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THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION #58222
09/23/04 06:47 PM
09/23/04 06:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,460
Florida, U.S.A.
Svengali Offline OP
CoS Magister
Svengali  Offline OP
CoS Magister

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,460
Florida, U.S.A.
THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION

If you post or respond to posts here, you are obliged to write in a manner that can be understood and responded to.

This involves form and content.

Form is spelling, grammar, and punctuation. There is no excuse for lacking these basic skills. If you have a hard time with this, try writing your post in Word or whatever word-processing program that came loaded in your computer. Most of these programs are designed to correct basic errors of spelling, grammar, and punctuation.

Content is the substance of your post. Just about any comment you can make is either a judgment or a call to action.

In the case of judgment, you are stating that you agree or disagree with a statement and your reasons for agreement or disagreement.

If you disagree with someone, it is because they are uninformed (lacking information), misinformed (based on wrong information), or their reasoning is flawed (they draw wrong or erroneous conclusions from the basic information), or they are incomplete in their analysis. If you disagree with someone the burden is on you to clearly state why. There is no point in just stating “I disagree” – that is just being mindlessly contentious. If you agree with someone and find it worth saying so, it also does not hurt to state why.

In the case of a call to action, you are stating what should be done or not be done and your reasons why.

If you can’t make the effort to be understood in the first place, Don’t be surprised when you get banned.

If you just “don’t care” if your post is understood, or if you are legible or coherent to anyone reading it, then why post here in the first place? Go do something more productive with yourself, like stick a butter knife into an electric socket.

The same goes to all the lot lice that immediately jump on every lame newcomer with petty nit-picking criticism. From what I’ve observed here, 99 times out of 100 you have nothing better to offer yourself.

Kindergarten dismissed!


Live and Let Die.
"If I have to choose between defending the wolf or the dog, I choose the wolf, especially when he is bleeding." -- Jaques Verges
"I may have my faults, but being wrong ain't one of them." -- Jimmy Hoffa
"As for wars, well, there's only been 268 years out of the last 3421 in which there were no wars. So war, too, is in the normal course of events." -- Will Durant.
"Satanism is the worship of life, not a hypocritical, whitewashed vision of life, but life as it really is." -- Anton Szandor LaVey
“A membership ticket in this party does not confer genius on the holder.” -- Benito Mussolini
MY BOOK: ESSAYS IN SATANISM | MY BLOG: COSMODROMIUM | Deep Satanism Blog
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Svengali] #58223
09/23/04 07:00 PM
09/23/04 07:00 PM
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,793
England
Drake_Bamboozle Offline
CoS Reverend
Drake_Bamboozle  Offline
CoS Reverend

Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,793
England
It's a good try, Reverend Svengali, but I am afraid that for a lot of people this is just a bridge too far. I commend your efforts though.



Human beings are as significant as a cigarette burn in the sun.
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Drake_Bamboozle] #58224
09/23/04 07:26 PM
09/23/04 07:26 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,460
Florida, U.S.A.
Svengali Offline OP
CoS Magister
Svengali  Offline OP
CoS Magister

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,460
Florida, U.S.A.
Now they cannot say that they were not warned.


Live and Let Die.
"If I have to choose between defending the wolf or the dog, I choose the wolf, especially when he is bleeding." -- Jaques Verges
"I may have my faults, but being wrong ain't one of them." -- Jimmy Hoffa
"As for wars, well, there's only been 268 years out of the last 3421 in which there were no wars. So war, too, is in the normal course of events." -- Will Durant.
"Satanism is the worship of life, not a hypocritical, whitewashed vision of life, but life as it really is." -- Anton Szandor LaVey
“A membership ticket in this party does not confer genius on the holder.” -- Benito Mussolini
MY BOOK: ESSAYS IN SATANISM | MY BLOG: COSMODROMIUM | Deep Satanism Blog
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Svengali] #58225
09/24/04 12:33 PM
09/24/04 12:33 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 89
.
Foxred Offline
Foxred  Offline

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 89
.
Reverend, it crossed my mind that quite a few might be using their second language...

If I cannot read something because it it bulky and requires extensive attention, I just skip it...


Look into Intergallactic depth
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Foxred] #58226
09/24/04 01:30 PM
09/24/04 01:30 PM
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 61
Hong Kong
P
Plato Offline
CoS Member
Plato  Offline
CoS Member
P

Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 61
Hong Kong
Quote:

Reverend, it crossed my mind that quite a few might be using their second language...

If I cannot read something because it it bulky and requires extensive attention, I just skip it...




But that's not an excuse for foreigners.
Those who are not good at the second-language should improve it before they use it.(not only English)

And as a foreigner, I’m always improving it.

Once I heard the Jehovah's Witness churchmen speak in Cantonese, it made me feel like my ears were raped.

So, the solution you should take is to improve it, not to loose it.


Desire's raison d'etre is not to realize its goal, to find full satisfaction, but to reproduce itself as desire.

Slavoj Zizek
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Foxred] #58227
09/24/04 04:57 PM
09/24/04 04:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,460
Florida, U.S.A.
Svengali Offline OP
CoS Magister
Svengali  Offline OP
CoS Magister

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,460
Florida, U.S.A.
Quote:

Reverend, it crossed my mind that quite a few might be using their second language...




Language barriers are apparent and excusable.

Idiocy filtered through a language barrier is equally apparent but inexcusable.


Live and Let Die.
"If I have to choose between defending the wolf or the dog, I choose the wolf, especially when he is bleeding." -- Jaques Verges
"I may have my faults, but being wrong ain't one of them." -- Jimmy Hoffa
"As for wars, well, there's only been 268 years out of the last 3421 in which there were no wars. So war, too, is in the normal course of events." -- Will Durant.
"Satanism is the worship of life, not a hypocritical, whitewashed vision of life, but life as it really is." -- Anton Szandor LaVey
“A membership ticket in this party does not confer genius on the holder.” -- Benito Mussolini
MY BOOK: ESSAYS IN SATANISM | MY BLOG: COSMODROMIUM | Deep Satanism Blog
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Svengali] #58228
09/29/04 12:08 PM
09/29/04 12:08 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 657
Italy
Xerx Offline

CoS Member
Xerx  Offline

CoS Member

Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 657
Italy
Superb post as usual. You expressed my idea.

Svengali for President!

Xerx


smile smile
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Xerx] #58229
09/29/04 01:03 PM
09/29/04 01:03 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,460
Florida, U.S.A.
Svengali Offline OP
CoS Magister
Svengali  Offline OP
CoS Magister

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12,460
Florida, U.S.A.
Quote:

Svengali for President!




Thank you for the sentiment, but I wouldn't want the job!


Live and Let Die.
"If I have to choose between defending the wolf or the dog, I choose the wolf, especially when he is bleeding." -- Jaques Verges
"I may have my faults, but being wrong ain't one of them." -- Jimmy Hoffa
"As for wars, well, there's only been 268 years out of the last 3421 in which there were no wars. So war, too, is in the normal course of events." -- Will Durant.
"Satanism is the worship of life, not a hypocritical, whitewashed vision of life, but life as it really is." -- Anton Szandor LaVey
“A membership ticket in this party does not confer genius on the holder.” -- Benito Mussolini
MY BOOK: ESSAYS IN SATANISM | MY BLOG: COSMODROMIUM | Deep Satanism Blog
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Svengali] #58230
09/29/04 11:18 PM
09/29/04 11:18 PM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 363
Lima, Perú
CannibalSpirit Offline
CannibalSpirit  Offline

Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 363
Lima, Perú
Thank you.
This was obvious, but necessary.


Cannibal Spirit "I am my enemy"
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Svengali] #58231
10/03/04 04:04 AM
10/03/04 04:04 AM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 307
Tiki Land
Shylock Offline
Shylock  Offline

Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 307
Tiki Land
A toast to the Reverend!

Might I also add that people should cite things when they borrow from them too closely, instead of acting like the ideas were their own? Perhaps I've been writing too many research papers...damn plagiarism clauses...but people on this board should have enough respect for the folks that inspire them to give credit where it's due. Most follow through with this or indicate that they simply can't recall the source of their quotes, but still....some of the newer ones don't catch on so quickly (not a good sign).


Pride may be worth less than safety but it's certainly worth more than convenience.

--The Royal Me
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Shylock] #58232
10/07/04 08:29 AM
10/07/04 08:29 AM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 144
Texas, USA
August-Wolfe Offline
August-Wolfe  Offline

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 144
Texas, USA
Quote:

A toast to the Reverend!

Might I also add that people should cite things when they borrow from them too closely, instead of acting like the ideas were their own? Perhaps I've been writing too many research papers...damn plagiarism clauses...but people on this board should have enough respect for the folks that inspire them to give credit where it's due. Most follow through with this or indicate that they simply can't recall the source of their quotes, but still....some of the newer ones don't catch on so quickly (not a good sign).



And here is a salute to Rev. Svengali as well. Even in impassioned debate there should be, I would think, a standard of courtesy ( I'm not a straight "A" student, maybe a "B+"). Unclear statements, improper grammar and such can lead to misinterpretation. So, well said Reverend. Timely, accurate advice.
And here's to Ginger as well. Plagiarism is an unspeakable misdeed. Almost as bad is the habit of quoting someone completely out of context. Cheers.


"I hold it that a little rebellion now and then is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical.".....Thomas Jefferson

"I have as much authority as the Pope - I just don't have as many people who believe it." ...George Carlin
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Svengali] #58233
10/09/04 11:10 AM
10/09/04 11:10 AM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 432
Hell; where else?
The_Sixth_Circle Offline
CoS Member
The_Sixth_Circle  Offline
CoS Member

Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 432
Hell; where else?
I agree with Svengali completely, finding it difficult to understand why people would find "talking" to other intelligent individuals in a coherent manner unimportant. Personally, I'm usually quite stringent with my use of the English language (rare for a Scot!) for I have too much respect for other posters to go on shamelessly abusing the language I enjoy speaking. In saying that, I think the odd typo or spelling/grammatical error here and there is forgiveable - constant continuance of same however, is not.

I often muse at those who say;

"I know lots of people who are very intelligent, but who are not great writers"

Oddly, I don't know any. I write down what goes through my head, thus it's a primary source of my intellect. I am not hampered by an inability to write, because I am not hampered by an inability to think. I think Dr LaVey himself said it best;

"Many people who fall back on phrases like "more than words can say", "when words are not enough", or "beyond description", simply have limited vocabularies."

Plus, if someone knew their spelling and grammar is bad yet were intelligent, surely they would have sense enough to use a spellchecker.

Just my two pence.

Last edited by highland_devil; 10/09/04 04:44 PM.

Have You Met The Alien Elite? / The Sixth Circle @ Myspace

Truth, in matters of religion, is simply the opinion that has survived. - Sir Oscar Wilde
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Svengali] #58234
10/20/04 02:51 AM
10/20/04 02:51 AM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 41
Carl_Luce Offline
Carl_Luce  Offline

Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 41
More often than not, an audience faced with linguistic slop is enabled a more important part of practical understanding:

"The man talking to me is a careless fool."

Those failing to recognize the trumping importance of grammar and precision deserve nothing short of their unwelcoming reception.

In otherwords, don't greet a king with a high five. Your "meaning" may be lost in the process.

Some people just don't get it [Re: Svengali] #58235
10/30/04 08:53 PM
10/30/04 08:53 PM
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 851
115°49'00"W 37°14'00"N
Captn_Thatch Offline
CoS Member
Captn_Thatch  Offline
CoS Member

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 851
115°49'00"W 37°14'00"N
From a website covering the topic of logical argumentative essays.

"Example One":

Even though there may be a deceiver of some sort, very powerful and very tricky, who bends all his efforts to keep me perpetually deceived, there can be no slightest doubt that I exist, since he deceives me; and let him deceive me as much as he will, he can never make me be nothing as long as I think I am something. Thus, after having thought well on this matter, and after examining all things with care, I must finally conclude and maintain that this proposition: I am, I exist, is necessarily true every time that I pronounce it or conceive it in my mind. - Rene Descartes

Translation:

"I am a blithering idiot".

Happy Halloween.


Do what thy manhood bids thee do, from none but self expect applause; He noblest lives and noblest dies who makes and keeps his self-made laws. -Sir Richard Francis Burton
Re: THE BURDEN OF COMMUNICATION [Re: Plato] #58236
10/30/04 10:19 PM
10/30/04 10:19 PM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 495
Skyla Offline

CoS Member
Skyla  Offline

CoS Member

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 495
Quote:

But that's not an excuse for foreigners. Those who are not good at the second-language should improve it before they use it.(not only English)




I understand your point, but on the other hand I think the best way to improve language skills is by using it. I know my english isn't perfect and how can it be when it's not my mother tongue? That doesn't necessarly mean that I have nothing to say. I try hard to avoid mistakes by using my dictionary and I often let a friend proofread before I post, but that doesn't cover every little fault. I appreciate the patience I receive from my english speaking friends. If someone isn't willing to accept a few mistakes that can't be wipped out, he should simply ignore the person and be glad to obviously never make mistakes himself.


One life. Live it.
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