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#496819 - 08/16/14 04:04 AM The term LeVeyan Satanism
Eli Offline


Registered: 08/06/14
Posts: 9
Loc: North Carolina
This post is just to see how others feel about the term LeVeyan Satanism. I understand I'm not the most knowledgeable person (nor a COS member) but I can see why this term was created. I feel it was created to help non-Satanist to differentiate the philosophy Anton Szandor LaVey wrote, from the Pseudo-Satanist (as defined by Nemo). I also see why this would be protested after reading a post by Magister Svengali just a few minutes ago that touched on them being by the word sheep to LaVey's word.

What is your opinion?
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#496822 - 08/16/14 09:04 AM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Eli]
AoiYami Offline


Registered: 06/09/14
Posts: 40
I view the term as nothing more then an annoyance. Putting a separation in the idea of Satanism implies many things that we don't want to imply. First it implies that there are legit divisions in Satanism. Due to the fact that most people when thinking of the word "Satanism" will think of the idea of literally worshipping the devil, the division in Satanism causes people to think that LeVeyan Satanism is the fake Satanism. Honestly the term only hurts Satanism by implying and backing up things we don't want it to.
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#496823 - 08/16/14 10:17 AM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Eli]
Louis3rd Offline


Registered: 12/05/12
Posts: 2
Loc: NJ, USA
Before LaVey, Satanism was a smear used to tar other religious groups, not a religion. Because LaVey was the first to codify it as an actual religion and defined it as atheistic, adding the term "Laveyan" is redundant. The term "theistic Satanism" is as much an oxymoron as "godless Catholic."


Edited by MisterPfromNJ (08/16/14 10:18 AM)

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#496824 - 08/16/14 10:31 AM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Eli]
de_Lioncourt Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 601
Please understand that I am not trying to come down hard on you.

In regards to Laveyan Satanism, to an extent, I get it.

If my memory serves me right, this term was used in both The Church of Satan and The Secret Life of a Satanist by Magistra Blanche Barton. I could be wrong.

That said, for a person who is entirely new to Satanism, the term could seem accurate especially considering the Laveyan Personality Synthesizer Clock.

However, with a look around these boards and the CoS website, it should become apparent that this term is not accepted or endorsed by the CoS.

My understanding of why this term is not considered useful is because a) It implies that there are other kinds of Satanism. (there are not) and b) it gives the impression that the CoS is an Anton Lavey personality cult (it is not).

This is a topic that has been covered here numerous times. No less, I hope that I have assisted in clearing this up.
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#496826 - 08/16/14 12:20 PM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Eli]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 13134
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
Quote:
This post is just to see how others feel about the term LeVeyan Satanism.


I find this term as it is being used today to be:

1. Misleading.

It is commonly intended to confuse people who believe in a real "Satan" (such as Christians, Muslims, and devil worshipers) with Satanists.

It is also commonly used as propaganda to promote the attempts of those who have less than legal agendas that they wish were a part of this religion and have gone off to create their own groups. However Satanism has always been opposed to crime.

2. Redundant.

To say "LaVeyan Satanism" is similar to saying "Christian Catholicism" or "Jewish Judaism".

It reminds me of the constant media use of the term "the exact same". If something is the "same", it is redundant to add the word "exact". If something is the same, and not just similar, it is already "exactly" the same.

3. A Reflection on the user.

For the first two reasons I see those who continue to use this term after being corrected to either have an anti-Satanist agenda or are willfully ignorant of what Satanism actually is.

Thus I tend to judge such folks as either troublemakers or fools.

Just my own opinion.
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Magister Nemo's Satanic Offerings:
DISCOVERING THE SATANIC GOD - The heart of Satanism.
THE SEVENTH TOWER OF SATAN - Ritual in virtual reality.
BENEATH THE SEVENTH TOWER OF SATAN - Deeper VR ritual.
THE FIRE FROM WITHIN - My book.

My first audio interview on GREATER MAGIC
My second audio interview by Rev Campbell



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#496831 - 08/16/14 03:59 PM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Eli]
Eli Offline


Registered: 08/06/14
Posts: 9
Loc: North Carolina
My apologies on a potentially repeated question. I understand the term being viewed as misleading. I didn't view it correctly on the part of LaVey having codified satanism for what it is. These responses are exactly why I posted instead of incorrectly using the term believing myself to be correct. Thank you
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#496838 - 08/17/14 10:59 PM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: de_Lioncourt]
Bill_M Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 07/28/01
Posts: 11648
Loc: New England, USA
Originally Posted By: de_Lioncourt
If my memory serves me right, this term was used in both The Church of Satan and The Secret Life of a Satanist by Magistra Blanche Barton. I could be wrong.

It does show up once in the latter. Still, the people who use the term are people who pretty much get the bulk of their information from Wikipedia. As you point out, trying to use the term as a replacement term for "Satanism" is just misleading.
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#496844 - 08/18/14 08:43 AM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Bill_M]
de_Lioncourt Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 601
Thanks for the clarification on what book that the term was used in Reverend.

Now Wikipedia...that wasn't around in '96 wink.

And exactly so, it is Satanism period. Nothing more, nothing less. smile
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#496869 - 08/21/14 07:35 PM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: de_Lioncourt]
Morguen Offline


Registered: 08/21/14
Posts: 3
The term “Laveyan Satanism” is a convenient way to separate from others like Spiritual Satanism, etc.
My first reading of the Satanic Bible was at 14 years old. And I continue to read it always.
In my years of study of philosophy I encounter with an interesting pattern of ideas and thoughts we can call now days “Laveyan”.
The Greek Philosopher Heraclitus (called the Dark One), has many “Laveyan concepts”. Frederic Nietzsche contains a great deal of what Dr. Lavey wrote.
So I realized Satanism existed long before and is the acceptance of our human nature and the rejection of any form of mental slavery like religion.
Dr. Lavey systematized all the above and he realized the same timeless wisdom: “Human nature will always prevail”.
So for me Satanism is Satanism. The rest is religion because they demand faith and have dogmas and ethic´s already made so to avoid free thinking.
I apologize for my bad grammar. English is not my native language but I will improve in time.
Morguen.

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#496876 - 08/21/14 08:34 PM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Morguen]
de_Lioncourt Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 601
While I can understand that you seem to be paying homage to Anton Lavey, please read other responses on this thread from members of the Priesthood. The term'Levayan Satanism' is not accepted or used by the CoS in any way.

You are correct in saying that Satanism is Satanism. That is all that needs to be said.

There is no such thing as spiritual Satanism.

Satanism.

It is all that needs to be said.
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#496877 - 08/22/14 04:00 AM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: de_Lioncourt]
Janina Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 12/06/11
Posts: 1611
Loc: Center of my own Universe
Anton Szandor LaVey wrote the Satanic Bible. Satanic Bible codifies the philosophy of Satanism. Without his work there would be no systematized religion under the name of Satanism, so calling it LaVeyan is totally unnecessary. It is just Satanism.

If one would call Satanism with adding this surplus term to describe it, would be like calling Christianity with the term Jesus Christ´s Christianity. There is no such thing as theistic Satanism, but only Christian heretics who like to use the term, so they could identify with philosophy which as a matter of fact is in contradiction with the idea of theism cause basis it´s core philosophy to A-Theism..
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#496878 - 08/22/14 06:22 AM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Janina]
de_Lioncourt Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 601
Agreed.
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#496879 - 08/22/14 06:51 AM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Janina]
Quaark Offline

CoS Reverend

Registered: 08/22/03
Posts: 8930
"Hi, I'm John. I'm an Achmed Christian."

(real Christian Jay) "Uh, what's an 'Achmed Christian'?"

(John) "It's a branch of Christianity founded by Achmed."

(Jay) "Never heard of it. Who was Achmed and what do you believe?"

(John) "Achmed was a Turk who lived 1000 years after Jesus. He taught that camels are funny, shoes should never have exposed toes, and that everyone should put a tablespoon of butter in their tea every morning for their health. And that people who cheat people when they sell low quality rugs will be denied figs in the third afterlife."

(Jay) "What does this have to do with Jesus or the Bible or what everyone has always called Christianity?"

(John) "Nothing, nothing at all."

(Jay) "Why are you calling it a branch of Christianity then?"

(John) "Because we want to. Christianity is a neat name and already has a lot of name recognition. Oh, and we think what you call Christianity really isn't Christianity. Our Christianity is the real Christianity. Real Christianity is about camels and shoes and rugs and figs. Jesus has nothing to do with it. We Achmed Christians call you people 'Jesus Christians'. Please call yourself Jesus Christians so people don't get confused, OK?"

(Jay) "That makes no sense."

(John) "Yes it does. People were thinking about camels and shoes and rugs and figs LONG before Jesus was born. And since Jesus never really discussed camels and shoes and rugs and figs, by definition he wasn't discussing real Christianity."

(Jay) "Dude. Your logic isn't just flawed, it's practically non-existent."

(John) "You probably sell low quality rugs and think camels aren't funny and wear open toed shoes and don't put butter in your morning tea. So of course you think that. You're living in denial."

(Jay) *walks away*

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#496881 - 08/22/14 11:06 AM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Quaark]
de_Lioncourt Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 601
grin

That was all that I could do while reading your very good analogy Reverend.

As I mentioned in an earlier reply to the original poster I recalled seeing that term in one of the books used once. However, after doing some reasearch and looking around here it became apparent that the CoS does not use this term. I concluded that the reasoning was both sound and accurate.

Personally, I never used the term when talking about the topic anyway. Satanism worked just fine for me.


Edited by de_Lioncourt (08/22/14 11:16 AM)
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#496883 - 08/22/14 02:41 PM Re: The term LeVeyan Satanism [Re: Quaark]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 13134
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
devilchili
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Magister Nemo's Satanic Offerings:
DISCOVERING THE SATANIC GOD - The heart of Satanism.
THE SEVENTH TOWER OF SATAN - Ritual in virtual reality.
BENEATH THE SEVENTH TOWER OF SATAN - Deeper VR ritual.
THE FIRE FROM WITHIN - My book.

My first audio interview on GREATER MAGIC
My second audio interview by Rev Campbell



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