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#98229 - 05/07/05 08:38 AM Re: Questions [Re: patbateman]
Hagen von Tronje Offline

CoS Priest

Registered: 06/28/01
Posts: 10146
You're welcome to think whatever you like politically.

However, I ask you this: do you think you can do anything at all to alter the fact that the world is corrupt, brutal, and most people don't make the cut? If not, why lose sleep over it?

With any individual issue, I suggest applying the maxim "Responsibility to the responsible." Simple as that.

The way you phrase "rethink stratification" is perhaps ambiguous. How so? Do you merely like socialist politics, or do you think along egalatarian lines?

More importantly:

What do you disagree with? Just political issues, or something more? Dr. LaVey had his political ideas, but he did not ever make politics a part of Church policy.

Have you discerned between personal opinions and Church doctrines in Dr. LaVey's writing? If you severely disagree with Church doctrines, as opposed to opinions, you are perhaps looking in the wrong place.

Also, I would suggest that you not imply that Dr. LaVey "talks shit sometimes, no matter who they are." Regardless of how you mean it, that is a vulgar expression to use in reference to someone you proclaim to respect (we think). Try and have a bit more class.
_________________________
"The devil I'll bring you," answered Hagen. "I have enough to carry with my shield and breastplate; my helm is bright, the sword is in my hand, therefore I bring you naught."

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#98230 - 05/07/05 09:58 AM Re: Questions [Re: patbateman]
VKat Offline


Registered: 03/23/05
Posts: 158
Loc: Near Costa Mesa, California
Quote:

1. Irresponsible people who get sterilised (as Lavey says they whould in "Satan Speaks") may turn their lives around later and then we may miss out on great talent being born.




I have a real problem with this statement. Why? I have watched what my generation has done to their children. (Makes me want to beat them with a stick.)

For instance, I know this thing I went to high school with. She had a baby girl at 15. This baby girl got drug from party to party. She witnessed her mom having sex with people, and shooting drugs into her vein. I saw this little girl at four, she looked like she had been living in a garbage can. Mean while her moma thought that drugs where good birth control. I am sure she had several miscarriages, but one stuck. This baby boy was born addicted. Taken away from his mother at birth, she lost all rights even visitation. No one could do anything tell after the baby was born. I wished they could have stuck her in a box for the rest of her pregnancy.

Now tell me. Who are you trying to protect? The junky? You should be protecting the kids. What about the kids who are living in foster care, waiting to be adopted? Where are the parents for them? Now say this person, gets their life turned around. They can adopt!! Oh its not the same you say? To bad, its not the same for that child either. A person who really wants to be a parent won't let a little thing called blood stop them.

Not to mention, having ten kids decreases their quality of life with each child. Unless the parents are extra special, good luck on that. I myself am planning on getting fixed, I have two kids. If I still f0ill the need to parent after my kids are older, I will adopt. I've done my contribution to society as I like to put it.

Again I ask, who are you protecting? The junky? What about the kids? The junky had his/her chance.

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#98231 - 05/07/05 02:33 PM Re: Questions [Re: Cholinergic]
Fifi_la_Bonne Offline

Cos Priestess

Registered: 04/02/02
Posts: 682
Loc: Blighty
You may wish to consider getting a good accountant so that you can avoid paying unnecessary taxes when you are in a position to do so.

The lion need give nothing to the antelope.

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#98232 - 05/07/05 03:38 PM Re: Questions [Re: patbateman]
patbateman Offline


Registered: 05/07/05
Posts: 16
OK.
First of all thankyou all for the refresher. Posts from other Satanists is like getting the slap in the face you need to wake up.
When my statements got analysed, I got real opinions back. If I'd asked advice from any "normal" person, I would have been met with outright criticism and strong urging to turn back to the mentality of helping the stupid and carrying them thru life.
Now I do realise where I am going wrong.
-Talented people will generally pass on some traits to the kids. Even if they adopt, they will use their superior talent to raise a talented child, thereby enriching the gene pool.
-Fuckwits should not be given a second chance. If you are on crack and leave your kid in a dumpster then fucking die (and get sterilised with a big kick to the genitals). Fair enough.
-If people elect not to rebel against their shit government then they are in a bad situation of their own making. Then they shall perish if they elect to do nothing. So be it.
-And, yes the leapord seldom changes his spots. If you're an idiot now, you WILL be an idiot later.
-Yeah, I believe nobody is right all the time, but Dr LaVey obviously thought carefully about what he wrote before he wrote it, to make sure he was right. Sorry Dr LaVey (bows respectfully).

I feel clearer now, and even foolish. I sounded like a wide eyed child who had stumbled into a room filled with Satanists.

Daniel.

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#98233 - 05/07/05 11:53 PM Open to correction. [Re: patbateman]
Nemo Offline
CoS Magister

Registered: 10/06/02
Posts: 13184
Loc: Point Nemo s48:52:31:748, w123...
A missile is off course 99% of the time.

By accounting for new information from radar it constantly corrects its course to hit the target dead on!

You are demonstrating a rare and virtuous trait: a willingness to accept correction - just like a missile.

This is, in my opinion, the only way to successfully approach life.

I congratulate you on building your true ego instead of attempting to inflate a false one.

Good for you!

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#98234 - 05/08/05 12:04 PM Re: Answers. [Re: Nemo]
Discipline Offline
CoS Warlock

Registered: 08/25/03
Posts: 6796
Loc: Forever West
>>You have many popular views that will make you welcome amongst "caring" people.

Ah, may I add something, Magister?

Making people assume that you are a caring or even to make them feel comfortable around you is an important aspect of lesser magic. If people think of you as caring they are more willing to do your bidding and even open path ways for you.

I agree that Satanism is not about holding onto popular ideals for the sake of fitting in. I do feel that using those popular ideals to your advantage is. It is about self-benefit without self-deceit.

I just wanted to add that for those on-lookers. I know that you know this, Magister.

Cheers!


Edited by Discipline (05/08/05 12:19 PM)
_________________________
"I've learned . . . that life is like a roll of toilet paper. The closer it gets to the end, the faster it goes." ~Andy Rooney

"At last I shall have time to devote myself seriously and freely to the destruction of all my former opinions." ~Descartes

“The first principle is that you must not fool yourself—and you are the easiest person to fool.” ~Richard Feynman

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#98235 - 05/08/05 12:31 PM Thanks [Re: Nemo]
patbateman Offline


Registered: 05/07/05
Posts: 16
Thankyou to everyone who had re-evaluated their assesments of me after reading my follow-up post (tips hat). I appreciate compliments and brutal honesty equally.


Edited by patbateman (05/10/05 10:09 PM)

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#98237 - 05/08/05 01:04 PM Re: Questions [Re: patbateman]
IronCrafter Offline


Registered: 04/09/05
Posts: 733
Loc: A Harsh Reality ,Wa USA
Sometimes it's gratifying to have to admit being in error about another person.

This is another of those times for me..You have proven me incorrect in my initial assessment. Well done.

Hold onto that Baphomet. I have no doubt that you will be in need of it!

And Welcome to the board Pat!
_________________________
"Life is an objective-achieve it." "Be who you are and say what you feel,because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." Dr Suess My home page featuring my work can be found here. HS! Crafter

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#98238 - 05/08/05 03:35 PM Re: Questions [Re: patbateman]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3976
Loc: The Deep South
What about the people getting fucked over by corrupt governments?

There is an old saying that goes: People have the government they deserve. If a nation of indolent slobs let their politicians get too powerful and corrupt, then they have to suffer the consequences. Why should anyone else give them help to solve the problems they themselves got into?

In any case, when their corrupt government gets too out of hand, they will finally get the "help" their need in the form of a nice invasion. Then they will finally have the "freedom" they wanted... but since they didn’t fight for it themselves, it will come at the cost of their oil, or whatever other natural resource they got. I think it’s just fair!
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You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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#98239 - 05/09/05 08:41 AM Re: Questions [Re: Old_Pig]
oggi Offline


Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 107
Loc: Finland
People have the government they deserve
Untrue. If in majority dictatorship country(ex. USA, UK) have most of its people voting for NSDAP(Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei) becouse it gives people food, and say things what people want to hear, and becouse there is no time to read what they will do when they rule country(becouse economic depression). And when they NSDAP have Führer, then there is nothing people could do. And everyone suffer, not only those who voted for NSDAP, but also those who were against Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei.

Of course, there is no innocents, expect those, who knew, what was going to happen, those who read mein kampf(of course we could say that they should have left everything they had and go onto streets to tell the truth, but that kind act need courange, and I can't find that kind courange from myself(becouse if you say against them, you could find yourself dead in morning), and becouse of that, I say that they weren't truly guilty to that faith), but only few had that change. And becouse majority wished, becouse of their stupidity, everyone in country suffer.

In majority dictatorship country(unlike the Nordic countries) small ones are allways thrown into obvilion, if it comes into deciding things. That means, that even if you are intelligent enough to have political opinnion, only way to make it to be heard in voiting, is to support(voting, giving money, telling people to vote that ideology...) one who you hate you less(or one who you think is close enough to right direction). But what if you see that there is only two possibility, and both of them are as bad. Do you thind that you deseserve to live in country whit ideologi of kommunism, or nazism.

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#98240 - 05/09/05 05:16 PM Re: Questions [Re: oggi]
Old_Pig Offline


Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3976
Loc: The Deep South
Do you thind that you deseserve to live in country whit ideologi of kommunism, or nazism.

No, I don't. But I was talking about people, not about me.

I still think people (as in the population of a country) get the government they deserve. As you said, herd conformity make they vote for parties that latter will enslave them. Let them eat cake!
_________________________
You can have peace. Or you can have freedom. Don't ever count on having both at once.
Robert A. Heinlein


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#98241 - 05/09/05 05:37 PM Re: Questions [Re: patbateman]
Mr_Atrox Offline
CoS Member

Registered: 09/16/03
Posts: 1845
Loc: Lycopolis
You said:
Quote:

I don't think the eugenics thing would ever work simply because of one simple fact: Talented people are not guaranteed to have talented kids.




And follow with:
Quote:

1. Irresponsible people who get sterilised (as Lavey says they whould in "Satan Speaks") may turn their lives around later and then we may miss out on great talent being born.




If talented children aren't guaranteed to talented parents, then how much lower does the percentage drop if the parents in question are of the turn-their-lives around variety?

Hmmm.
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WEREWOLVES

BLOOD & HONOR

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#98242 - 05/09/05 11:09 PM Re: Questions [Re: oggi]
hickeyarmy Offline


Registered: 09/04/04
Posts: 93
Loc: US
Yes, I must insist on the correctness of the idea that people get the government they deserve. These governments do not descend upon the people from outer space. All governments in power have come to be such by the decisions directly or indectly made by the masses. They made the choices of leadership, or failed to keep leadership that was against their interests from taking power. Once in power, these governments serve their own agendas, unless kept from doing so by the masses. Where is the suprise or shock in that?
Self-emancipation is the only true emancipation. I will only respect the self-emancipated, for they have acted for their own interests and succeeded. Those who are enslaved and "oppressed" deserve no pity whatsoever. Victory is the only basis of right in this world, not moral postures and pipedreams.
The same truth holds for every human grouping that has organized itself. Whether a business concern or an ethnicity, it has only itself to blame for its successes and failures.
_________________________
The flesh is my kingdom, my playground, my paradise, and my wealth. May the flesh prevail forever!

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#98243 - 05/10/05 02:22 PM Re: Questions [Re: Old_Pig]
oggi Offline


Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 107
Loc: Finland
Quote:

Do you thind that you deseserve to live in country whit ideologi of kommunism, or nazism.

No, I don't. But I was talking about people, not about me.
I still think people (as in the population of a country) get the government they deserve. As you said, herd conformity make they vote for parties that latter will enslave them. Let them eat cake!


problem is, that 90%(optimistic estimate) humans are fools, and I really don't care if they destroy themselves(of course expect people I like), but I don't wan't to go down whit them.

But there is some good points in that soothsaying, I think that Bush and USA deserves each other.
_________________________
"You fool, you wanderer You challenged the gods and lost" -nightwish

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