide if this is something that they are interested in as well, or not. For example, I was recently talking to someone that I dated years ago. Currently, my standards for seeing someone is that they not be sleeping with anyone else. My friend who I dated is currently seeing someone else as a casual "friend with benefits." Since I'm not interested in being involved with someone who's also seeing other people, I chose to remain friends with him and not take him up on his offer he alluded to in which he wouldn't mind having two girls.

The key to this type of stratification is to remain courteous to the other individual regarding the choices they make. So if a friend seems less interested in maintaining the friendship, then I respect that individual's choice. Since the guy I dated wants to have casual friends with benefits, I respect his choice and remain his friend without throwing him attitude for his actions. Respecting the choices of others very clearly demonstrates that you both accept their actions, and that you're not willing to compromise your own standards in favor of someone else's.

The second part about accepting others' choices seems to be something that most people have a problem with. However, if you're clear with yourself and others regarding what you want, and what you are and aren't willing to do, then you end up weeding people out very effectively. As a result, the only people in your life who remain are the ones who meet your standards. I suppose it's a polite way of saying, "this is who I am, if you don't like it, you can fuck off."
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"As within, so without. If you do not have happiness within you, you will never find it outside of you."

The underhanded manipulator is akin to the woman who stuffs her bra, or the man who wears a codpiece. When it comes down to business, the goods are revealed, and any inadequacies are subsequently exposed.

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#476054 - 07/06/12 11:59 PM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3969
Loc: The Deep South
You don't. Stratification happens naturally.

In any group or society the smarter individuals will find their way to the top and the mediocre will remain down. It's as simple as water leveling itself.

The problem with today's societies is they all try to install an artificial system that goes against the natural dynamics of human nature. They keep trying to either push the incompetent up or pull the successful down in order to achieve a false sense of equality. But that always fails. Stratification always establishes itself again.
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#476333 - 07/09/12 06:38 PM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Emily]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12990
Loc: The Solid State
Emily, great response.

I think you could distill it all down into two main points:

1) Know thyself, and thine own values and expectations,

2) Communicate those values and expectations clearly and directly, and stick by them.

Well, and I particularly like how you said that you're still civil and pleasant with people who've made different choices, so you neither cross their boundaries, nor allow them to cross yours. Getting needlessly sniffy and righteous about others' "wrong" choices only brings more drama into your life, as well as theirs, after all.
_________________________
"Gentlemen, the verdict is guilty, on all ten counts of first-degree stupidity. The penalty phase will now begin."--Divine, "Pink Flamingos."

"The strong rule the weak, and the cunning rule over all." HS!

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#476338 - 07/09/12 09:36 PM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: TrojZyr]
Emily Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 05/08/06
Posts: 114
Loc: Colorado
Thanks!

Yeah, funny how so much stuff can be boiled down to basic interpersonal skills. I've found that I've frequently misinterpreted people who are awkward at expressing themselves, as being manipulative or intentionally misleading and indirect. Perhaps I feel more comfortable being honest with myself and others than most people do. As long as you're honest and straightforward with me, you could suggest the most bizarre stuff, and although I may not like it, I will remain courteous.

I often find it funny how people claim to be allowing you to make your own choices, but then throw you attitude when they don't agree with your choices. I see this as a passive-agressive attempt to persuade the other party into "cooperating," but it generally tends to backfire. This is why I think it's imperative that an individual remain courteous when the other party chooses something that he or she wouldn't want. This communicates more than words the acceptance of standards and boundaries, and the lack of willingness to compromise one's own.
_________________________
"As within, so without. If you do not have happiness within you, you will never find it outside of you."

The underhanded manipulator is akin to the woman who stuffs her bra, or the man who wears a codpiece. When it comes down to business, the goods are revealed, and any inadequacies are subsequently exposed.

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#476386 - 07/10/12 10:03 AM Re: How to apply stratification? [Re: Jupiter]
TrojZyr Offline
CoS Witch

Registered: 07/25/01
Posts: 12990
Loc: The Solid State
Ah! So you've managed to steer clear of Solipsism, too! You prefer to be honest and direct, but you realize that some people just aren't that way. Some people are just awkward about expressing themselves, as you said. Some people don't quite know what they want. And, some people don't feel they can be honest or direct, and believe they have to resort to other means to get what they need or want--but, even they don't intend to be sneaky or manipulative.

I really wish more people in the world could really recognize and respect the boundary between themselves, and other people, and recognize that there's a stark difference between, "This person's decision or behavior directly harms or affects me and/or mine," and "This person's decision or behavior makes me all weepity-sad inside."

I actually had an important "boundary" conversation with a loved one recently. The main problem that emerged was that they couldn't tolerate the thought of me suffering, so they had to make sure I was going to make the "right" decision that would ensure (they assumed) that I ultimately succeeded in a certain area. My feeling was that I'd almost rather fail miserably and painfully, than have another person just move me around on the chess board of life. It'll probably be an ongoing conversation, but at least we got down to the nitty-gritty of the matter, and the person had to acknowledge that not wanting to see me fail was their dealio, even if they insisted that they couldn't change or let go of that. Again, it'll be an ongoing conversation, I imagine, and I'll have to keep restating and re-defending the boundaries. (Of course, this also begs the question of why my plans are destined to fail, while the other's plans are guaranteed keys to success. I imagine we'll burn that bridge when we get to it.)

Anyway, it just struck a chord with me, so thanks for articulating it all so well.
_________________________
"Gentlemen, the verdict is guilty, on all ten counts of first-degree stupidity. The penalty phase will now begin."--Divine, "Pink Flamingos."

"The strong rule the weak, and the cunning rule over all." HS!

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